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[f1usa]

#1 Movable floor pan in Australia, #2 100M fine in spygate saga, #3 Brazil appeal for cold fuel. Ron Dennis does not want Kimi's WDC title. RD and all of us know Max and the FIA will not let that happen. The point is, this will be three times the the FIA and stewards have made arbitrary and biased rulings that have affected McLaren. The more examples of controversial and biased decisions by FIA, the better. McLaren and Mercedes will seek a legal solution to some of the FIA rulings of 2007 season. This will open the door for more thorough investigations of FIA, Max and Bernie.

[darwin dali]

You are missing the points:
#1 not illegal at the time.
#2 too lenient - the drivers were allowed to finish the season in a car that benefited from industrial espionage for which the team was penalized.
#3 sore losers are rapidly losing the rest of respect they might still have had and are becoming the laughing stock.

Fact is that McLaren/RD screwed up royally this past season: annoying incompetence in managing their drivers, disingenuous handling of the spysaga, ridiculously amateurish mistakes and embarrassingly incompetent coaching of their rookie driver which resulted in them losing the title during the last two races.
Any CEO in the corporate world who is responsible for this many serious f.uck ups would be given a golden parachute and kicked out!

[Mikep99]

You are missing the points:
#1 not illegal at the time.
#2 too lenient - the drivers were allowed to finish the season in a car that benefited from industrial espionage for which the team was penalized.
#3 sore losers are rapidly losing the rest of respect they might still have had and are becoming the laughing stock.

Fact is that McLaren/RD screwed up royally this past season: annoying incompetence in managing their drivers, disingenuous handling of the spysaga, ridiculously amateurish mistakes and embarrassingly incompetent coaching of their rookie driver which resulted in them losing the title during the last two races.
Any CEO in the corporate world who is responsible for this many serious f.uck ups would be given a golden parachute and kicked out!

DD your a genius

[f1usa]

Darwin, you are missing the point, this is about corruption and bias in the FIA and the need to expose it. Obtuse verbiage does not make your points valid.

[raikkonenrox]

so what exactly is your point f1usa?

[Ron Dennis]

where two lines meet

[racechick]

so what exactly is your point f1usa?

I think his point is that McLaren not only have beat Ferrari on the track they have to beat the FIA as well. they are in a no win situation. Yes McLarn made erros this season they have not denied this but that is irrelevant to the issue. They were destabilised from the outset and had their focus taken from the racing. They have not been treated fairly.

[mooker]

You are missing the points:
#1 not illegal at the time.
#2 too lenient - the drivers were allowed to finish the season in a car that benefited from industrial espionage for which the team was penalized.
#3 sore losers are rapidly losing the rest of respect they might still have had and are becoming the laughing stock.

Fact is that McLaren/RD screwed up royally this past season: annoying incompetence in managing their drivers, disingenuous handling of the spysaga, ridiculously amateurish mistakes and embarrassingly incompetent coaching of their rookie driver which resulted in them losing the title during the last two races.
Any CEO in the corporate world who is responsible for this many serious f.uck ups would be given a golden parachute and kicked out!

I get his points, if not best expianed.

1. Not illegal at the time? Says the FIA, huh? If it wasn't illegal then why weren't they allowed to keep running it?

2. Industrial espionage is the biggest joke of the season. Did Red-Bull get repremanded for having McLaren technology on their cars after signing Adrian Newey? Was it Renault technology that gave McLaren their 6/10 that Alfonso was twittering on about? And how much insider info did Kimi take to Ferrari? Point is, this happens all across F1 and yet its mostly accepted. Personally I don't think any 'Ferrari technology' was used on the MM cars, other than trying out some set-up info. That's why they can easily state that they have nothing to hide.

3. Sore losers?? I wonder what Ferrari would have done in that situation...

To be honest, I think its the whole pettiness that has spoilt the F1 season. Things that would have just been accepted in the past have been blown out of proportions this year and its distracted from an otherwise great season.

I'm a big Kimi fan and I'm glad he won. I have big respect for Lewis achieving what he has as a rookie. Its just a shame that most of the things I have read about F1 this year have nothing to do with racing.

[Mikep99]

so what exactly is your point f1usa?

I think his point is that McLaren not only have beat Ferrari on the track they have to beat the FIA as well. they are in a no win situation. Yes McLarn made erros this season they have not denied this but that is irrelevant to the issue. They were destabilised from the outset and had their focus taken from the racing. They have not been treated fairly.

Sorry racechick but this has been discussed a millions time before not only between us but with just about everyone on this board. I know my arguments still stand and I am sure everyone else's do too so why do we all need to repeat it all again.
mooker & f1usa if you do some sniffing around you will see what everyone’s arguments are on this subject, both for and against then you can make up your own mind.

[racechick]

From the sound of Mooker's last post he already knows exactly what the score is!

[bud]

Hey Mooker i tend to agree with your post! schweet

[Ron Dennis]

3. Sore losers?? I wonder what Ferrari would have done in that situation...

LIke McLaren they would have appealed. I am sure most people agree that the only difference is that Ferraris appeal would have been successful, where as McLarens will not.

We all remember the mass damper fiasco of last year. McLaren question the technology and nothing is done about it. Ferrari attempt to copy it, and when unsuccessful they too appeal and shazaam the mass damper system is banned. I wonder why the McLaren complaint was ignored but the Ferrari one was not?

[737flier]

The point is the FIA has difficulty making unbiased decisions when the sound of money is ringing in their ears.

McLaren Honda and Williams have had the brunt of these questionable decisions, they have all been heavily penalized in the same situation as Ferrari's flexible floor, however Ferrari get no penalty at all. And yes, it is illegal and always has been, the test had not been formulated correctly but the intent of the rule is clear and fitting a spring is a conscious measure to circumvent the test and thus break the rule.

Honda and Mclaren have been penalized even though there was no proof that a rule had been broken.

[f1usa]

I did not seek a rediscussion of the three topics of my origional post. Those are examples of the corrupt and bias rulings of MM and FIA. I do advocate McLaren start legal proceedings against FIA in the spygate saga. That is the point.

[Ron Dennis]

f1usa - what you seek is not what you always get

a wise man once said "what time is it?"