FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Gaz]

Q. Do you think it will be easier to trail another car and overtake it this year?

TG: I drove just half a lap behind Nick Heidfeld in Bahrain and for five or six corners behind Kovalainen here, and for me it felt the same as last year. For me there was no big difference. The car was even a bit more nervous because last year we had understeer and now it felt like the car more unbalanced. So for me it's pretty clear that at least for us it's the same as last year.

From an interview with Timo Glock,

what do we think more or less overtaking this year.

personaly based on that i would say the same perhaps less at least for toyota, i hope its not the same for everyone else.

[Rivelution]

Heidfeld said that it was way easier to follow a car. Maybe the Toyota is just poo?

[welshie]

With all the alterations made to the cars, they should be able to follow each other ALOT easier . . . . in theory. And it will be extremely disappointing if nothing has changed, although I suspect there has.

[EwanM]

I wasn't expecting a radical overhaul in terms of overtaking action for Melbourne due to its layout, but if its proving difficult at a track like Bahrain with its long straights and slow corners...

[7UpJordan]

I wonder if the "overtaking ability" will vary from car to car?

[Jensonb]

-Compares cars to 90s-

Yeah...Pretty similar...

Brace yourselves lads and ladies, we're in for some real motor racing.

Hands up who wants to see 90s-style whole-field first corner stuffups back?

-Puts hand up-

[Mike D]

to me the cars are looking like the mid 90s more and more, but I seem to remember in 95 I think, Jean Alesi saying that it was very hard to follow another car, and watching early 90s races again recentley, there wasnt much overtaking or the ability to follow cars closely if the 2 cars where on the limit.

the one thing I think they should introduce if theyre thinking on standardising parts is standard soft shock absorbers, making braking and cornering more of a handfull.

Im thinking too that these modern v8 engines have narrow powerbands too which doesnt help for good racing and reminds me of modern british touring cars .

but at the end of the day, the only way they can get them to follow right up the gearbox of another car on fast corners when both cars are on similar lap times is simply, take the wings off them, motogp bikes are impressively fast around fast corners so an f1 car would still be impressive with no wings, even if they had fake wings, ie flat to keep the sponser area.

even small chin spoilers introduced to touring cars in the mid 90s made following another car harder, so a formula 1 car is gonna be a lot more worse off.

also if the fastest car is at the front, with the slowest behind it, the faster car will pull away, I liked the season where they were not allowed to change tyres, it became a bit like motorcyle racing where the guy whos pulled away may have shot his tyres and so nearer the end of the race, the guy whos got better tyres at the end would catch him up.


I dont think its gonna make much difference, but I hope Im wrong and it does, certainly theyre going in the right direction with the removal of the sidepod wings and return to slick tyres im undecided too whether re fueling should be banned.



Mike

[Rivelution]

I say bring back ground effects! Thats why the Champ Cars could follow each other so closely.

[f1ea]

Either way... just because you can now follow a car better doesn't mean you're going to be able to pass it. I mean... the guy in front is still not going to give up his position just because the car behind is able to follow. Besides, overtaking is probably just going to be easier not exactly easy, specially with different drivers, cars and set-ups behaving differently to the new regulations.

AND you still have to make sure you dont clip your big front wing while overtaking... so its still going to be a brave affair.

[madbrad]

Passing has been banned in F1 for years.

[Hanwombat]

Passing has been banned in F1 for years.

Agreeable

[Jag Racing]

I thing the overtaking will be much the same. With the increased size of the front wings and decreased size of the rear wings, the cars may suffer under steer due to the lack of air on the front whilst in the slip stream. the rear wing (which in the past may have balanced this out, but affected trail winds) doesn't counter this as much as it used to.

does that make sense or have i over analyzed?

[welshie]

I thing the overtaking will be much the same. With the increased size of the front wings and decreased size of the rear wings, the cars may suffer under steer due to the lack of air on the front whilst in the slip stream. the rear wing (which in the past may have balanced this out, but affected trail winds) doesn't counter this as much as it used to.

does that make sense or have i over analyzed?

Maybe slightly over-analyzed But then it's expected as no-one really knows how the cars will be affected until the first race in Auz, so speculation mounts!

[irons_4_ever]

I am looking forward to the new season i dont think anyone really knows whats going to happen, i find that exciting. i hope Honda get ready and are able to enter puerly to see another English driver, if Button gets the drive.

[Gilles 27]

bringing back Ground Effect is the only way of allowing the cars to follow while maintaining cornering speeds. Ground effect got into trouble because it employed movable aerodynamic parts in the sliding skirts (the FIA is now allowing movable aerodynamic parts to a degree). The teams got round this by using fixed skirts and setting the cars up so stiff that they maintained a constant ride height most of the time.

The cars now, because of carbon fiber are running much stiffer than they did during the ground effect era and with much higher downforce levels so none of the safety risks of ground effect have been negated by banning it! So now we have cars that are as stiff, corner faster and can't overtake.

The principles behind the new aerodynamic rules are sound but the implication has been crude. It has just been done to avoid an embarrassing U Turn on movable parts and ground effect. if they do overtake more next season, it will be because of slick tires and lower overall downforce levels rather than because of the new wings