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#214266
Todt has issued a statement of clarification, saying essentially that there was no "smoking gun," no res ipsa loquitur evidence against Ferrari. :bs:

This is the reesult as of this afternoon of a fan poll at crash.net:

Image

And Ferrari, never one to let the sleeping dog lie, is claiming they only intended to motivate Massa to drive harder, and Massa slowed in a fit of pique because Smedley rubbed his nose in the fact that Alonso was faster.

The good news is that the FIA probably will amend if not altogether scrap the team orders rule as a result.
#214267
Ahh pity, I didnt get to vote...

And Ferrari, never one to let the sleeping dog lie, is claiming they only intended to motivate Massa to drive harder, and Massa slowed in a fit of pique because Smedley rubbed his nose in the fact that Alonso was faster.


LOL :bs:
But that's what you get with a BS rule.

The good news is that the FIA probably will amend if not altogether scrap the team orders rule as a result.


:yes:
Make a rule that makes sense. Or teams will continue to make a mockery out of the sport. Simple.
#214270
When the speed limit was 55 and I cruised at 75 and got speeding tickets, I thought the rule made a mockery of highway driving so I made a mockery of the law. Now the speed limit is 65 and I still cruise at 75, yet I never get a speeding ticket.

I feel that in my own little way I did what Ferrari is doing to the FIA and the sport on this, you can only change the rules by blatantly thumbing your nose at it. :D

I just didn't have the same deep pockets to pay $100k fines but hey me and Ferrari... I feel a kindred now.
#214277
When the speed limit was 55 and I cruised at 75 and got speeding tickets, I thought the rule made a mockery of highway driving so I made a mockery of the law. Now the speed limit is 65 and I still cruise at 75, yet I never get a speeding ticket.

I feel that in my own little way I did what Ferrari is doing to the FIA and the sport on this, you can only change the rules by blatantly thumbing your nose at it. :D

I just didn't have the same deep pockets to pay $100k fines but hey me and Ferrari... I feel a kindred now.

Birds of a feather ...definitely.

:director: Now go and change your avatar. :wink:
#214281
More BS and trying to pull the wool over people's eyes by Ferrari then. Whats now to stop Ferrari breaking another rule with the thought that the rules will be changed to accomodate the rule break? This lack of backbone by the FIA is annoying in that in the past a rule hasnt been broken but because it was deemed someone had an unfair advantage the person was penalised and a rule introduced. As what happened to Hamilton at Spa 2 years ago.
So now they have gone the other way, a rule was in place, broken by a team in a blatantly obvious manner, got a small fine and the rule changed in their favour. There will be those that say all teams have orders, but they arent carried out so blatantly with one driver deliberately slowing down to let his teammate take the lead. I expect the most annoyed people will be those at Red Bull who have allowed their drivers to race and ended up with one taking out the other. Yet again feel like giving up on F1, if it wasnt for the likes of Hamilton in the sport I think I would call it a day.
#214285
More BS and trying to pull the wool over people's eyes by Ferrari then. Whats now to stop Ferrari breaking another rule with the thought that the rules will be changed to accomodate the rule break? This lack of backbone by the FIA is annoying in that in the past a rule hasnt been broken but because it was deemed someone had an unfair advantage the person was penalised and a rule introduced. As what happened to Hamilton at Spa 2 years ago.
So now they have gone the other way, a rule was in place, broken by a team in a blatantly obvious manner, got a small fine and the rule changed in their favour. There will be those that say all teams have orders, but they arent carried out so blatantly with one driver deliberately slowing down to let his teammate take the lead. I expect the most annoyed people will be those at Red Bull who have allowed their drivers to race and ended up with one taking out the other. Yet again feel like giving up on F1, if it wasnt for the likes of Hamilton in the sport I think I would call it a day.


