FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Martin]

Hi folks, long time no speak. I don't get much time to look at the site these days so please forgive me if I am raking up something that has been covered recently.
I have been banging on, for over a year now, about the future of F1. We are now 3 teams short on the grid, and even before the 'credit crunch' there were no obvious new entrants to F1 - probably no car manufacturers - especially now (for the next couple of years at least). My thoughts then were that the most likely new entrants would be successful teams currently in something like GP2, and well sponsored by anyone (I think that Microsoft should sponsor an F1 team), and supported by an existing team. However, even that seems unlikely now.
At the end of this year I believe that we are likely to lose at least 1 more team (Toyota?) however, it would not surprise me if we lost a few others also.
I have written to FOM twice, very politely, to ask what plans there are to entice new teams in. I have had no reply. So does that mean there is no plan? Bernie is of an age where he must retire soon, so why would he care if there are no new teams? His revelations about the extras that Ferrari get from FIA suggest to me that he doesn't give a toss anymore. He would not have said those things a couple of years ago I think.
The future of F! does not look good from where I stand. Bernie seems to be losing interest (and why not? hes got more money than he will ever be able to spend, and money is his prime motivation in this business), Moseley will leave soon, bloody good riddance, but, who in his place? Someone from Ferrari no doubt, so the corruption will continue.
Am I being too negative? I am normally a positive person but I can only see F1 going down slowly. Environmental pressures are also affecting F1 already. I just cant see the future without serious new management of FOM & FIA. What say you?

[Gaz]

i agree with what your saying really it don't look good, but with the cost cuting comming in it should prevent more teams leaving.

perhaps if they allow customer cars more teams will join?

[bud]

i agree with what your saying really it don't look good, but with the cost cuting comming in it should prevent more teams leaving.

perhaps if they allow customer cars more teams will join?

3 car teams with the 3rd car running different livery for extra funding is what they should do before customer cars!

oh and welcome back Martin ya Neanderthal

[cap-dude]

Can I just ask, where did this stuff about 3 car teams come from. It sounds brilliant, but it sound unfortunatly fictional.

[Gaz]

Can I just ask, where did this stuff about 3 car teams come from. It sounds brilliant, but it sound unfortunatly fictional.

part of the rules man, if another team goes, torro rosso for example the teams will have to produce a 3rd car and driver.

[Red_Five]

I've long since been of the opinion that the influx of "works" teams was only ever gonna be a bad thing for F1 in the long run. Manufacturer involvement was always going to escalate budgets to a level where only manufacturers could afford to play. People like Ken Tyrrell, Paul Stoddart & Eddie Jordan have been priced out of the game. Now I know that these teams were perennial mid gridders/backmarkers, but the only reason they existed was to go racing. Car makers have to answer to their shareholders/board, and are very likely to pull the plug if the results aren't forthcoming.
Now that this global economic crisis is upon us, how much longer can a car maker justify the expense of F1 to their board whilst at the same time laying off workers? Ford ditching Jaguar should have been the wake up call the sport needed to reduce it's reliance on works teams. When the manufacturers have all gone away we'll be left with Williams & Force India. And as much as I love Williams that would be kind of boring. Max is correct, in my opinion, to be trying to reduce the cost of going F1 racing. It needs to be at a level where a GP2 team can realistcally contemplate making the step up.
I do love the technical side of F1, but it has gone too far with each team spending millions on things that don't actually improve the racing. But then manufacturers have to demonstrate F1's relevance somehow. I don't particularly care who is the best hydraulic engineer or computer programmer in the pitlane, so lets get rid of seamless shift gearboxes and reintroduce the throttle cable. Otherwise F1 is persuing a cold war-esque MAD policy where they'll just spend their way into oblivion.

[Martin]

oh and welcome back Martin ya Neanderthal

Cheers Bud nice to be back - Neanderthal is good - the original and best, but Mosses is kind of - well more holy & serene - know what I mean?

