FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[racechick]

As a Ferrari tifosa I would prefer Vettel over all those drivers. Then after that Alonso, Kubica, Massa and KImi. I wouldn't want Lewis Hamilton at Ferrari.

By the way, Ferrari screwed up the first 3 races of 2003. Then in the 4th race at San Marino Imola eventually Michael Schumacher just beats McLaren's Kimi Raikkonen. SO after a very bad start, Ferrari still won both drivers and constructors championships in 2003. Looked like Ferrari were in turmoil then as well but turned it around. They will do it again in 2009, or at least be competitive and then win titles again in 2010. Also note that in 2005 Ferrari also had a miserable season. Then they turned it around in 2006 and almost won both titles but ended up winning everything in 2007. All great teams have their ups and downs. All great teams succeed in the end. Ferrari is the type of team so they will succeed. Fact.

Let's face it there though. Raikkonen and Massa are no way near the class of Schumacher.

Very true. Having said that, though, on a good day Raikkonen was the faster man. Schumacher was smarter and more consistent, and not exactly slow, mind you.

When Raikkonen could be bothered of course lol.

If Ferrari promised to buy him the Magnum factory, think what he'd achieve.

I still maintain that Raikkonen is the fastest of the current F1 drivers.

Schumacher didn't cheat in 03

I didnt mention '03

But that is what my post was in referent to.

Once a cheat always a cheat. Isnt that how it goes??

Why was it necessary to bring cheating in to this in the first place?

Its the typical argument. Lewis and his fans are backed into the corner so they'll play either the Schumacher or Alonso card.

Why was it neccessary to bring in cheating?
I think it started when Ewman said this

"No wonder such a low approval rate for Hamilton. They certainly know a cheat when they see one! "

I just pointed out that the guy he went on to praise was a past master at it.

Cheat or not, it's impossible to deny Michael Schumacher's class. The cheating argument is irrelevant to the comment made.

Suddennly its "cheat or not it's impossible to deny class"???I see. So the label cheating may only be applied to a one time world champion?? A McLaren driver? A guy whose father manages him? A guy you dislike? If you cheat on multiple occassions but win 7 world championships then its ok??

Erm. What?

I did not deny the fact that he cheated, I merely stated that regardless of whether or not he was a cheater, he was still a great driver. Stop just assuming everyone is so anti-Lewis. Read and think about what people post.

I did . I read this.
"No wonder such a low approval rate for Hamilton. They certainly know a cheat when they see one! "

[EwanM]

Schumacher > Hamilton. IT is as simple as that.

Senna > Schumacher.

Never did senna do anything which was abit dodgy without a reason.

Schumacher just cheated again and again and again to win.

Lewis either lied or was convinced to lie to win but his on track antiques have been pretty honest racing.

OH FOR GOD SAKE, THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH AYRTON SENNA!

[SAS88]

As a Ferrari tifosa I would prefer Vettel over all those drivers. Then after that Alonso, Kubica, Massa and KImi. I wouldn't want Lewis Hamilton at Ferrari.

By the way, Ferrari screwed up the first 3 races of 2003. Then in the 4th race at San Marino Imola eventually Michael Schumacher just beats McLaren's Kimi Raikkonen. SO after a very bad start, Ferrari still won both drivers and constructors championships in 2003. Looked like Ferrari were in turmoil then as well but turned it around. They will do it again in 2009, or at least be competitive and then win titles again in 2010. Also note that in 2005 Ferrari also had a miserable season. Then they turned it around in 2006 and almost won both titles but ended up winning everything in 2007. All great teams have their ups and downs. All great teams succeed in the end. Ferrari is the type of team so they will succeed. Fact.

Let's face it there though. Raikkonen and Massa are no way near the class of Schumacher.

Very true. Having said that, though, on a good day Raikkonen was the faster man. Schumacher was smarter and more consistent, and not exactly slow, mind you.

When Raikkonen could be bothered of course lol.

If Ferrari promised to buy him the Magnum factory, think what he'd achieve.

I still maintain that Raikkonen is the fastest of the current F1 drivers.

Schumacher didn't cheat in 03

I didnt mention '03

But that is what my post was in referent to.

Once a cheat always a cheat. Isnt that how it goes??

Why was it necessary to bring cheating in to this in the first place?

Its the typical argument. Lewis and his fans are backed into the corner so they'll play either the Schumacher or Alonso card.

