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[billindenver]

You wanted an answer to your question, so here it is. I can kind of understand where you're coming from and you've clearly thought it through; but equally clear is that you don't know the full technical ins and outs of F1 tyres.

Dry Tyres in F1 have an optimum temperature, and in order to maintain that temperature and retain grip, the cars have to maintain a certain average speed on both the straight and turn-ins to corners. Once the tyre temparature goes, the tyre pressure follows, and the grip then worsens yet further. There is NO way around this or to heat the tyres again except for going faster, and even then it usually takes approximately a km flat out to get the tyres fully up to racing temperature. Without the ability to do that, the grip gets worse and worse, first progressively and then dramatically.

You've displayed yourself Glock's times, and they are a straightforward indication of this. with two laps to go, he couldn't maintain his speed as the track was wet. Even if it was drying, his tyres by the last lap were cool and low on pressure, unless the track was bone dry he could pick the pace up and so he lost more grip and so on...

The truth is that he demonstrated amazing skill in even keeping it on the road.

those are facts by the way, not rumours in the same way the 'did he let Hamilton through' conspiracy mongers have been spouting out.
so that is the answer to your question.

There it is in a nutshell. The track I was watching was not drying, certainly not enough to bring dry tires back into play. Glock took a chance that the lead he had was enough to make up for the tires....it would have been wonderful if he was correct. But, he was not. After the way Hamilton pushed the field around this year, often endangering some...there is no way Glock would roll over for him. Anyone who believes he would must have a screw loose. Fact is most of the drivers out there have complained at some point this season about Hamiltons tactics, but the further fact is that this year.....they worked. You can't argue it, McLaren won....and I say, good on them. I don't like them, wasn't cheering for them, was overjoyed when it looked like Glock would hold on.....but now I find I must congratulate them. Well done McLaren, enjoy your title. Tough luck Massa, but well done on the interview afterwards. Your team cost you this one....maybe they can make it up to you someday. I disliked Massa after last season's complaining all the time nearly as much as Hamilton this year....but this year Massa has shown a different side, more mature and more composed and while I don't necessarily wish him to win, I no longer wish him to crash. Maybe next year will be the year Hamilton grows up too. It could happen. We will see next year. In the meantime, enjoy the title....

[csrracer]

Well put Bill, Cheers.

[bud]

another thing to take into account is why would Toyota make Glock stay out on the drys if they didnt want to finish ahead of Hamilton?
think about it, If they pitted then they would not have affected Lewis at all, they would have kept the pre rain "status quo"by staying out they took a chance of finishing as high up as possible in doing so knowingly racing Lewis & Vettel!

[stonemonkey]

Dry track near the start of the race but the tail lights were still on.


Final lap, the reflections of the tail light show the track was wet.

[Denthúl]

:D

I have to say, though, credit to Massa for even thinking about Glock after what he happened. He handled everything very well.

I do think his has been the most gracious second place in the championship since Mika in 2000.

He's definitely a guy with a big heart, is Felipe, and on Sunday he proved that he has exactly what Alonso is missing.

[dant]

TruthTellerF1.

You say your a McLaren fan, yet your doubting this move with Glock and saying it sucks, is wrong or fixed or whatever, but you have failed to reply on more than one occasion about the point i brought up.

Kimi let Massa through in China, why, as a McLaren fan afterall are you not in absoloute uproar about this, as this would have been the deciding factor in the WDC had Glock managed to keep control of his car, or as youd put it, not let Hamilton through.

I think you have your priorities totally mixed up, and i for one dont beleive for one minute that your a McLaren fan, i think your just saying that so that people will take notice more of your opinion.

[Gaz]

I've seen the fish tacos comment already.... nice... bordering on racist... lol

rain starts to ease
Lap 69:1:18.688

Almost dry on parts of the track
Lap 70: 1:28.041
Lap 71:1:44.731

It simply doesn't add up.