[Martin]

I've long since been of the opinion that the influx of "works" teams was only ever gonna be a bad thing for F1 in the long run. Manufacturer involvement was always going to escalate budgets to a level where only manufacturers could afford to play. People like Ken Tyrrell, Paul Stoddart & Eddie Jordan have been priced out of the game. Now I know that these teams were perennial mid gridders/backmarkers, but the only reason they existed was to go racing. Car makers have to answer to their shareholders/board, and are very likely to pull the plug if the results aren't forthcoming.
Now that this global economic crisis is upon us, how much longer can a car maker justify the expense of F1 to their board whilst at the same time laying off workers? Ford ditching Jaguar should have been the wake up call the sport needed to reduce it's reliance on works teams. When the manufacturers have all gone away we'll be left with Williams & Force India. And as much as I love Williams that would be kind of boring. Max is correct, in my opinion, to be trying to reduce the cost of going F1 racing. It needs to be at a level where a GP2 team can realistcally contemplate making the step up.
I do love the technical side of F1, but it has gone too far with each team spending millions on things that don't actually improve the racing. But then manufacturers have to demonstrate F1's relevance somehow. I don't particularly care who is the best hydraulic engineer or computer programmer in the pitlane, so lets get rid of seamless shift gearboxes and reintroduce the throttle cable. Otherwise F1 is persuing a cold war-esque MAD policy where they'll just spend their way into oblivion.

i agree with lots of this. A lot of the technology is expensive and pointless really - Yeah, bring back the throttle cable!! and ban electronic 'lollipops' and other such trivia. limit the size of motorhomes, limit the number of staff at a meeting.
Customer teams are probably the only realistic solution now but who is promoting this - or anything else? We need at least 4 more teams in the pipeline and there are no-one, so far as i know.

[Gaz]

I've long since been of the opinion that the influx of "works" teams was only ever gonna be a bad thing for F1 in the long run. Manufacturer involvement was always going to escalate budgets to a level where only manufacturers could afford to play. People like Ken Tyrrell, Paul Stoddart & Eddie Jordan have been priced out of the game. Now I know that these teams were perennial mid gridders/backmarkers, but the only reason they existed was to go racing. Car makers have to answer to their shareholders/board, and are very likely to pull the plug if the results aren't forthcoming.
Now that this global economic crisis is upon us, how much longer can a car maker justify the expense of F1 to their board whilst at the same time laying off workers? Ford ditching Jaguar should have been the wake up call the sport needed to reduce it's reliance on works teams. When the manufacturers have all gone away we'll be left with Williams & Force India. And as much as I love Williams that would be kind of boring. Max is correct, in my opinion, to be trying to reduce the cost of going F1 racing. It needs to be at a level where a GP2 team can realistcally contemplate making the step up.
I do love the technical side of F1, but it has gone too far with each team spending millions on things that don't actually improve the racing. But then manufacturers have to demonstrate F1's relevance somehow. I don't particularly care who is the best hydraulic engineer or computer programmer in the pitlane, so lets get rid of seamless shift gearboxes and reintroduce the throttle cable. Otherwise F1 is persuing a cold war-esque MAD policy where they'll just spend their way into oblivion.

i agree with lots of this. A lot of the technology is expensive and pointless really - Yeah, bring back the throttle cable!! and ban electronic 'lollipops' and other such trivia. limit the size of motorhomes, limit the number of staff at a meeting.
Customer teams are probably the only realistic solution now but who is promoting this - or anything else? We need at least 4 more teams in the pipeline and there are no-one, so far as i know.

To be fair tho, there were quite a few teams around sniffing before this credit crunch.

Ultimate F1, ProDrive, Honda North America and Lancia.

If there handnt been such an economic down turn we may of seen a few of them make the grid

[8-ball]

F1 future will look a whole much better if Bernie and Max were to go. As much as I don't like Max I rate him more highly than Bernie because at least he isn't solely motivated by money. Bernie exists to make as much of it as he can and he has screwed track owners, teams and TV companies to ensure his bank account's full. If he went and Max was left I would be OK with it.

Bernie is more of a problem than Max and the downturn in the economy has highlighted this more than ever. Part of me now says I think Max should stay on for another term as FIA president because at least he is one person that Bernie cannot influence and implement whatever crackpot idea he comes up with. I don't want Max to leave and we end up with an Eccelstone troll who will go along with whatever Bernie says.

So stay where you are Max!!!! All is forgiven...

