- 26 Jul 14, 01:54#409976
I said something to this end somewhere else. It's a battle worthy of a championship. If the second half of the season pans out in a similar vein to the first, it would have been more greatly deserved by Hamilton than Nico.
And whilst you're mentioning Senna there's something he said in 1990 which rings true with me should Nico win:
"In each year every sport has its champion. But the champion is not always real, respected and admired, acknowledged by everybody. On the contrary: often the champion is a champion without victories, without merit and fight. Look, if a team like McLaren dominates the World Championship then only two drivers have a chance for victory. But victory is worth a lot more if you achieve that by your own strenght, not because others made mistakes – because your opponents crashed or something. I like to take my wins in the former method, I consider only that as a real victory."
So he's saying championships can be won by more than one route, and depending on that route, that's how we should judge it, not just facts and figures. I also think legacies are built over a career, and that we may come to see Hamilton like Moss or Mansell, great drivers who for whatever reason didn't clinch the titles they deserved, rather than lesser ranked simply because they have less crowns than Vettel or Piquet.
So, WB, as an add-on to that, (and I know you didn't address me directly* but your snipes seem to follow cookie's posts around like a bad smell. If it's not me you're addresing, it's invisible ghosts, so you're then just chiming in with a pointless point) this is how I will see things, in an adult like context. I see the big picture of Hamilton's talent. I've never said I didn't support him or I'm here to bring him down. If he wins, like when Mansell won, it will be for all the previous near misses as much as for this season. He's owed one, but it doesn't work like that unfortunately. And if he misses out by a whisker it won't be too much of a stretch to say where he fell down and it wasn't all bad luck. I just call it as I see it, someone who has followed the sport long enough, and garnered enough knowledge not be dictated to on whether I'm right or wrong with people who see the world diifferently.
* i re-read WB's post and you were talking about me, sorry, just not to me, like if you use a different personal pronoun I won't notice you're still talking to me. It's like pretending I'm not in the room when I am. Have you seen somebody do that in real life? Not a good look.
Also his legend will be mightly boosted by a hard fought battle and will elevate his 2 WDCs with 2 teams above Sebs uncontested 4 and Alonsos uncontested 2
And best of all, everyone expecting/hoping he gets beaten by their fave Nico, will have burnt the bridges to use the detraction of 'he had the best car, my mom coulda won in that car'
And of course there is next year to come, hopefully with another team closer enough to widen the difference between the two.
Sennas legend is largely due to showing on track how musch faster than Prost he was despite Prost beating him one year and running his close the other mostly due to dnfs etc
As the wise boxing promoter said to the hot shot boxer - 'son, dont tell me what you won, tell me who you beat'
I said something to this end somewhere else. It's a battle worthy of a championship. If the second half of the season pans out in a similar vein to the first, it would have been more greatly deserved by Hamilton than Nico.
And whilst you're mentioning Senna there's something he said in 1990 which rings true with me should Nico win:
"In each year every sport has its champion. But the champion is not always real, respected and admired, acknowledged by everybody. On the contrary: often the champion is a champion without victories, without merit and fight. Look, if a team like McLaren dominates the World Championship then only two drivers have a chance for victory. But victory is worth a lot more if you achieve that by your own strenght, not because others made mistakes – because your opponents crashed or something. I like to take my wins in the former method, I consider only that as a real victory."
So he's saying championships can be won by more than one route, and depending on that route, that's how we should judge it, not just facts and figures. I also think legacies are built over a career, and that we may come to see Hamilton like Moss or Mansell, great drivers who for whatever reason didn't clinch the titles they deserved, rather than lesser ranked simply because they have less crowns than Vettel or Piquet.
So, WB, as an add-on to that, (and I know you didn't address me directly* but your snipes seem to follow cookie's posts around like a bad smell. If it's not me you're addresing, it's invisible ghosts, so you're then just chiming in with a pointless point) this is how I will see things, in an adult like context. I see the big picture of Hamilton's talent. I've never said I didn't support him or I'm here to bring him down. If he wins, like when Mansell won, it will be for all the previous near misses as much as for this season. He's owed one, but it doesn't work like that unfortunately. And if he misses out by a whisker it won't be too much of a stretch to say where he fell down and it wasn't all bad luck. I just call it as I see it, someone who has followed the sport long enough, and garnered enough knowledge not be dictated to on whether I'm right or wrong with people who see the world diifferently.
* i re-read WB's post and you were talking about me, sorry, just not to me, like if you use a different personal pronoun I won't notice you're still talking to me. It's like pretending I'm not in the room when I am. Have you seen somebody do that in real life? Not a good look.
Last edited by Roth on 26 Jul 14, 02:24, edited 1 time in total.
Fascinating reads!! 
is claiming that Lewis was mentally weaker than his team mate and has always suffered from that weakness directly impacting his results over the years.