FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[LewEngBridewell]

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Troublemakers? Trade Unions strive for better pay for workers, more jobs, the maintenance of a respectable image for the trade in question, and more importantly, better working conditions.

Totally disagree with you there. But it always seemed evident that we are polar opposites when it comes to politics.

[1Lemon]

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Troublemakers? Trade Unions strive for better pay for workers, more jobs, the maintenance of a respectable image for the trade in question, and more importantly, better working conditions.

Totally disagree with you there. But it always seemed evident that we are polar opposites when it comes to politics.

And plenty of cash in the pockets of the union leaders who were basically exploiting the very people they are there to protect for political gain. Still that's something that goes on now and will never be stamped out fron Unions.

[LewEngBridewell]

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Troublemakers? Trade Unions strive for better pay for workers, more jobs, the maintenance of a respectable image for the trade in question, and more importantly, better working conditions.

Totally disagree with you there. But it always seemed evident that we are polar opposites when it comes to politics.

And plenty of cash in the pockets of the union leaders who were basically exploiting the very people they are there to protect for political gain. Still that's something that goes on now and will never be stamped out fron Unions.

Such are the fortunes of the proletariat.

[What's Burning?]

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Troublemakers? Trade Unions strive for better pay for workers, more jobs, the maintenance of a respectable image for the trade in question, and more importantly, better working conditions.

Totally disagree with you there. But it always seemed evident that we are polar opposites when it comes to politics.

And plenty of cash in the pockets of the union leaders who were basically exploiting the very people they are there to protect for political gain. Still that's something that goes on now and will never be stamped out fron Unions.

because corporate lobbyists don't line the pockets of politicians.

We're all free to make out own political decision, but to say this is a black and white thing is simply the wrong way forward and often time it's the unwillingness to compromise that leads to a deterioration and polarization as is obvious with Thatcher. What makes an elected politician that's supposed to be serving their constituency abusing their power any different than the union leaders you're so against?

[andrew]

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Unions can be good but can hold a country to ransom duckling up finances when the job naturally is non profitable

The mines are a prime example of this. Fact is they were not profitable enough and were already being heavily bailed out by the tax payer meaning that spending was being diverted from where it should really be.

I can understand people hating her if they are directly effected, what I dislike is hippie students jumping on the bandwagon (i hate hippie hypocrisy) and those with no reason

I agree. All these clips of students jumping on pictures of her celebrating her death, it's not right. They Weren't even alive, just hippies who heard that she privatised things and get all angry.

It's the hypocrisy that gets me. How is the education funded etc etc

It's all about being in the trendy crowd. The truth or the policies don't matter. It's cool to bash the right.

She wasn't scared to take on the far too powerfull Unions who were, and still are, nothing more than a bunch of troublemakers.

Troublemakers? Trade Unions strive for better pay for workers, more jobs, the maintenance of a respectable image for the trade in question, and more importantly, better working conditions.

Totally disagree with you there. But it always seemed evident that we are polar opposites when it comes to politics.

Unions hide behind a facade of noble intentions whilst the union leaders get richer and the workers get nothing. Unions have never been able to get the simple fact - money cannot be made to spontaneously materialise without something suffering. This was the situation during the late 70's, early 80's but trouble making, self serving, idiots like Arthur Scargill couldn't and still can't understand this. Maybe he and his ilk would have been happier having a crumbling infrastructure and outdated hospitals as long as there was a coal mine in every town.

[zurich_allan]

I think people comparing her to Hitler is pretty disgusting in regards to the war crimes

Tbh i think she did what needed to be done

I can understand people hating her if they are directly effected, what I dislike is hippie students jumping on the bandwagon (i hate hippie hypocrisy) and those with no reason

People need someone to blame and it is fashionable to hate her

Personally I believe she did what needed doing

Really? You want to go there? Then let us.

Margaret Thatcher had blood on her hands and was directly and indirectly responsible for many deaths, intolerance, racism, homphobia and many other disgusting and unacceptable traits that are not acceptable in any modern society.

You're right - it's quite clear than many only know the basics they have picked up in passing or from the mass media. On the other hand, there will be others who know a lot more detail having knwledge that stems back far before the past week.

So back to the death and injustice linked to good old Maggie then?:

Start with Section 28 - banning any notion that homosexuality was an acceptable lifestyle. Enacted in 1988 - not 1888. Disgusting and unaceptable.

Then move on to her personal friendship and support for General Pinochet - who oversaw the death and incarceration of over a hundred thousand of his political opponents during his tenure.

Take it further and discuss the Hillsborough cover-up where hundreds of parents, friends and relatives are still waiting for answers that she knew but refused to divulge - some details only now beginning to trickle through, over 2 decades later.

Then there is the literal murder of over 300 members of crew and civilans onboard the Belgrano as it was sailing away from the exclusion zone during the Falklands war - when she ordered it destroyed in spite of expert advice not to do so.

