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#235767
Please do not take my question out of context, i didnt mean to actually infer that Alonso is better, just that his logic in deciding a driver's speed is not as accurate as he might think it is.

I’m sorry Nish, it wasn’t my intention. I don’t believe it was out of contest. You were only asking… as saying he isn’t. I think it’s pretty clear.
Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?

Yes of course, far better, for that and many other reasons. Remember that Alonso is a tough and intelligent driver, not only a fast one.


He is also a driver that as a double world champion was beaten by a rookie hamilton in the same car. Why is that so tricky to remember :P

You should make that question to Uncle Ron, not to me. I know that you, in the deep of your heart, like very much Fernando.
#235768
You should make that question to Uncle Ron, not to me. I know that you, in the deep of your heart, like very much Fernando.

Ooh, ouch, badabing, badaboom! :eek::P:twisted:
#235786
It's pretty easy to put 90% effort and make sure you finish every race with the car and tyres looking pretty. But that's also the reason why you lose the chance of being WDC a few races before the end, instead of the teammate who pushes it 110% and makes a couple of mistakes but still has a tiny shot in the last race. (No names mentioned)

In regards to Vettel, he's got sublime speed. We saw some racecraft in Silverstone where he overtook cars left and right. Yes, the car was much stronger than the opposition he was overtaking, but apart from Lewis, how many overtakes do we see between cars in near-equal capability? McLaren-Ferrari-Redbull...not much.

Vettel is definitely a contender for many more WDCs, and he's only going to get better as time goes on, just like Lewis. These two haven't been in F1 very long, unlike their teammates who've been in the game for a decade or more.


hmm,
i just cant agree, remember how long it took him to work his way back up
the field in silcerstone, embaressingly long. this myth about he's still young, like i said alonso
and hamilton are clearly better, and like i said, unless his car is the top car, even
if only by a bit, i dont think he'll win again, dont understand the blistering speed part either, his onboard laps have never looked any different then anyone elses and he
was beaten to pole at none other then the ultimate driver track by webber. if anything hamilton having only one
title in going on 5 years in 2011 shows how hars the beat have it. vettels got a lot of work to do considering hes pretty
much as crash prone as
lewis and his overtaking skill is absolutely dire, dire.....


Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?


i didnt imply in any way shape or form that hes a worse driver then webber?

i said that given considering
everyone labels him blisteringly quick, being beaten by a teammate that
general opinion labels as an average-good driver at a track that a drivers ability counts more then any other, doesnt suggest so. please read what i say before
going for the obvious throat and making an alonso>hamilton reference to a hamilton
fan. especially when its irrelevant.


I read it. I really did, as hard as it sometimes gets, i did read your post. And according to me my point still stands.

You state that his speed is nothing great by comparing it to Webber's performance in Monaco. So I'm comparing Lewis's speed (who is regarded by many as either the fastest or one of the fastest drivers) to his former teammate, Alonso's.

Because according to you if a driver is not faster than his teammate around Monaco then he there is no proof of his "blistering speed". (even though he out did his teammate by a scale factor of 2 when it comes to pole positions in comparison to Lewis's 2010 season in which he went against a reigning world champion and only scored one more pole position to him)



Yeah you really didnt read it, as proved by this recent piece i must now rip into in an attempt you quieten you down. Try replying to such retarded posts on a ipod, thats why its hard to read sometimes.

I did not state his speed is nothing by comparing to anything, there were no comparisons, i used an example, in the same car wwhich clearly dominated the track, a track which most would say is best at showing the drivers skill, and vettel couldnt get pole against a teammate most would say is only average-good.

"according to you if a driver is not faster..." tell me where i said that, no no, where i even implied that and ill show you a born liar. Once again i used Monaco as an example of my opinion, not hard proof of a dead certain fact.

Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism without becoming a 5 year old, you have turned it onto Lewis, who doesnt actualyl have anything to do with this thread, or debate.


Funny how you need to "quieten me down" while saying that i cant take criticism for a driver of a team that i support. "Try replying to such a retarded posts on a ipod", no i would prefer for people to understand what i write and not then have to argue over it while trying to change the tone of the post so that im not proven wrong.

Your example was a comparison of Vettel's speed to Webber's. If you cant admit that then there is no point arguing this and we can leave Vettel to prove his speed to you on track.

"Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism"
Wow, you are quite the hypocrite, someone who cant take criticism on his "opinion" and is still able to indulge in personal attacks by calling me a 5 year old, thus proving that it is you who is so immature that they cannot debate or argue without without needing to throw an insults at someone, and im sure many would agree that its not really the first time you have done such a thing.

And i didnt turn it onto lewis vs alonso to prove one of them is better, i used it to prove your comparison wrong.
#235800
Please do not take my question out of context, i didnt mean to actually infer that Alonso is better, just that his logic in deciding a driver's speed is not as accurate as he might think it is.

I’m sorry Nish, it wasn’t my intention. I don’t believe it was out of contest. You were only asking… as saying he isn’t. I think it’s pretty clear.
Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?

Yes of course, far better, for that and many other reasons. Remember that Alonso is a tough and intelligent driver, not only a fast one.


He is also a driver that as a double world champion was beaten by a rookie hamilton in the same car. Why is that so tricky to remember :P

You should make that question to Uncle Ron, not to me. I know that you, in the deep of your heart, like very much Fernando.


No I dont like him one tiny little bit. And I have no need to speak to Ron to help me remember the facts of 2007.
#235801
It's pretty easy to put 90% effort and make sure you finish every race with the car and tyres looking pretty. But that's also the reason why you lose the chance of being WDC a few races before the end, instead of the teammate who pushes it 110% and makes a couple of mistakes but still has a tiny shot in the last race. (No names mentioned)

Then again, some people have the consistency to win a world championship before the final round, whereas others have to wait until the final freaking turn, never mind round, of the season because they kept making mistakes.

Again, no names mentioned :wink:


well doesnt matter if its won though :wink::hehe:

Haha, yeah, of course. Don't get me wrong, I personally don't care, I just don't like skewed statistics :thumbup:


:hehe:
#235802
Please do not take my question out of context, i didnt mean to actually infer that Alonso is better, just that his logic in deciding a driver's speed is not as accurate as he might think it is.

I’m sorry Nish, it wasn’t my intention. I don’t believe it was out of contest. You were only asking… as saying he isn’t. I think it’s pretty clear.
Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?

Yes of course, far better, for that and many other reasons. Remember that Alonso is a tough and intelligent driver, not only a fast one.


He is also a driver that as a double world champion was beaten by a rookie hamilton in the same car. Why is that so tricky to remember :P
You should make that question to Uncle Ron, not to me. I know that you, in the deep of your heart, like very much Fernando.


No I dont like him one tiny little bit. And I have no need to speak to Ron to help me remember the facts of 2007.


YEAH!! :hehe:
#235822
It's pretty easy to put 90% effort and make sure you finish every race with the car and tyres looking pretty. But that's also the reason why you lose the chance of being WDC a few races before the end, instead of the teammate who pushes it 110% and makes a couple of mistakes but still has a tiny shot in the last race. (No names mentioned)

In regards to Vettel, he's got sublime speed. We saw some racecraft in Silverstone where he overtook cars left and right. Yes, the car was much stronger than the opposition he was overtaking, but apart from Lewis, how many overtakes do we see between cars in near-equal capability? McLaren-Ferrari-Redbull...not much.

Vettel is definitely a contender for many more WDCs, and he's only going to get better as time goes on, just like Lewis. These two haven't been in F1 very long, unlike their teammates who've been in the game for a decade or more.


hmm,
i just cant agree, remember how long it took him to work his way back up
the field in silcerstone, embaressingly long. this myth about he's still young, like i said alonso
and hamilton are clearly better, and like i said, unless his car is the top car, even
if only by a bit, i dont think he'll win again, dont understand the blistering speed part either, his onboard laps have never looked any different then anyone elses and he
was beaten to pole at none other then the ultimate driver track by webber. if anything hamilton having only one
title in going on 5 years in 2011 shows how hars the beat have it. vettels got a lot of work to do considering hes pretty
much as crash prone as
lewis and his overtaking skill is absolutely dire, dire.....


Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?


i didnt imply in any way shape or form that hes a worse driver then webber?

i said that given considering
everyone labels him blisteringly quick, being beaten by a teammate that
general opinion labels as an average-good driver at a track that a drivers ability counts more then any other, doesnt suggest so. please read what i say before
going for the obvious throat and making an alonso>hamilton reference to a hamilton
fan. especially when its irrelevant.


I read it. I really did, as hard as it sometimes gets, i did read your post. And according to me my point still stands.

