FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[bud]

yeah Salary cap is alot easier to monitor. Budget crap is going to be a killer! and i can see the accusations flying already!

[myownalias]

I fail to see how the hell the FIA are going to be able to police it effectivly.

anything thats not in the cap for example marketing and promotion, drivers..

all that will happen is they will put R&D, Parts, and Other budget costs down as stuff thats not in the cap.

In otherwords there's gonna be alot of Carbon Fibre needed for "Marketing Purposes"

How do they do it in other sports?

Simple. Other sports are Salary Caps. That means you have X number of athletes, they make Y number of dollars each...done deal, simple math. There are no sponsors giving parts to the teams that have to have values applied to them. Since those parts are one offs, requiring untold millions of dollars in testing etc to produce...how do you value them? In short, there are so many differences between a salary capped NHL hockey for instance and formula one's proposed spending cap that I could spend all day pointing them out. The proof is in the puddin as they say....lets see Max make it work. I'll bet he can't do it.

I remember a while back there being a big furore in football about a salary cap being placed on European football players, which was eventually deemed illegal in European courts and as most F1 teams operate within Europe; I fear that a F1 salary cap will be deemed illegal as well unless that resolution has been removed since!

[headless]

Simple. Other sports are Salary Caps. That means you have X number of athletes, they make Y number of dollars each...done deal, simple math. There are no sponsors giving parts to the teams that have to have values applied to them. Since those parts are one offs, requiring untold millions of dollars in testing etc to produce...how do you value them? In short, there are so many differences between a salary capped NHL hockey for instance and formula one's proposed spending cap that I could spend all day pointing them out. The proof is in the puddin as they say....lets see Max make it work. I'll bet he can't do it.

Celery Caps?

[hipcheck5]

Actually it would be as simple as a salary cap if the rules are written properly. Everything gets approved by the governing body, when it comes to one off parts they get a value placed on them by a committee, etc.

[bud]

Actually it would be as simple as a salary cap if the rules are written properly. Everything gets approved by the governing body, when it comes to one off parts they get a value placed on them by a committee, etc.

each team manufactures majority of their own parts. And they all pay their own employees at their own discretion.

[hipcheck5]

Actually it would be as simple as a salary cap if the rules are written properly. Everything gets approved by the governing body, when it comes to one off parts they get a value placed on them by a committee, etc.

each team manufactures majority of their own parts. And they all pay their own employees at their own discretion.

And the parts are valued by a committee. Employees salaries must be presented in the team budget. Really not very hard to maintain on a basic level. Will teams try to cheat? of course, but then teams try to cheat right now, so what's the difference.

[Chris_0648]

I suggested this somewhere before, can't remember where, but what's so hard for teams to put their annual budget (lets just say £40mil for now) into an account at the start of the season which is observable by an independant body (again, lets just say the FIA) and all payments towards F1 operations have to be made through that account. It'll be pretty obvious if anyone is hiding anything or getting anything on the cheap through a non-existant company. No need for teams to disclose anything out of the F1 business, nor reveal any sources of income. No problem at all surely?

Obviously not perfect but the budget cap is workable. I just think some teams dont want their little exclusive group spoiled, and generally they dont like the way Max runs the show.

On a side note - the free-er tech regs that Max proposed for capped teams, I'd love them to stay.

[darwin dali]

I suggested this somewhere before, can't remember where, but what's so hard for teams to put their annual budget (lets just say £40mil for now) into an account at the start of the season which is observable by an independant body (again, lets just say the FIA) and all payments towards F1 operations have to be made through that account. It'll be pretty obvious if anyone is hiding anything or getting anything on the cheap through a non-existant company. No need for teams to disclose anything out of the F1 business, nor reveal any sources of income. No problem at all surely?

Obviously not perfect but the budget cap is workable. I just think some teams dont want their little exclusive group spoiled, and generally they dont like the way Max runs the show.

On a side note - the free-er tech regs that Max proposed for capped teams, I'd love them to stay.

Intramural payments for labor between different subsidies of a team would be hard to monitor if at all.

[billindenver]

I suggested this somewhere before, can't remember where, but what's so hard for teams to put their annual budget (lets just say £40mil for now) into an account at the start of the season which is observable by an independant body (again, lets just say the FIA) and all payments towards F1 operations have to be made through that account. It'll be pretty obvious if anyone is hiding anything or getting anything on the cheap through a non-existant company. No need for teams to disclose anything out of the F1 business, nor reveal any sources of income. No problem at all surely?

Obviously not perfect but the budget cap is workable. I just think some teams dont want their little exclusive group spoiled, and generally they dont like the way Max runs the show.

On a side note - the free-er tech regs that Max proposed for capped teams, I'd love them to stay.

Intramural payments for labor between different subsidies of a team would be hard to monitor if at all.

You mean freakin impossible. Anyone who has run a company will tell you that tracking employee hours is difficult to do even when you WANT them tracked....attempting to track those hours when the employee and company involved don't want them tracked....impossible. So, I'm assuming there will be a set price per part assumed and labor is free. All of which makes the 'cap' even more ridiculous.