Look at this you can clearly see who has slicks on even the lap times with inters go down look at trulli are you saying that he slowed down too to keep the ruse

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-content/u ... llaps2.pdf

if it was posible to achive decent laptimes in damp conditions with slicks there would be no need for inters would there?

but its that much a of a problem


FROM F1 FANATIC.CO.UK:As the track began to dampen from laps 65-69 Glock’s lap times jumped into the high 1’18s while Trulli lapped in the 1’20s. Clearly Glock was able to cope with the wet conditions better at first (although, as he was further ahead of Trulli, his laps would have been set on a slightly drier track).

The penultimate lap, number 70, appears to be the point at which the combination of an increasingly wet surface and decreasingly warm tyres tipped the Toyotas into trouble. Glock’s lap time rocketed to 1′28 and Trulli was five seconds slower.

With dry weather tyres that were now not only very low on temperature but also heavily worn, the pair tiptoed around the final lap in 1′44. The fact that this produced a thrilling run to the chequered flag for the title contenders was, in a sense, a side-show for Glock. For him, the gamble of staying out on dry tyres paid off:


Full Analysis here:http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/11/04/2008-brazilian-grand-prix-analysis/


Look at this video:http://www.dailymotion.com/video/k6cqY0u8hlyx4MPiE0

you can see even Lewis is having trouble keeping the car straight why would he do that and risk crashing? to create a ruse?

LOL your a fool if you believe that they would do so many things to make it look like glock slowed down at the facts and shut the hell up

[headless]

It was absolutly hammering it down after the race when the pundits wree jibbering on.

I laughed watching the camera man wipe the lens all the time

[Gaz]

TruthTellerF1.

You say your a McLaren fan, yet your doubting this move with Glock and saying it sucks, is wrong or fixed or whatever, but you have failed to reply on more than one occasion about the point i brought up.

Kimi let Massa through in China, why, as a McLaren fan afterall are you not in absoloute uproar about this, as this would have been the deciding factor in the WDC had Glock managed to keep control of his car, or as youd put it, not let Hamilton through.

I think you have your priorities totally mixed up, and i for one dont beleive for one minute that your a McLaren fan, i think your just saying that so that people will take notice more of your opinion.

I mentioned that before and he said nothing about its because he's a Ferrari fan and a utter utter utter tool and hes so shocked by the fact a silver car and a Mclaren driver could of won the WDC without using team orders like ferrari blatantly did last year and in china that he will ignore any FACTS you put in front of him.

Your a idiot of the highest degree TruthTeller and there is no point in you posting here because its utter utter bullsh*te

[McLaren Fan]

still going on about this? sour grapes

Come on Bud, if Hamilton had finished 6th and Massa had won the title on race victories, all the McLaren fans on here would be talking about Spa and you'd be one of them...

Different thing completely. One is being screwed over by corrupt officials. The other is overtaking a car on the wrong tyres.

Correct.

Your team cost you this one....maybe they can make it up to you someday.

Huh? Ferrari could to all of the mistakes Massa made this season. Formula One is a team sport. You win and lose together as a team.

[headless]

TruthTellerF1.

You say your a McLaren fan, yet your doubting this move with Glock and saying it sucks, is wrong or fixed or whatever, but you have failed to reply on more than one occasion about the point i brought up.

Kimi let Massa through in China, why, as a McLaren fan afterall are you not in absoloute uproar about this, as this would have been the deciding factor in the WDC had Glock managed to keep control of his car, or as youd put it, not let Hamilton through.

I think you have your priorities totally mixed up, and i for one dont beleive for one minute that your a McLaren fan, i think your just saying that so that people will take notice more of your opinion.

I mentioned that before and he said nothing about its because he's a Ferrari fan and a utter utter utter tool and hes so shocked by the fact a silver car and a Mclaren driver could of won the WDC without using team orders like ferrari blatantly did last year and in china that he will ignore any FACTS you put in front of him.