You state that his speed is nothing great by comparing it to Webber's performance in Monaco. So I'm comparing Lewis's speed (who is regarded by many as either the fastest or one of the fastest drivers) to his former teammate, Alonso's.

Because according to you if a driver is not faster than his teammate around Monaco then he there is no proof of his "blistering speed". (even though he out did his teammate by a scale factor of 2 when it comes to pole positions in comparison to Lewis's 2010 season in which he went against a reigning world champion and only scored one more pole position to him)



Yeah you really didnt read it, as proved by this recent piece i must now rip into in an attempt you quieten you down. Try replying to such retarded posts on a ipod, thats why its hard to read sometimes.

I did not state his speed is nothing by comparing to anything, there were no comparisons, i used an example, in the same car wwhich clearly dominated the track, a track which most would say is best at showing the drivers skill, and vettel couldnt get pole against a teammate most would say is only average-good.

"according to you if a driver is not faster..." tell me where i said that, no no, where i even implied that and ill show you a born liar. Once again i used Monaco as an example of my opinion, not hard proof of a dead certain fact.

Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism without becoming a 5 year old, you have turned it onto Lewis, who doesnt actualyl have anything to do with this thread, or debate.


Funny how you need to "quieten me down" while saying that i cant take criticism for a driver of a team that i support. "Try replying to such a retarded posts on a ipod", no i would prefer for people to understand what i write and not then have to argue over it while trying to change the tone of the post so that im not proven wrong.

Your example was a comparison of Vettel's speed to Webber's. If you cant admit that then there is no point arguing this and we can leave Vettel to prove his speed to you on track.

"Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism"
Wow, you are quite the hypocrite, someone who cant take criticism on his "opinion" and is still able to indulge in personal attacks by calling me a 5 year old, thus proving that it is you who is so immature that they cannot debate or argue without without needing to throw an insults at someone, and im sure many would agree that its not really the first time you have done such a thing.

And i didnt turn it onto lewis vs alonso to prove one of them is better, i used it to prove your comparison wrong.



If you want people to understand what you write get the crayon out your arse and write a decent, coherent post.

This isnt an argument either btw, this is you busting a nut cause i dont think Vettels as good as it would seem, you think Hamiltons worse then Alonso, fine, ill take it on the chin, like i have been the past four seasons now.

As for your last part, childish posts deserve childish replies. What ironic is that you use the quote many would agree(with you), when infact im damn sure anyone that knows how to debate in even the most basic form will see how you went off on a tangent in your very first reply to my post and went further down the rabbit hole with your further replies.

If you want to take this further, reply to me in a personal message for the sake of myself and the rest of the forum, i dotn wanna be contacted by mods cause you threw your toys from the off.
#235825
It's pretty easy to put 90% effort and make sure you finish every race with the car and tyres looking pretty. But that's also the reason why you lose the chance of being WDC a few races before the end, instead of the teammate who pushes it 110% and makes a couple of mistakes but still has a tiny shot in the last race. (No names mentioned)

In regards to Vettel, he's got sublime speed. We saw some racecraft in Silverstone where he overtook cars left and right. Yes, the car was much stronger than the opposition he was overtaking, but apart from Lewis, how many overtakes do we see between cars in near-equal capability? McLaren-Ferrari-Redbull...not much.

Vettel is definitely a contender for many more WDCs, and he's only going to get better as time goes on, just like Lewis. These two haven't been in F1 very long, unlike their teammates who've been in the game for a decade or more.


hmm,
i just cant agree, remember how long it took him to work his way back up
the field in silcerstone, embaressingly long. this myth about he's still young, like i said alonso
and hamilton are clearly better, and like i said, unless his car is the top car, even
if only by a bit, i dont think he'll win again, dont understand the blistering speed part either, his onboard laps have never looked any different then anyone elses and he
was beaten to pole at none other then the ultimate driver track by webber. if anything hamilton having only one
title in going on 5 years in 2011 shows how hars the beat have it. vettels got a lot of work to do considering hes pretty
much as crash prone as
lewis and his overtaking skill is absolutely dire, dire.....


Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?


i didnt imply in any way shape or form that hes a worse driver then webber?

i said that given considering
everyone labels him blisteringly quick, being beaten by a teammate that
general opinion labels as an average-good driver at a track that a drivers ability counts more then any other, doesnt suggest so. please read what i say before
going for the obvious throat and making an alonso>hamilton reference to a hamilton
fan. especially when its irrelevant.


