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[bud]

na mate you keep fishing im an athiest i think all religious people are mindless lambs
that doesnt change the meaning of my post...... caught up in the hysteria YOUR CITY key word.....

gee gotta be careful around you dont i, what ever i say its either racist as well isnt it? i think youve been abused too much growing up mate you need to get over it already!!

Insecure CHILD

Where is that picture of you again

answer my question above you big man you

[Fact Man]

I personnaly don't have problem with team orders and I do believe that all teams have them.

Also, I don't have an issue with wether or not McLaren has team orders or not.

What I hate the most is when HK let LH pass him so easily that it was obvious.

If HK wants LH to pass, it's fine with me because he knows LH was faster but for us the fans we don't like to be cheated.

At least put on some "show" with a little fight and then let him by. I'll buy that more and it'll be more fun to see some racing between the 2 McLarens. That's all...

[Big Azza]

What the ...?

I just don't get this. If you can't slow down for your team mate, then what is the whole point of having a team. Seriously? I try some sick team manouvers on F106. Consider this situation:

Teammate is in title contention. So I deliberately slow down the rest of the field and give my team mate a considerable advantage, before I start speeding up. Damage done to the rest of the field, advantage Team.... (I can't say, because I really don't like the drivers for McLaren.)

But back to my point before, can anyone tell me, what is the whole point of having a team in Formula one, if you aren't allowed to help your team mate out. If McLaren, Ferrari, or any other team for that matter of fact wants to win a constructor's championship, then they should be allowed to do whatever it takes to create an optimal scenario that will benefit them. This rule by the FIA, which I've only found out about after reading this thread, makes absolutely no sense at all. If that's the case, then f**k the constructors championship, f**k the concept of teams, and lets have 22 different teams - one for each driver. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

That said however, Hamilton was always going to overtake Kovaleinen. I don't care how much it sucks that Massa didn't finish better. You guys are just finding excuses to cover up the fact that Ferrari had another s**t race, and you guys will bend the rules, until Ferrari benefit. We all do it!

What do you honestly expect from the situation!!!??? Do you want to see Hamilton shove Kovaleinen off the road, just as he did to Massa!? So, a team's two drivers have to have a wheel-on-wheel duel for about half a lap before it's acceptable for one of them to pass!? We would have 2 cars with a DNF!!! Come to a realisation that Ferrari have finally come to first Mini S**t Streak in like a decade. The problem is with Ferrari, not the other 18 drivers/ 9 constructors. And it's certainly not McLaren's fault, that Ferrari are second best right now.

Kovaleinen was always slower than Hamilton. Hamilton was always going to overtake, and Hamilton was always going to win. True, if Kovaleinen had've held off Hamilton for the rest of the race, then Massa would've finished better, and Hamilton wouldn't be leading. But come on! He deserves it! McLaren deserve to win something for once.

[texasmr2]

I just wanna say you both rock! Mikep99 I like that you have the conviction's that bud doe's so you two are actually very much alike.
Now concerning bud OH GOD where do I start? No seriously mate your probably my favorite member because you are YOU! There is no other forum member I'm looking forward to meeting and partying with next year more than you, sorry Hannah and racechick , so please dont take our arguement's on the forum as anything other than what they are, a difference of opinion.

[bud]

I just wanna say you both rock! Mikep99 I like that you have the conviction's that bud doe's so you two are actually very much alike.
Now concerning bud OH GOD where do I start? No seriously mate your probably my favorite member because you are YOU! There is no other forum member I'm looking forward to meeting and partying with next year more than you, sorry Hannah and racechick , so please dont take our arguement's on the forum as anything other than what they are, a difference of opinion.

I dont care i dont take any insults to heart, i come here for the arguments its boring when everyone concurs

[Mikep99]

so Mike if McLaren prevented Heikki from winning why did he not finish second??

You truly are way off the point mate.
Where did you get that anyone implied that Hammy won because Heikki gifted it to him.

We all know why Heikki moved over don't we bud
Imagine if Heikki made him fight for it & wasted his time.
Would he have caught Massa - probably
Would he have caught Nelson - Maybe - probably

Get it mate, he didnt need to worry about Heikki coming into the equation. Simple mateeeeeeee

End for me mate I am sick of

[madbrad]

There's no rule forbidding a driver to let his teammate pass. There's only the rule forbidding his team to tell him to do it. The radio communication apparently was carefully worded so they can say they never gave him any order. It was all Heike's idea!

[bud]

If you admit he would have passed him then what is the point of holding hammy up?

i have no problem with these team orders what i have a problem with is when one guy is capable of being infront of his team mate by merit but is told to move aside.
this did not happen in Germany Heikki did not have Lewis' pace Heikki new this and did the team thing after being told so. Ofcourse Ron telling Heikki Lewis is faster is code word for move over but all teams use this. and again it is different to the above example i gave.