[texasmr2]

F1 future will look a whole much better if Bernie and Max were to go. As much as I don't like Max I rate him more highly than Bernie because at least he isn't solely motivated by money. Bernie exists to make as much of it as he can and he has screwed track owners, teams and TV companies to ensure his bank account's full. If he went and Max was left I would be OK with it.

Bernie is more of a problem than Max and the downturn in the economy has highlighted this more than ever. Part of me now says I think Max should stay on for another term as FIA president because at least he is one person that Bernie cannot influence and implement whatever crackpot idea he comes up with. I don't want Max to leave and we end up with an Eccelstone troll who will go along with whatever Bernie says.

So stay where you are Max!!!! All is forgiven...

Are you mad and have truelly gone fishing, they both need to go!

[8-ball]

F1 future will look a whole much better if Bernie and Max were to go. As much as I don't like Max I rate him more highly than Bernie because at least he isn't solely motivated by money. Bernie exists to make as much of it as he can and he has screwed track owners, teams and TV companies to ensure his bank account's full. If he went and Max was left I would be OK with it.

Bernie is more of a problem than Max and the downturn in the economy has highlighted this more than ever. Part of me now says I think Max should stay on for another term as FIA president because at least he is one person that Bernie cannot influence and implement whatever crackpot idea he comes up with. I don't want Max to leave and we end up with an Eccelstone troll who will go along with whatever Bernie says.

So stay where you are Max!!!! All is forgiven...

Are you mad have you truelly gone fishing, they both need to go!

Max is crazy but Bernie is willing to screw whoever he needs to to make as much money as he can (ask Damon Hill and the rest of the BRDC board). I think that they both need to go but Max imo is the lesser of two evils. And if Max goes and Bernie stays then heaven help us all!

[Red_Five]

To be fair tho, there were quite a few teams around sniffing before this credit crunch.

Ultimate F1, ProDrive, Honda North America and Lancia.

If there handnt been such an economic down turn we may of seen a few of them make the grid

I'm not aware that Lancia expressed an interest in F1. I find it hard to take seriously seeing as the Fiat empire must already struggle to support Ferrari. And anyway Lancia is historically a rallying marque.
Prodrive were only intersted in joining the fold as a customer team, which would have been a damn sight cheaper than a standalone entry.
And as for the rest........ Talk is cheap.

[McLaren Fan]

Hi folks, long time no speak. I don't get much time to look at the site these days so please forgive me if I am raking up something that has been covered recently.
I have been banging on, for over a year now, about the future of F1. We are now 3 teams short on the grid, and even before the 'credit crunch' there were no obvious new entrants to F1 - probably no car manufacturers - especially now (for the next couple of years at least). My thoughts then were that the most likely new entrants would be successful teams currently in something like GP2, and well sponsored by anyone (I think that Microsoft should sponsor an F1 team), and supported by an existing team. However, even that seems unlikely now.
At the end of this year I believe that we are likely to lose at least 1 more team (Toyota?) however, it would not surprise me if we lost a few others also.
I have written to FOM twice, very politely, to ask what plans there are to entice new teams in. I have had no reply. So does that mean there is no plan? Bernie is of an age where he must retire soon, so why would he care if there are no new teams? His revelations about the extras that Ferrari get from FIA suggest to me that he doesn't give a toss anymore. He would not have said those things a couple of years ago I think.
The future of F! does not look good from where I stand. Bernie seems to be losing interest (and why not? hes got more money than he will ever be able to spend, and money is his prime motivation in this business), Moseley will leave soon, bloody good riddance, but, who in his place? Someone from Ferrari no doubt, so the corruption will continue.
Am I being too negative? I am normally a positive person but I can only see F1 going down slowly. Environmental pressures are also affecting F1 already. I just cant see the future without serious new management of FOM & FIA. What say you?

I'm sorry, but not surprised to read, that FOM didn't get back to you. It really speaks volumes about how much they appreciate the fans.

[bud]

oh and welcome back Martin ya Neanderthal

Cheers Bud nice to be back - Neanderthal is good - the original and best, but Mosses is kind of - well more holy & serene - know what I mean?

whenever i see your avatar i think of moses but at a closer look its a neanderthal right?
or was Moses a red head with a big fat nose?