Why was it neccessary to bring in cheating?
I think it started when Ewman said this

"No wonder such a low approval rate for Hamilton. They certainly know a cheat when they see one! "

I just pointed out that the guy he went on to praise was a past master at it.

Cheat or not, it's impossible to deny Michael Schumacher's class. The cheating argument is irrelevant to the comment made.

Suddennly its "cheat or not it's impossible to deny class"???I see. So the label cheating may only be applied to a one time world champion?? A McLaren driver? A guy whose father manages him? A guy you dislike? If you cheat on multiple occassions but win 7 world championships then its ok??

Which "cheating" incidents are you exactly referring to? Many people call some things Schumacher did as cheating whilst they may have been controversial and others don't always agree with it.

Michael Schumacher outclasses Hamilton, so there is no point making these lowly comparisons. Try another driver.

[SAS88]

Schumacher > Hamilton. IT is as simple as that.

Senna > Schumacher.

Leaving aside your subsequent rant, how did you come to this conclusion?

Might as well start your own governing body and declare your officiated statements backed up with plenty of evidence, make sure to bring along irrelevant points too.

[Denthúl]

As a Ferrari tifosa I would prefer Vettel over all those drivers. Then after that Alonso, Kubica, Massa and KImi. I wouldn't want Lewis Hamilton at Ferrari.

By the way, Ferrari screwed up the first 3 races of 2003. Then in the 4th race at San Marino Imola eventually Michael Schumacher just beats McLaren's Kimi Raikkonen. SO after a very bad start, Ferrari still won both drivers and constructors championships in 2003. Looked like Ferrari were in turmoil then as well but turned it around. They will do it again in 2009, or at least be competitive and then win titles again in 2010. Also note that in 2005 Ferrari also had a miserable season. Then they turned it around in 2006 and almost won both titles but ended up winning everything in 2007. All great teams have their ups and downs. All great teams succeed in the end. Ferrari is the type of team so they will succeed. Fact.

Let's face it there though. Raikkonen and Massa are no way near the class of Schumacher.

Very true. Having said that, though, on a good day Raikkonen was the faster man. Schumacher was smarter and more consistent, and not exactly slow, mind you.

When Raikkonen could be bothered of course lol.

If Ferrari promised to buy him the Magnum factory, think what he'd achieve.

I still maintain that Raikkonen is the fastest of the current F1 drivers.

Schumacher didn't cheat in 03

I didnt mention '03

But that is what my post was in referent to.

Once a cheat always a cheat. Isnt that how it goes??

Why was it necessary to bring cheating in to this in the first place?

Its the typical argument. Lewis and his fans are backed into the corner so they'll play either the Schumacher or Alonso card.

Why was it neccessary to bring in cheating?
I think it started when Ewman said this

"No wonder such a low approval rate for Hamilton. They certainly know a cheat when they see one! "

I just pointed out that the guy he went on to praise was a past master at it.

Cheat or not, it's impossible to deny Michael Schumacher's class. The cheating argument is irrelevant to the comment made.

Suddennly its "cheat or not it's impossible to deny class"???I see. So the label cheating may only be applied to a one time world champion?? A McLaren driver? A guy whose father manages him? A guy you dislike? If you cheat on multiple occassions but win 7 world championships then its ok??

Erm. What?

I did not deny the fact that he cheated, I merely stated that regardless of whether or not he was a cheater, he was still a great driver. Stop just assuming everyone is so anti-Lewis. Read and think about what people post.

I did . I read this.
"No wonder such a low approval rate for Hamilton. They certainly know a cheat when they see one! "

But clearly you did not read and consider what I said. Which is the point at hand.

[Gaz]

Schumacher > Hamilton. IT is as simple as that.

Senna > Schumacher.

Never did senna do anything which was abit dodgy without a reason.

Schumacher just cheated again and again and again to win.

Lewis either lied or was convinced to lie to win but his on track antiques have been pretty honest racing.

OH FOR GOD SAKE, THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH AYRTON SENNA!

your caps lock button appears to be stuck?....



It had nothing to do with Schui but since were looking at cheats i'd thought i'd point at a driver who had a pretty clean career.

[EwanM]

If we're doing it the racechick way - which is bringing random arguments into the thread because there is some sort of link to Hamilton - then it is fine to bring in Schumi. He has the Ferrari link.