If Heikki was lapping the same as Lewis and told to move over then i would agree with you. but it wasnt the case and i wont agree with you.



whats wrong with i think it feels good Mike i do it alot on here

[Big Azza]

I just wanna say you both rock! Mikep99 I like that you have the conviction's that bud doe's so you two are actually very much alike.
Now concerning bud OH GOD where do I start? No seriously mate your probably my favorite member because you are YOU! There is no other forum member I'm looking forward to meeting and partying with next year more than you, sorry Hannah and racechick , so please dont take our arguement's on the forum as anything other than what they are, a difference of opinion.

If only you were here with the pilgrims marching outside my office all week, we could have had a beer together.

OOOO-OOHHHHHH -

I'd like to have a beer with Texas
Texas M R 2
We'd drink in the town and country
Everything is GREAT!
I'd like to have a beer with Texas
Cos Texas' me mate!


Slim Dusty you legend.

[Big Azza]

Even though I didn't get one mention in your post.

[texasmr2]

I dont care i dont take any insults to heart, i come here for the arguments its boring when everyone concurs

Man I dont really know how to reply to that without being judgemental and frankly disappointed. I guess your are a vicious drunk so that mean's your not sleeping in my tent mister, unless you score us some trim! Oh snap did I just say that out loud!!!!

[F1racer]

Do you want to see Hamilton shove Kovaleinen off the road, just as he did to Massa!? So, a team's two drivers have to have a wheel-on-wheel duel for about half a lap before it's acceptable for one of them to pass!?

Isn't that what Whitmarsh and Dennis promise us every year? Along with some back handed statement about how they can't see why anyone would run a team any other way?

The point here is that Mclaren lies through thier teeth about using team orders...then they have the audacity to say that Hiekki made the decision to pull over on his own...

What a pile of steaming, stinking, horse dung.

[darwin dali]

Do you want to see Hamilton shove Kovaleinen off the road, just as he did to Massa!? So, a team's two drivers have to have a wheel-on-wheel duel for about half a lap before it's acceptable for one of them to pass!?

Isn't that what Whitmarsh and Dennis promise us every year? Along with some back handed statement about how they can't see why anyone would run a team any other way?

The point here is that Mclaren lies through thier teeth about using team orders...then they have the audacity to say that Hiekki made the decision to pull over on his own...

What a pile of steaming, stinking, horse dung.

Yup, it's called hypocrisy,

[bmwpower]

hammy wrote:

But back to my point before, can anyone tell me, what is the whole point of having a team in Formula one, if you aren't allowed to help your team mate out. If McLaren, Ferrari, or any other team for that matter of fact wants to win a constructor's championship, then they should be allowed to do whatever it takes to create an optimal scenario that will benefit them. This rule by the FIA, which I've only found out about after reading this thread, makes absolutely no sense at all. If that's the case, then f**k the constructors championship, f**k the concept of teams, and lets have 22 different teams - one for each driver. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

That said however, Hamilton was always going to overtake Kovaleinen. I don't care how much it sucks that Massa didn't finish better. You guys are just finding excuses to cover up the fact that Ferrari had another s**t race, and you guys will bend the rules, until Ferrari benefit. We all do it!

Hammy I agreed with what you said about teammates, but teams have teammates to push each other because every F1 driver will tell you, the first person to beat is your teammate. Second, I know there's a lot of rubbish that was written on this thread and some rubbish was even censored for various reasons but the majority sentiment from this thread and you even stated from this quote

then they should be allowed to do whatever it takes to create an optimal scenario that will benefit them

, the question was asked that Ferrari has used this tactic for years and everyone tried to burn them for it, then it was pointed out that McLaren (Heikki) did the same thing (and I have no problem with teams doing this) all of a sudden a few McLaren fans got very defensive and even childish. Like I said I have no problems with teams doing this, BMW used this a couple of races ago with Heidfeld (15th) and Kubica lapping him, Kubica got a nice tow down the straights from Heidfeld. I think what most people have a problem is that Heikki was in fourth, Massa 3rd, Nelson 2nd and Heidfeld 1st, Heikki just pulled to the side of the hairpin and just admited defeat and let LH storm down the field and changed the outcome. Now was that good for the team, yes, was that good for Heiiki, no because it just said you don't the balls or the will to beat your teammate and that was the first rule of a F1 driver, first person to beat is your teammate.

[bud]

again i dont think youre being fair to Heikki, his tyres were 10 laps older than Lewis' and was lapping 5 tenths to even 1 second slower than Lewis. He knew the inevitable and being team mates did Lewis a favour and made plenty of room for Lewis' pass.

Heikki is allowed to race Lewis, good example is at the start of Britain they banged wheels and were fighting for position.