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User avatar
By Martin
#35268
Patrick Head (Williams) has proposed that the fastest cars should start at the back to make more overtaking and more of a spectacle.
I dont know how he proposes that the speed of a car should be calculated. For example, if Quali was to continue I think that we might find some cars with a maximum speed of 30MPH along the straights! I suppose it would be based upon the cars speed in the previous race. I think that this would spoil racing in the event that a front runner were to spin of and need a call to the pits, it might be decided to 'go slow' to gain a better grid position next race, rather than race hard to make up places, as we have seen many times.
In fairness I dont know how he proposes to make it work but I cant see how it can be done. Do you?
User avatar
By Denthúl
#35271
I don't quite understand how it would work, either. But Patrick Head is pretty smart, so he's probably got it all worked out. Still, I think there are better ways of increasing overtaking. Like designing tracks for maximum overtaking possibilities rather than prettyness.
User avatar
By PJ640
#35275
Australian V8 Supercars tried reverse grid starts last year, it didn't even make the end of the season until the idea was chucked out. Nobody liked it. Drivers, owners, sponsors and even most of the paying public thought it was stupid.

I think Patrick Heads idea is for the grid to be the reverse of the championship points standings.
User avatar
By McLaren Fan
#35277
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7282861.stm

Reverse F1 grids - Williams boss
By Andrew Benson

Williams co-owner Patrick Head
Head believes radical ideas need to be explored on overtaking
A radical idea to improve the spectacle of Formula One and make overtaking easier has been proposed by Williams team co-owner Patrick Head.

The veteran says races can be boring and wants the fastest cars to start at the back and the slowest at the front.

"I would like to see the grids in reverse order of championship position," Head told BBC Sport.

"It's the same for everybody, and over a whole season the right guy would still win the championship."

Interview: Williams team co-owner Patrick Head

Head, who has been involved in F1 for more than 30 years and is one of the most respected engineers in the sport, feels his idea will "very much upset the purists".

But he said current proposals to facilitate overtaking and improve the spectacle were unlikely to work and urged the FIA, the sport's governing body, to "be a bit more adventurous".


If you line the cars up with the fastest at the front and the slowest at the back, why should there be any overtaking?

Previous attempts to increase overtaking have failed.

The boldest of those was forbidding refuelling between qualifying and the race.

The move was designed to open up the possibility of positional changes in the race because teams would adopt different strategies.

But, in practice, the strategies of the leading teams do not tend to vary significantly.

Any changing of position that takes place tends to be a result of what happens in the pits not on the track.

For 2009, the FIA has introduced another series of changes to spice up the sport.

These include introducing a "boost" button to provide a brief burst of extra power and changes to the aerodynamics to make it easier for one car to follow another closely.

But Head, speaking ahead of the start of the new season in Australia, says he does not think they will make a big impact.

"Maybe overtaking will be less difficult, but if a guy is back there because he is 0.3 seconds slower than the car in front, why should he overtake [it]?"

Head admits there would probably be a number of objectors to his idea.

He anticipates some people would want to know how the grid would be formed for the first race of the season.

He also feels some drivers would be upset.

"The fastest might say: 'Well, overtaking is a risk and it puts us more at risk than the guys who don't have to do that'," said Head.

"I'm sure people would complain.

"But I do come across a lot of people who say they like watching motorbikes [more] and I have to say I'm a little bit in that camp because there isn't a lot of overtaking in Formula One.

Ferrari's Kimi Raikkonen leads McLaren's Lewis Hamilton
Overtaking is notoriously difficult in Formula One

"What's really boring is if there's a car that is genuinely faster sitting on the tail of the car in front and his race is destroyed.

"We've had some races at Monaco where people have been held up for 30 or 40 laps when they've been a second or two faster than the car in front, and I think that's a pity."

Head's view is largely at odds with that of FIA president Max Mosley, who has in the past likened the strategic complexity of Grands Prix to chess matches.

Mosley admits overtaking is currently a little bit too difficult, but he argues that if it became too easy it would lose its appeal.

Head says his proposal had not come out of the blue and was not motivated by his team's recent fall after dominating F1 in the 1980s and 1990s.

"I've suggested [it] to the FIA in the past and I've made those suggestions at times when Williams have been winning races," he said.

As evidence his proposal would work, Head highlighted the 2005 Japanese Grand Prix, which has been hailed as arguably the greatest single race in F1 history.

The fastest cars qualified well down the field because of a rain shower in qualifying.

The result was a dramatic race that included a number of daring overtaking manoeuvres.

Fernando Alonso passed Michael Schumacher around the outside of a 180mph corner while Kimi Raikkonen eventually claimed victory with a superb overtaking move on the last lap.


I can't say I'm really for the idea at all. I would rather leave the rules as they are make modifications to the cars in order to improve overtaking. I believe this can be done without silly moving wings, but by increasing the mechanical grip of the cars and reducing the aerodynamic grip, as well as bring back good old-fashioned manual gears (with a stick and clutch pedal). I think some people also need to realise that Formula One is not all about overtaking. The appeal of Formula One extends beyond such in-your-face measures. It's about passion, glamour, some politics, driving skill, strategy, engineering, innovation, and efficient team work.
User avatar
By Stephen
#35282
Head is right, we need change, but i'm not convinced about the reverse grid. I'd have to agree with McLaren Fan, that changes need to be made to the cars.
User avatar
By 7UpJordan
#35304
Reverse grid won't work, you'll then get drivers intentionally setting slow times. Overtaking should be increasing again when these aero restrictions are put in place next season, so I'd wait. :)
User avatar
By 8-ball
#35305
F1 needs to be careful that it does not turn into a more expensive version of A1 grand prix. Equalizing (such as through the aero restrictions) the cars will increase the overtaking opportunities but will limit development. I personally think that we just don't need these aero restrictions
User avatar
By Jensonb
#35337
Makes no sense. It basically means getting rid of qualifying.

Besides, the problem is not that the fast cars lead, it's that they have trouble getting by each other.
User avatar
By Red Racer
#35361
Maybe we could get a COGSWORTH PUSH TO PASS in F1 that would be awsome.
User avatar
By AKR
#35369
Ok so if this dumb idea were ever implemented, then all you have to do is be the slowest in qualifying so you then qualify first and then during the race go as fast as you can. Now imagine everyone caught on to this? Then you would have everyone qualfying by driving at walking speeds!!!!!!! How boring and how stupid........

Here is another proposal. Put the Ferraris at the front of the grid and put the McLarens at the back. That is fair don't you think????? Uhhhh was just kidding of course but if I had to be the one to decide..................... *LOL*
User avatar
By Martin
#35378
Ok so if this dumb idea were ever implemented, then all you have to do is be the slowest in qualifying so you then qualify first and then during the race go as fast as you can. Now imagine everyone caught on to this? Then you would have everyone qualfying by driving at walking speeds!!!!!!! How boring and how stupid........

Here is another proposal. Put the Ferraris at the front of the grid and put the McLarens at the back. That is fair don't you think????? Uhhhh was just kidding of course but if I had to be the one to decide..................... *LOL*


As PJ640 has already said, Heads idea is that cars line up on the grid in reverse order of championship points. So the championship leader would start at the back.
This would obviously do away with qualy, which is a spectacle in itself. If there was more practice on Saturday then that would be a bit boring wouldn't it?
I definitely think that improved mechanical grip and reduced aero will improve overtaking opportunities. (maybe high wear, high grip tyres = more mechanical grip and more pit stops for new tyres = more overtaking)

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