[Jamie]

why would ya wanna join a team that im turmoil

No one is in turmoil.
But with the Alonso thing, he is a good racing driver in which I believe he can bring us a few titles along the way. But in my own personal opinion Vettel is the more suited driver to my taste for the Maranello based squad. He would fit in a little more than Alonso. But Alonso is an ace driver and could bring us allot of Gold on the way. From the opinions of others everyone on this planet has cheated to prosper from ones mistake. That is what makes us human. If you have an enemy with a weak leg it is only human to beat that leg first them the person. Schumi no matter what people say might or might not have cheated, that does not change the fact of 7 times champion. But I guess with the races he was laps ached of people that was cheating also? Michael has had his comeuppance in his time on the track, Jap GP rings a few bells when he over cooked it and lost a few places. Alonso is a talent to be reckoned with, Ferrari will give him the chance that is needed. Schumacher is an amazing driver that you should all respect because he has made F1 one of the most watched sports in Europe. He brought us allot of great times, Senna Vs Schumacher? I'd go on Schumacher for the pure fact of more evidential success rate than Senna. Senna is a legend in his own class for the pure fact of personality and the heart to win. Schumacher's personality doesn't acquire to allot of peoples taste but I believe he has written his own books in this sport and has a mind of a genius. Strategic and calculates everything down to the last number. Both amazing in different worlds. Only difference is a few titles and both at different teams.

[racechick]

If we're doing it the racechick way - which is bringing random arguments into the thread because there is some sort of link to Hamilton - then it is fine to bring in Schumi. He has the Ferrari link.

Dont mention cheating if you're not prepard to discuss it fully.You brought up cheating not me.

[EwanM]

If we're doing it the racechick way - which is bringing random arguments into the thread because there is some sort of link to Hamilton - then it is fine to bring in Schumi. He has the Ferrari link.

Dont mention cheating if you're not prepard to discuss it fully.You brought up cheating not me.

Yes cheating Lewis

[Hanwombat]

SO MANY QUOTES

[racechick]

[Michael Schumacher outclasses Hamilton, so there is no point making these lowly comparisons. .

He outclasses him in cheating thats for sure!

Driving? Lewis has had two years. How many did Michael have 12? 15? more? Hardly a fair comparison.

[Hexagram]

And yes I do feel Raikkonen has the outright pace of everyone. However as has been said he just never tried to improve the other aspects of his driving.

You have got to be kidding me! Outright pace of everyone? Massa made a show of Kimi last year at most of the grandprixs and its going to happen again this year.

And people will jump to his defence people saying the car doesn't suit his style, the tracks don't suit his style. You know what I think?

[EwanM]

And yes I do feel Raikkonen has the outright pace of everyone. However as has been said he just never tried to improve the other aspects of his driving.

You have got to be kidding me! Outright pace of everyone? Massa made a show of Kimi last year at most of the grandprixs and its going to happen again this year.

And people will jump to his defence people saying the car doesn't suit his style, the tracks don't suit his style. You know what I think?

Kimi is just lazy. His countless fastest laps show he is a very quick driver.
Previous to that he was mindblowingly fast in 2007 in the Ferrari. Before that we all know how quick he could be when he was at Mclaren.

[Hexagram]

And yes I do feel Raikkonen has the outright pace of everyone. However as has been said he just never tried to improve the other aspects of his driving.

You have got to be kidding me! Outright pace of everyone? Massa made a show of Kimi last year at most of the grandprixs and its going to happen again this year.

And people will jump to his defence people saying the car doesn't suit his style, the tracks don't suit his style. You know what I think?

Kimi is just lazy. His countless fastest laps show he is a very quick driver.
Previous to that he was mindblowingly fast in 2007 in the Ferrari. Before that we all know how quick he could be when he was at Mclaren.

A key ability in any drivers toolkit is the ability to adapt to a track & a new car quickly and get up to speed. He lacks that ability, which explains all his fastest laps usually clocked in near the end of the race when he is in 4th or 5th while Massa is 1st or 2nd. Its just not good enough in my opinion. Thing is i really like Kimi, my heart sunk when he put his Ferrari into the wall last year in Spa, I couldn't believe he threw it into the wall at the Singapore Grand Prix but to start 2009 off by throwing away what effectively would have been 2nd place by putting his Ferrari once again into a wall is unacceptable. Its nearly a year since Kimi won a grandprix! If i was in charge of Ferrari Kimi would be on very thin ice at the min because there is better than him available on the grid who would drop their current contracts for his seat at Ferrari.