Your a idiot of the highest degree TruthTeller and there is no point in you posting here because its utter utter bullsh*te

Troll

[McLaren Fan]

I've seen the fish tacos comment already.... nice... bordering on racist... lol

Now I know you are clutching at straws as you have posted that video... who's payroll are you on, FIA.. McLaren?? lol

Just look at the photo, get your Sky+ box out:



(1) It is not wet
(2) It is not raining
(3) Glock is not struggling

On lap 63 it starts to rain, on lap 62, reports on 5 Live state that the rain is starting to fall. Renault reports "drops of rain, drops of rain"
Lap 66:1:17.992
Lap 67:1:18.897
Lap 68: 1:18.816

rain starts to ease
Lap 69:1:18.688

Almost dry on parts of the track
Lap 70: 1:28.041
Lap 71:1:44.731

In Parc Ferme it starts to chuck it down we see it live in front of our eyes as the heavens open

I'll say it again..... so it wasnt hard for Glock to drive and keep control when it was raining hard during laps 63-68 but then during laps 70 & 71 when the rain was non-existent and the track was dry enough not be a problem for dry tyres, then Glock cant keep control? What a nonsense.

It simply doesn't add up.

You have no understanding of how a Formula One car works.

[headless]

To be fair, but i am not trying to prove a point, it doenst look like it is wet at all there. in that pic.

I dont think Glock got out of the way though.

[scousers on tour 2008]

Put to one side the splits and the lap times, especially on the dry tyres. We have absolutely no idea about how the final laps compared for the two Toyotas, there are too many variables: traffic, skids, slips, mistakes and so on.

One thing is for certain that if the pit lane called to Glock to ease up, then with all the telemetry and the splits in front of them, they would have seen how it appeared.

What we did witness is the following:

* Glock was well ahead
* The track was drying - there was no more rain
* The end sector was not as wet
* Glock was not only ahead but along with Vettel... WELL AHEAD
* Hamilton was unable to catch Glock or Vettel
* Hamilton himself was suffering from a lack of grip as the car was not set up well on the intermediates
* We saw Hamilton struggling to even keep up with Glock and Vettel
* Glock was some 15 - 18 seconds ahead of Hamilton with 3 turns to go
* We clearly see Glock ease up and PULL WIDE

Other than this is the common sense factor.

Those watching the coverage witnessed Martin Brundel confirming that the Championship was slipping out of Hamilton’s hands. Glock was 15 seconds ahead and all he had to do was “tip-toe” around the last few turns. We saw Hamilton unable to catch him.

Everyone from Martin Brundel to Damon Hill saw what happened on the last bend. No one wants to say it. The media is using the word "dramatic" for "controversial"... considering the usual behaviour of the stewards i.e. Everything is looked into even if to clear the drivers, is it not unusual that this is not even being investigated by the stewards?

Where is the debate on the TV / News / Media? It conspicuous due to its absence.

Your a muppet mate and have not got a clue have you ever watched a race ever in your life.
I bet before you watched the race ( if you even watched it) you were watching the 20 20 cricket

[scousers on tour 2008]

I've seen the fish tacos comment already.... nice... bordering on racist... lol

Now I know you are clutching at straws as you have posted that video... who's payroll are you on, FIA.. McLaren?? lol

Just look at the photo, get your Sky+ box out:



(1) It is not wet
(2) It is not raining
(3) Glock is not struggling

On lap 63 it starts to rain, on lap 62, reports on 5 Live state that the rain is starting to fall. Renault reports "drops of rain, drops of rain"
Lap 66:1:17.992
Lap 67:1:18.897
Lap 68: 1:18.816

rain starts to ease
Lap 69:1:18.688

Almost dry on parts of the track
Lap 70: 1:28.041
Lap 71:1:44.731

In Parc Ferme it starts to chuck it down we see it live in front of our eyes as the heavens open

I'll say it again..... so it wasnt hard for Glock to drive and keep control when it was raining hard during laps 63-68 but then during laps 70 & 71 when the rain was non-existent and the track was dry enough not be a problem for dry tyres, then Glock cant keep control? What a nonsense.

It simply doesn't add up.

You have no understanding of how a Formula One car works.

just put the race on again and guess what its pissing down on the second half of the last lap.
whatch it again and on the corner after lewis passes him and vettel he gets passed again (maybe by someone who is lapped)
and he losses it on the last bend.
you should get a hd tv you can see the rain spots