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[What's Burning?]

Please, allow me to savor the delightful experience unfolding before me, before we see what winter testing has in store for us. It's funny how no one wanted the EBD changed mid season, it's hilarious how there was an uproar when the engine mappings were changed mid season for one race. The mid season tire change last year? Remember the backlash at that? But this year, it's imperative that we allow mis season upgrades. it's killing competition, the sport is eroding.

Let me tell you, I can think of a dozen things that are very wrong in the sport before we even get to the subject of the engine development freeze.

Mercedes Benz 2014 WCC. That sounds so nice. In the sport just 4 seasons and they've achieved what the stalwart titans haven't been able to achieve in twice that time. I hope Honda come in with just as good a power plant as Mercedes next year as we'd see the struggling whiners fall behind yet another newcomer.

The sweet, sweet taste of victory, Mercedes Benz 2014 WCC, could be made sweeter still with another WDC for the guy you love to hate.

[The Second Coming]

Please, allow me to savor the delightful experience unfolding before me, before we see what winter testing has in store for us. It's funny how no one wanted the EBD changed mid season, it's hilarious how there was an uproar when the engine mappings were changed mid season for one race. The mid season tire change last year? Remember the backlash at that? But this year, it's imperative that we allow mis season upgrades. it's killing competition, the sport is eroding.

Let me tell you, I can think of a dozen things that are very wrong in the sport before we even get to the subject of the engine development freeze.

Mercedes Benz 2014 WCC. That sounds so nice. In the sport just 4 seasons and they've achieved what the stalwart titans haven't been able to achieve in twice that time. I hope Honda come in with just as good a power plant as Mercedes next year as we'd see the struggling whiners fall behind yet another newcomer.

The sweet, sweet taste of victory, Mercedes Benz 2014 WCC, could be made sweeter still with another WDC for the guy you love to hate.

WB, regarding the engine freeze, set aside for a moment the notion that one team/engine manufacturer was clever and got it very right, leading to the rest being left feeling like rules are written to be conveniently broken because they got it very wrong. The one thing that is noticeably absent from this ongoing conversation is, be careful what you ask for. If Mercedes capitulate and the freeze is lifted, I think the opposition is forgetting that while they try to juice their power units to be closer or on par with the current Mercedes unit, Mercedes too will have and take advantage of putting their unit on a new level of steroids. By the time all is said and done, the performance gap could actually be far greater than it is now. Be careful what you ask for!

Such fun!

[sagi58]

There is only one way to find out, isn't there?

[racechick]

Mercedes is now set to veto in season upgrading of the engines

No. Surely not! Mercedes are going to use a veto? Well that's just not cricket chaps!

[Jabberwocky]

To be fair. Why would Mercedes want to allow people the chance to catch up.

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[sagi58]

To be fair. Why would Mercedes want to allow people the chance to catch up.

They wouldn't. But, then, let's not put Red Bull down for their years of domination.
Just wondering, did they vote down in-season development, of any sort?

I'm sure someone here has the answer to that one!!

[CookinFlat6]

Who is stronger mentally roth?

It's not that simple.

It never is, is it with the likes of yourself, unless its Lewis in question, then its straightforward

Lewis makes a few mistakes - he has a mental weakness, Nico has mentally beaten him, Nico is much stronger intellectually

Nico makes several mistakes - blahblahblahpsychobabablahblahrelativeblahblahinstinctblahblahbehindclosedblahdoorsblahblah

you are at least consistent with the inconsistency

[CookinFlat6]

To be fair. Why would Mercedes want to allow people the chance to catch up.

They wouldn't. But, then, let's not put Red Bull down for their years of domination.
Just wondering, did they vote down in-season development, of any sort?

I'm sure someone here has the answer to that one!!

Why not just do some simple research yourself so that you can actually come up with meaningful statements???????