Pretty much my views. The FIA change and manipulate things to their own ends. I thought things had improved, obviously not.
#214286
More BS and trying to pull the wool over people's eyes by Ferrari then. Whats now to stop Ferrari breaking another rule with the thought that the rules will be changed to accomodate the rule break? This lack of backbone by the FIA is annoying in that in the past a rule hasnt been broken but because it was deemed someone had an unfair advantage the person was penalised and a rule introduced. As what happened to Hamilton at Spa 2 years ago.
So now they have gone the other way, a rule was in place, broken by a team in a blatantly obvious manner, got a small fine and the rule changed in their favour. There will be those that say all teams have orders, but they arent carried out so blatantly with one driver deliberately slowing down to let his teammate take the lead. I expect the most annoyed people will be those at Red Bull who have allowed their drivers to race and ended up with one taking out the other. Yet again feel like giving up on F1, if it wasnt for the likes of Hamilton in the sport I think I would call it a day.


:rofl:

That cheered me up no end, of course, controversy fighter all round good guy Hamilton to save the day!

As for the thread, read: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson ... right.html

And Mark Webber says this:

"When you go through it deeply, it's not easy to make a strong stance on this. It wasn't an easy one for Ferrari because Felipe did not have that many points but maybe it was a bit early in the championship.

"If in the future the team has to make a decision like Ferrari have then it's up to them," said the Australian driver.

"McLaren will do the same in the future, let me guarantee you that, if they need to. Ferrrari did that because Felipe had a tough start to the season and Fernando had some momentum behind him.

"If team orders are allowed, I don't think a huge amount changes. The teams will go to each venue with the same cars prepared and do everything they can to win the constructors' championships.

"If they see at any point in the championship you might want to swap positions, then that might happen.

"If you're in a position where you have to do that yourself, it's not ideal, but if you don't like it, go somewhere else. It's not ideal, but that's how it's been for the last 60 years in F1."


Accept team orders (for the championship at least) are a part of f1, and everyones happy. I agree with the idiocy surrounding the trial and 100grand fine, but the fundamental problem with that was a rule which was almost impossible to enforce and a team which (accidentally) pushed that almost impossible to enforce to the limits.

Tell me you only have a problem becuase it was so obvious, and I'll tell you your a hypocrite.

Talking about other rules is also not relevant, the problem is how difficult this rule is to enforce.
Last edited by vaptin on 09 Sep 10, 19:01, edited 1 time in total.
#214290
Come on, how can people be surprised and outraged by this outcome given the situation, evidence and letter of the law? Seriously, i want to know. :scratchchin:
#214297
In the latest press release it is clear that they found Ferrari guilty but chose to do nothing about it. It's also clear why Massa was slower. (they told them both to turn their engines down then told Alonso to turn his up). This in response to Alonso's whining. The reply to him was "we're onto it."
If Ferrari weren't guilty why did they not appeal the initial fine? By not doing so they accepted guilt, so why now change the story?
This is the full report with the information in it.
http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pr ... cision.pdf

If you cant be bothered to read it all look a the section 'decision'. Sorry but im not sure how to paste when I copy the relevant bits.
#214306
I guess the rule will be changed back to (team orders are OK) until the next time a team like say McLaren let one of their drivers through on the last lap of the last race to clinch the WDC from Ferrari. Then it will be deemed outrageous and the rule re-instated. I've been around too long. Big bad team red always get their way. If they don't they threaten to leave. Well I say GO. Play at NASCAR for a few years. We'll not miss you. Honest! :wavey:
#214308
I guess the rule will be changed back to (team orders are OK) until the next time a team like say McLaren let one of their drivers through on the last lap of the last race to clinch the WDC from Ferrari. Then it will be deemed outrageous and the rule re-instated. I've been around too long. Big bad team red always get their way. If they don't they threaten to leave. Well I say GO. Play at NASCAR for a few years. We'll not miss you. Honest! :wavey:


I doubt it, McLaren would only be able to pull that one off if one of their driver was mathematically out of the WDC, and in that situation no one seems to mind.
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