[Il Leone]

Hi, I just joined the forum to ventilate because this cap thing is really pissing me off. F1 is the "creme de la creme", the best of the best (or should be) and teams must be allowed to spend whatever they think is worth while to achieve their goals. If Ferrari wants to spend 450 million, let them. If Wiliams only has 50 million, though luck for them. Do not misunderstand me, I have been and will always be a Williams fan (and F1-fans from the eighties will understand my nick) but fact is that F1 evolved into a racing class where automobile manufacturers rule. If they are willing to spend that kind of money, let them. If they can't, then the budgets will drop again or teams, like Honda, will be replaced.

All in favour to kick Losely's but, say I.

[bud]

good first post there mate! I agree with you.

[Jamie]

I would prefer a two tier F1! f*ck the cap and give us a two tier F1! Which would mean 4 drivers per team, in total it = 52 drivers; all in 'n' all, it will look a little like Indy, but with this it means we can have more drivers and F1 will be more accessible to the younger drivers and won't be as hard to get to Formula 1, Also wages will stick, so $5 Million dollars sounds good

The drivers to enter; McLaren Mercedes Benz - Heikki Out / Paffett In:
My Verdict;
Gary Paffett to me is another lost British talent in which I think McLaren need this boy to jump on board in the winter, do some hardcore aero work, prove his worth and get that set, he would race for $2 Million dollars max! , That should be more than what he's worth at DTM? Right?

Brawn GP - Button Is GONE -
Now this is optimistic but I believe Brawn will not be as competitive next season and good ol Jenny see's this, he will want a new contract with a new team as they won't be able to supply the Brit with a $10 Million Dollars? Maybe McLaren would pay top Dollar? Or even AT&T Williams F1 did we forget they have wanted him for years now?

Brawn Gp - Button out - Senna In -
A good talented driver here to prove himself to the world of motor sport that his uncle was telling the truth and he wants to take his name back to F1 and put himself back on the glory list

USF1 - Marco Andretti -
This is a boy with speed and power! A good career under his belt, not as much Indy success but he has raw talent and pace under his belt! With family support this boy has it all to play for! Racing in Indy and A1 GP surly shows a real hardcore driver? USF1

- Second Seat - Patrick V Scott Speed -
Scott Speed will gain my vote all day everyday, as he has a real bounce back attitude and if anyone feels like reading his profile? Check it out! This boy was badly sick in the beginning of his career and bounced back to claim an F1 seat, now back in the states concentrating on a hardcore racing career, he now could claim the seat at USF1? But then there is the publicity of the first woman to touch base in Indy and also gold in F1? So will they go for Speed and talent or the publicity stunt?

Rosberg - This boy wants a new challenge? He has the lucks and head of a top man? Also with a degree under his belt? Surely he can get the businessman out and secure himself a good seat at a top dog team? Any More? Drop It In!!!

[headless]

MMM.
Dunno.
Celery caps wouldn't work. Well they could but people might not be too happy.

[Jamie]

I would prefer a two tier F1! f*ck the cap and give us a two tier F1! Which would mean 4 drivers per team, in total it = 52 drivers; all in 'n' all, it will look a little like Indy, but with this it means we can have more drivers and F1 will be more accessible to the younger drivers and won't be as hard to get to Formula 1, Also wages will stick, so $5 Million dollars sounds good

The drivers to enter; McLaren Mercedes Benz - Heikki Out / Paffett In:
My Verdict;
Gary Paffett to me is another lost British talent in which I think McLaren need this boy to jump on board in the winter, do some hardcore aero work, prove his worth and get that set, he would race for $2 Million dollars max! , That should be more than what he's worth at DTM? Right?

Brawn GP - Button Is GONE -
Now this is optimistic but I believe Brawn will not be as competitive next season and good ol Jenny see's this, he will want a new contract with a new team as they won't be able to supply the Brit with a $10 Million Dollars? Maybe McLaren would pay top Dollar? Or even AT&T Williams F1 did we forget they have wanted him for years now?

Brawn Gp - Button out - Senna In -
A good talented driver here to prove himself to the world of motor sport that his uncle was telling the truth and he wants to take his name back to F1 and put himself back on the glory list

USF1 - Marco Andretti -
This is a boy with speed and power! A good career under his belt, not as much Indy success but he has raw talent and pace under his belt! With family support this boy has it all to play for! Racing in Indy and A1 GP surly shows a real hardcore driver? USF1

- Second Seat - Patrick V Scott Speed -
Scott Speed will gain my vote all day everyday, as he has a real bounce back attitude and if anyone feels like reading his profile? Check it out! This boy was badly sick in the beginning of his career and bounced back to claim an F1 seat, now back in the states concentrating on a hardcore racing career, he now could claim the seat at USF1? But then there is the publicity of the first woman to touch base in Indy and also gold in F1? So will they go for Speed and talent or the publicity stunt?

Rosberg - This boy wants a new challenge? He has the lucks and head of a top man? Also with a degree under his belt? Surely he can get the businessman out and secure himself a good seat at a top dog team? Any More? Drop It In!!!

[scotty]

^^^ I could see Andretti and Speed at USF1 for various reasons, even if outright skill wouldn't be one of them.

Button won't leave Brawn though, certainly not after this season.