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#97046
I am not saying that he is not a world champion, I am on about if he will become an all time great, not just a champion.

Moss is classed as a great, yet he was never a champion
#97079
People leave Toyota outta this. They actually gained posistions by staying on dry tyres.

The title last year came down to the weather really. Massa and Hamiltion both deserved the title equally. It just came down to a matter of 1 point.

Anyways, I wouldn't say this is make or break for Lewis. I'd say this is the opposite. He's proved he can win the world championship, it's a matter of how many more can he win. It'll be interseting to see him in the mid-feild rather than anything else.


Im not blaming Toyota for that gamble they took, it nearly paid off big time and they had nothing to loose.Clever move. I was just explaining to VB, as he seemed to be unaware of the facts, that they did not stop, they slowed drastically when the tyres lost grip.
#97083
Hamilton has the skill to make Kovalainen (who will have no excuses this forthcoming season) look an amateur. My only concern is he'll see red. If Hamilton doesn't think clearly this season, at the very least he will learn a hell of a lot about racing.


I know what you mean McLaren Fan, he does see red.He sees red not when he knows a car/driver package is faster than him, that just makes him dig deaper. He sees red when he makes a small mistake or circumstances conspire to put him in a lower position than he feels he should or could be. Then he sees red and reacts not always in the best thoughtout way(crashing into the back of Kimi when he lost his easy first place due to the safety car)
Like the guy in Ewman's post said , in F2 he was sublime, he was, I watched him and he was streets ahead of the field in the same car. We've seen this in F1 but not consistantly and yetstill he humbled a double world champion in his rookie year and then won the championship. When the consistency comes he will be formidable. In my opinion he is the most talented driver in the field with the best car control, also one of the bravest. He now has to stop the red mists and show he can lead a team out of trouble then he is up with the greatest - thats Senna, not Schumacher.


I think the points you make are open for argument.
#97085
Hamilton has the skill to make Kovalainen (who will have no excuses this forthcoming season) look an amateur. My only concern is he'll see red. If Hamilton doesn't think clearly this season, at the very least he will learn a hell of a lot about racing.


I know what you mean McLaren Fan, he does see red.He sees red not when he knows a car/driver package is faster than him, that just makes him dig deaper. He sees red when he makes a small mistake or circumstances conspire to put him in a lower position than he feels he should or could be. Then he sees red and reacts not always in the best thoughtout way(crashing into the back of Kimi when he lost his easy first place due to the safety car)
Like the guy in Ewman's post said , in F2 he was sublime, he was, I watched him and he was streets ahead of the field in the same car. We've seen this in F1 but not consistantly and yetstill he humbled a double world champion in his rookie year and then won the championship. When the consistency comes he will be formidable. In my opinion he is the most talented driver in the field with the best car control, also one of the bravest. He now has to stop the red mists and show he can lead a team out of trouble then he is up with the greatest - thats Senna, not Schumacher.


I think the points you make are open for argument.


Oh Im sure you do!
#97087
I see the whole Lewis/McLaren Vs Ferarri love-in is still going strong!

I'd forgotten how much I'd missed it...

2008 was Lewis' make or break year wasn't it? Poor lad can't win... (*might be a continual theme throughout the season)

*Thought I'd get that in incase you thought I'd gone soft. :wink:
#97109
2008 was Lewis' make or break year wasn't it? Poor lad can't win...

Was my point too, just to be clear.
#97132
Make or break? I think that's a bit premature, Hamilton is only 24 and Senna was just making his F1 debut at this age 25 years ago. He has loads of time yet, but I suppose some people today have this strange mentality that as soon as you hit 30 you should be put in a Home and have a pension.


Well, he really needs to do what most of us are expecting and put the car (if it's bad) in places that it shouldn't be. Even being labelled another Villeneuve could be harmful.


Agreed :yes:

I suggested at a parallel between the two on here a looooong time ago and basically got flamed for it, but look where we are now - Villeneuve was forgotten just like that, 5 minutes after people were hailing him as a 'future legend' when he passed Schumacher round the outside! I don't think Hamilton has to prove anything new, just fulfil the 'easy' task of meeting his (sometimes absurd) expectations!

i think he will and it will silence his doubters but for me as a Fan of Mclaren i he just won the championship, what more can you do apart from win more.

i would like to see his doubters silenced though


It's never gonna happen though is it? People still doubt the likes of Prost and Schumacher.... (including me, hah)
#97136
Make or break? I think that's a bit premature, Hamilton is only 24 and Senna was just making his F1 debut at this age 25 years ago. He has loads of time yet, but I suppose some people today have this strange mentality that as soon as you hit 30 you should be put in a Home and have a pension.


Well, he really needs to do what most of us are expecting and put the car (if it's bad) in places that it shouldn't be. Even being labelled another Villeneuve could be harmful.


Agreed :yes:

I suggested at a parallel between the two on here a looooong time ago and basically got flamed for it, but look where we are now - Villeneuve was forgotten just like that, 5 minutes after people were hailing him as a 'future legend' when he passed Schumacher round the outside! I don't think Hamilton has to prove anything new, just fulfil the 'easy' task of meeting his (sometimes absurd) expectations!

i think he will and it will silence his doubters but for me as a Fan of Mclaren i he just won the championship, what more can you do apart from win more.

i would like to see his doubters silenced though


It's never gonna happen though is it? People still doubt the likes of Prost and Schumacher.... (including me, hah)


:rolleyes: Hammy's no Villeneuve! Jacques that is, Guiles is another story. And Hammy won't be "forgotten". Already in the history books and pleny more to come :driving::clap:
#97139

I suggested at a parallel between the two on here a looooong time ago and basically got flamed for it, but look where we are now - Villeneuve was forgotten just like that, 5 minutes after people were hailing him as a 'future legend' when he passed Schumacher round the outside! I don't think Hamilton has to prove anything new, just fulfil the 'easy' task of meeting his (sometimes absurd) expectations!