I read it. I really did, as hard as it sometimes gets, i did read your post. And according to me my point still stands.

You state that his speed is nothing great by comparing it to Webber's performance in Monaco. So I'm comparing Lewis's speed (who is regarded by many as either the fastest or one of the fastest drivers) to his former teammate, Alonso's.

Because according to you if a driver is not faster than his teammate around Monaco then he there is no proof of his "blistering speed". (even though he out did his teammate by a scale factor of 2 when it comes to pole positions in comparison to Lewis's 2010 season in which he went against a reigning world champion and only scored one more pole position to him)



Yeah you really didnt read it, as proved by this recent piece i must now rip into in an attempt you quieten you down. Try replying to such retarded posts on a ipod, thats why its hard to read sometimes.

I did not state his speed is nothing by comparing to anything, there were no comparisons, i used an example, in the same car wwhich clearly dominated the track, a track which most would say is best at showing the drivers skill, and vettel couldnt get pole against a teammate most would say is only average-good.

"according to you if a driver is not faster..." tell me where i said that, no no, where i even implied that and ill show you a born liar. Once again i used Monaco as an example of my opinion, not hard proof of a dead certain fact.

Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism without becoming a 5 year old, you have turned it onto Lewis, who doesnt actualyl have anything to do with this thread, or debate.


Funny how you need to "quieten me down" while saying that i cant take criticism for a driver of a team that i support. "Try replying to such a retarded posts on a ipod", no i would prefer for people to understand what i write and not then have to argue over it while trying to change the tone of the post so that im not proven wrong.

Your example was a comparison of Vettel's speed to Webber's. If you cant admit that then there is no point arguing this and we can leave Vettel to prove his speed to you on track.

"Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism"
Wow, you are quite the hypocrite, someone who cant take criticism on his "opinion" and is still able to indulge in personal attacks by calling me a 5 year old, thus proving that it is you who is so immature that they cannot debate or argue without without needing to throw an insults at someone, and im sure many would agree that its not really the first time you have done such a thing.

And i didnt turn it onto lewis vs alonso to prove one of them is better, i used it to prove your comparison wrong.



If you want people to understand what you write get the crayon out your arse and write a decent, coherent post.

This isnt an argument either btw, this is you busting a nut cause i dont think Vettels as good as it would seem, you think Hamiltons worse then Alonso, fine, ill take it on the chin, like i have been the past four seasons now.

As for your last part, childish posts deserve childish replies. What ironic is that you use the quote many would agree(with you), when infact im damn sure anyone that knows how to debate in even the most basic form will see how you went off on a tangent in your very first reply to my post and went further down the rabbit hole with your further replies.

If you want to take this further, reply to me in a personal message for the sake of myself and the rest of the forum, i dotn wanna be contacted by mods cause you threw your toys from the off.


Haha i guess your what they call a "troll".
#235827
It's pretty easy to put 90% effort and make sure you finish every race with the car and tyres looking pretty. But that's also the reason why you lose the chance of being WDC a few races before the end, instead of the teammate who pushes it 110% and makes a couple of mistakes but still has a tiny shot in the last race. (No names mentioned)

In regards to Vettel, he's got sublime speed. We saw some racecraft in Silverstone where he overtook cars left and right. Yes, the car was much stronger than the opposition he was overtaking, but apart from Lewis, how many overtakes do we see between cars in near-equal capability? McLaren-Ferrari-Redbull...not much.

Vettel is definitely a contender for many more WDCs, and he's only going to get better as time goes on, just like Lewis. These two haven't been in F1 very long, unlike their teammates who've been in the game for a decade or more.


hmm,
i just cant agree, remember how long it took him to work his way back up
the field in silcerstone, embaressingly long. this myth about he's still young, like i said alonso
and hamilton are clearly better, and like i said, unless his car is the top car, even
if only by a bit, i dont think he'll win again, dont understand the blistering speed part either, his onboard laps have never looked any different then anyone elses and he
was beaten to pole at none other then the ultimate driver track by webber. if anything hamilton having only one
title in going on 5 years in 2011 shows how hars the beat have it. vettels got a lot of work to do considering hes pretty
much as crash prone as
lewis and his overtaking skill is absolutely dire, dire.....