It has been explained to you several times by different people that there is no bar to in season development, only to engine developemnt - and the engines were similarily frozen of ALL dvelopment not just in season for the best part of the previous decade. And why an engine freeze?? costs - ALL the manfacturers agreed to freeze engine devlopment to cut the astronomical costs involved in all out war. The isue we have now is allowing the other engines to get to parity with the best one - just like in the previous era.
Everyone agreed that the mechanism for this would be wha it is now incremental end of year development of the engine i.e change up to 60% during the winter break
People are now whining because they realise that Merc are so much better prepared and organised and plain smarter that the only chance any of the lame ducks have is another all out spending war. No one wants this - so Renault and Ferrari are just hoping a compromise is reached to allow them not to catch up with Merc - thats impossible cos Mer will keep developing - BUT to stop HONDA coming in at the end of the year and embarassing ferrari further

dont worry I am sure someone will explain it to you several more times

[spankyham]

To be fair. Why would Mercedes want to allow people the chance to catch up.

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Everyone agreed to these rules, Mercedes is under no obligation to make it easier for the rest. My team has a lot of change to digest - they could do with the extra year. Having said that, all the teams should go flat out to catch up under the rules we have.

[What's Burning?]

Accept it and move on cookin', the mentally weaker guy seems to find a way to win. I can live with that. I think we can all live with that.

[spankyham]

... the engines were similarily frozen of ALL dvelopment not just in season for the best part of the previous decade.

The last engine change started in 2006 and was essentially the V8's used until last year. The first year of that engines use there was free and unfettered engine changes allowed throughout the whole season.
In the years that followed, the FiA allowed what they called engine "re-equalisations".

The engines were certainly not "frozen from ALL development" for the last decade

[What's Burning?]

Team will have the opportunity to change up to 50% of all engine components with next year's engines. You'd think given that, everyone should come to parity given the fact that they know exactly where they went wrong with this year's engine. Honda on the other hand has no yardstick. They will be frozen next year with the engine they bring.


Make the best engine you can at the beginning of the year because you won't be able to change it until the following year is a pretty easy, and pretty economical rule. Some teams have to pay for their engines you know.

[CookinFlat6]

... the engines were similarily frozen of ALL dvelopment not just in season for the best part of the previous decade.

The last engine change started in 2006 and was essentially the V8's used until last year. The first year of that engines use there was free and unfettered engine changes allowed throughout the whole season.
In the years that followed, the FiA allowed what they called engine "re-equalisations".

The engines were certainly not "frozen from ALL development" for the last decade

when did the best part (more than half) of a decade become 'for the last' decade

and did you forget to read the part I described the mechanism of equalisation for the current era therefore setting the context for anyone with a brain that a similar process must have occured in the previous era if they were frozen for the best part of the decade?

reequalisation is frozen after equalisation with only relaiblity updates - its was Renault so far behind that caused the reequalisation to drag on

I think the mea culpas are on you - why do you even bother

[darwin dali]

Team will have the opportunity to change up to 50% of all engine components with next year's engines. You'd think given that, everyone should come to parity given the fact that they know exactly where they went wrong with this year's engine. Honda on the other hand has no yardstick. They will be frozen next year with the engine they bring.


Make the best engine you can at the beginning of the year because you won't be able to change it until the following year is a pretty easy, and pretty economical rule. Some teams have to pay for their engines you know.

Honda has McLaren's Mercedes as yardstick.

[What's Burning?]

Team will have the opportunity to change up to 50% of all engine components with next year's engines. You'd think given that, everyone should come to parity given the fact that they know exactly where they went wrong with this year's engine. Honda on the other hand has no yardstick. They will be frozen next year with the engine they bring.


Make the best engine you can at the beginning of the year because you won't be able to change it until the following year is a pretty easy, and pretty economical rule. Some teams have to pay for their engines you know.

Honda has McLaren's Mercedes as yardstick.

They've likely had a bodyguard on those engines the entire year. They know what it does, have pictures and metrics and likely will have a solid understanding of it but nothing more. They've probably not even seen that engine on the inside. Mercedes could have opted to not provide their engine to McLaren this year if they wanted to. McLaren would have been using a Renault Engine for a year if that's what Mercedes chose. I'm sure Mercedes got contractual assurances from IP infringements on their engine from McHonda.