I think a harder task for any World Champion is to try and defend their title the following year. However, Hamilton's task will always be harder than the average for one reason - He's British. The British Media can be your friend and your enemy all rolled up into one. Such expectations are placed upon Hamilton by the media, even though at this point he does not have the machinery to be World Champion. For those who have no real interest in Formula One, opinion of Hamilton can easily change on briefly seeing that he isn't doing very well. That's the fickle Uk Public for you.

In terms of the users on this board however this isn't the case. We base our opinions on the true facts (or for some blind patriotism).
End of the day Hamilton is a great driver. I have never denied that and believe he has the potential to be one of the greatest. However the same goes for the likes of Vettel and Kubica in my opinion, both of whom have done amazing jobs in cars which were never of the level of Hamilton's. This will be a telling year for Hamilton - but so will every single yar of his career. Face it if he doesn't win the title this year people will labell him along side the likes of JV etc. If he does however people will ask, can he match the likes of Schumacher? The expectations are too high for him sometimes.
#97140

:rolleyes: Hammy's no Villeneuve! Jacques that is, Guiles is another story. And Hammy won't be "forgotten". Already in the history books and pleny more to come :driving::clap:


End of the day, you can't say that. He is in the history books as World Champion, but so is Jacques, so is Nelson Piquet, so is Phil Hill etc etc.
At the end of 97 many believed Jacques was going to go from strength to strength. Although Hamilton will more than likely improve, you cannot be certain.
#97146

:rolleyes: Hammy's no Villeneuve! Jacques that is, Guiles is another story. And Hammy won't be "forgotten". Already in the history books and pleny more to come :driving::clap:


End of the day, you can't say that. He is in the history books as World Champion, but so is Jacques, so is Nelson Piquet, so is Phil Hill etc etc.
At the end of 97 many believed Jacques was going to go from strength to strength. Although Hamilton will more than likely improve, you cannot be certain.


It's a fair point, although I'll reiterate Lewis does get a raw deal with most people.

Hamilton by all accounts isn't going to have a great car this year. Villeneuve didn't in 98 and he wilted. I'm almost certain Hamilton wont wilt like Jacques but it's a new challenge and we'll get to see how good he really is without the tools (assuming the car is a 'disappointment')

Alonso last year for example was magnificent in a mediocre Renault. I'm not saying he's better than Schumacher but when you consider that the latter only won one race in 2005 you begin to see what a great job Alonso did in 08. Hamilton is going to need to be similarly solid and consistent. My one problem with Alonso was that I thought he never seemed to like it when things were'nt going his way and moaned rather than knuckled down. He totally blew that theory out of the water last year. I percieve Hamilton to have similar problems so he's going to have to do the same.

I'd still say he's 'made it' though, and his achievements are quite incredible.
#97147

I suggested at a parallel between the two on here a looooong time ago and basically got flamed for it, but look where we are now - Villeneuve was forgotten just like that, 5 minutes after people were hailing him as a 'future legend' when he passed Schumacher round the outside! I don't think Hamilton has to prove anything new, just fulfil the 'easy' task of meeting his (sometimes absurd) expectations!



I think a harder task for any World Champion is to try and defend their title the following year. However, Hamilton's task will always be harder than the average for one reason - He's British. The British Media can be your friend and your enemy all rolled up into one. Such expectations are placed upon Hamilton by the media, even though at this point he does not have the machinery to be World Champion. For those who have no real interest in Formula One, opinion of Hamilton can easily change on briefly seeing that he isn't doing very well. That's the fickle Uk Public for you.

In terms of the users on this board however this isn't the case. We base our opinions on the true facts (or for some blind patriotism).
End of the day Hamilton is a great driver. I have never denied that and believe he has the potential to be one of the greatest. However the same goes for the likes of Vettel and Kubica in my opinion, both of whom have done amazing jobs in cars which were never of the level of Hamilton's. This will be a telling year for Hamilton - but so will every single yar of his career. Face it if he doesn't win the title this year people will labell him along side the likes of JV etc. If he does however people will ask, can he match the likes of Schumacher? The expectations are too high for him sometimes.


The British media have been on his case since he entered F1 but it didnt stop him winning the championship, its something he has to accept and deal with. If he doesnt win this year it no way means he's a JV. There's way more involoved in greatness than winning championships(Moss). Though of course championships do help.
Im interested to see how he performs in an off the pace car and how he helps develop it. Having said that if the McLaren somehow is on the pace that would be great, cos then he could get another championship and then people would have to say ...2010, it will be make or break for Lewis"
#97150

:rolleyes: Hammy's no Villeneuve! Jacques that is, Guiles is another story. And Hammy won't be "forgotten". Already in the history books and pleny more to come :driving::clap:


End of the day, you can't say that. He is in the history books as World Champion, but so is Jacques, so is Nelson Piquet, so is Phil Hill etc etc.
At the end of 97 many believed Jacques was going to go from strength to strength. Although Hamilton will more than likely improve, you cannot be certain.


I can say that. Read my signature.
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