Alonso beat Hamilton at the "Ultimate driver's track"... does that mean Alonso is better than Hamilton?


i didnt imply in any way shape or form that hes a worse driver then webber?

i said that given considering
everyone labels him blisteringly quick, being beaten by a teammate that
general opinion labels as an average-good driver at a track that a drivers ability counts more then any other, doesnt suggest so. please read what i say before
going for the obvious throat and making an alonso>hamilton reference to a hamilton
fan. especially when its irrelevant.


I read it. I really did, as hard as it sometimes gets, i did read your post. And according to me my point still stands.

You state that his speed is nothing great by comparing it to Webber's performance in Monaco. So I'm comparing Lewis's speed (who is regarded by many as either the fastest or one of the fastest drivers) to his former teammate, Alonso's.

Because according to you if a driver is not faster than his teammate around Monaco then he there is no proof of his "blistering speed". (even though he out did his teammate by a scale factor of 2 when it comes to pole positions in comparison to Lewis's 2010 season in which he went against a reigning world champion and only scored one more pole position to him)



Yeah you really didnt read it, as proved by this recent piece i must now rip into in an attempt you quieten you down. Try replying to such retarded posts on a ipod, thats why its hard to read sometimes.

I did not state his speed is nothing by comparing to anything, there were no comparisons, i used an example, in the same car wwhich clearly dominated the track, a track which most would say is best at showing the drivers skill, and vettel couldnt get pole against a teammate most would say is only average-good.

"according to you if a driver is not faster..." tell me where i said that, no no, where i even implied that and ill show you a born liar. Once again i used Monaco as an example of my opinion, not hard proof of a dead certain fact.

Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism without becoming a 5 year old, you have turned it onto Lewis, who doesnt actualyl have anything to do with this thread, or debate.


Funny how you need to "quieten me down" while saying that i cant take criticism for a driver of a team that i support. "Try replying to such a retarded posts on a ipod", no i would prefer for people to understand what i write and not then have to argue over it while trying to change the tone of the post so that im not proven wrong.

Your example was a comparison of Vettel's speed to Webber's. If you cant admit that then there is no point arguing this and we can leave Vettel to prove his speed to you on track.

"Lastly once AGAIN, like most people that cannot take the slightest bit of meaningful criticism"
Wow, you are quite the hypocrite, someone who cant take criticism on his "opinion" and is still able to indulge in personal attacks by calling me a 5 year old, thus proving that it is you who is so immature that they cannot debate or argue without without needing to throw an insults at someone, and im sure many would agree that its not really the first time you have done such a thing.

And i didnt turn it onto lewis vs alonso to prove one of them is better, i used it to prove your comparison wrong.



If you want people to understand what you write get the crayon out your arse and write a decent, coherent post.

This isnt an argument either btw, this is you busting a nut cause i dont think Vettels as good as it would seem, you think Hamiltons worse then Alonso, fine, ill take it on the chin, like i have been the past four seasons now.

As for your last part, childish posts deserve childish replies. What ironic is that you use the quote many would agree(with you), when infact im damn sure anyone that knows how to debate in even the most basic form will see how you went off on a tangent in your very first reply to my post and went further down the rabbit hole with your further replies.

If you want to take this further, reply to me in a personal message for the sake of myself and the rest of the forum, i dotn wanna be contacted by mods cause you threw your toys from the off.


Haha i guess your what they call a "troll".


LOL. pathetic. i must not of included it last time so, personal message it.
#235828
nish2280, and FRAFPDD lets stop this before it gets overly personal, at that point I am sure you will be on the wrong end of an official warning or a ban, the choice is yours!
#235857
nish2280, and FRAFPDD lets stop this before it gets overly personal, at that point I am sure you will be on the wrong end of an official warning or a ban, the choice is yours!


:yes: come on you guys,
#235866
He is also a driver that as a double world champion was beaten by a rookie hamilton in the same car. Why is that so tricky to remember :P

You should make that question to Uncle Ron, not to me. I know that you, in the deep of your heart, like very much Fernando.

No I dont like him one tiny little bit. And I have no need to speak to Ron to help me remember the facts of 2007.

Oh! Sorry, in that case I was wrong, but I guess you remember Uncle Ron saying they were racing against Alonso, I mean his own driver. In my opinion, McLaren lost a great opportunity for wining another WDC by racing against Alonso, but of course Lewis did a good job, as he always does.
By the way, which is your favorite driver if not Alonso?
#235872
How did a thread about Vettel and merc turn into another fernando/lewis fiasco?

You're new here, aren't you?
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