And, for now, finally as I think I've made my point, her active support of apartheid in South Africa when it was at its height (including very real terrorist action and political murdering under the regime of the time).

All of the above true, and all of it completely unacceptable regardless of anybody's right or left wing tendancies in any modern society. And make no mistake, it was certainly not acceptable during the 1980's - the majority of her reign.

As I say - real blood and deaths on her hands, well into the hundreds of thousands.

[LewEngBridewell]

Well said, ZA

[andrew]

I think people comparing her to Hitler is pretty disgusting in regards to the war crimes

Tbh i think she did what needed to be done

I can understand people hating her if they are directly effected, what I dislike is hippie students jumping on the bandwagon (i hate hippie hypocrisy) and those with no reason

People need someone to blame and it is fashionable to hate her

Personally I believe she did what needed doing

Really? You want to go there? Then let us.

So how many holocausts did Magaret Thatcher cause? Who committed some of the worst human rights offenses known to humankind? Who was heel bent on world domination at any cost? Etc etc etc.

Start with Section 28 - banning any notion that homosexuality was an acceptable lifestyle. Enacted in 1988 - not 1888. Disgusting and unaceptable.

But this was not rectified until 2000 in Scotland (2003 in the rest of the UK) so you need to condemn John Major and Tony Blair for not doing something sooner rather than being selective to suit your own personnal agenda. Plus, homosexuality was illeagal until 1967 and thereafter frowned upon to an extent so where is your condemnation of the Primeministers who were in power during these times?

Then move on to her personal friendship and support for General Pinochet - who oversaw the death and incarceration of over a hundred thousand of his political opponents during his tenure.

I take it you're ok with Tony Blair being pals with George Bush and supporting his illegal wars?

Then there is the literal murder of over 300 members of crew and civilans onboard the Belgrano as it was sailing away from the exclusion zone during the Falklands war - when she ordered it destroyed in spite of expert advice not to do so.

Tell me how many peoples blood is on the hands of Tony Blair after his support of an illegal and needless war?

And, for now, finally as I think I've made my point, her active support of apartheid in South Africa when it was at its height (including very real terrorist action and political murdering under the regime of the time).

I don't think she actively supported it. I see no evidence of that.

All of the above true, and all of it completely unacceptable regardless of anybody's right or left wing tendancies in any modern society. And make no mistake, it was certainly not acceptable during the 1980's - the majority of her reign.

All of the above is opinions based on the interpretation of events. I wouldn't say facts as it is clear you do not have an open mind here. Fact is she did a lot of good for the UK, which would have been in a far worse place than it is now if it wasn't for someone having the courage to make a lot of difficult and unpopular decisions that had to be made.

As I say - real blood and deaths on her hands, well into the hundreds of thousands.

No more than Tony Blair. In fact, probably less!

[1Lemon]

Then there is the literal murder of over 300 members of crew and civilans onboard the Belgrano as it was sailing away from the exclusion zone during the Falklands war - when she ordered it destroyed in spite of expert advice not to do so.

And what would we be saying today if she didn't sink the Belgrano and it went around and sunk a British ship a few days later, people would be screaming out "She didn't act when she had the chance!". Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[LewEngBridewell]

andrew, you keep bringing things back to Tony Blair and Labour. You do that with me as well.

Why are you under the assumption that those of us who despise Conservatism absolutely adore Labour and Tony Blair? I can't speak for ZA, but I certainly don't! New Labour may as well be centre-right these days!

[andrew]

andrew, you keep bringing things back to Tony Blair and Labour. You do that with me as well.

Why are you under the assumption that those of us who despise Conservatism absolutely adore Labour and Tony Blair? I can't speak for ZA, but I certainly don't! New Labour may as well be centre-right these days!

It seems fair, especially as you are condemning acts done by Margaret Thatcher that have been done to a far worse extent by Tony Blair.

Poor grammer i know, but I'm knackered so there!

[LewEngBridewell]

andrew, you keep bringing things back to Tony Blair and Labour. You do that with me as well.

Why are you under the assumption that those of us who despise Conservatism absolutely adore Labour and Tony Blair? I can't speak for ZA, but I certainly don't! New Labour may as well be centre-right these days!

It seems fair, especially as you are condemning acts done by Margaret Thatcher that have been done to a far worse extent by Tony Blair.

Poor grammer i know, but I'm knackered so there!

Meh, that's just defending one jerk, by comparing them to another.

Yeah I'm knackered too....

[andrew]

I'm not defending a jerk.

As you know, I don't vote due to the wishy-washy useless self serving inept breed of politicians we have today who seem unable to actually achieve anything and are seemingly determined to send us all back to the dark ages (though I might make the effort during the Scottish referendum to try and stop yon numpty from sending us all to the poorhouse). Someone like Margaret Thatcher in the next election would make me want to vote.

[1Lemon]

I'm not defending a jerk.

As you know, I don't vote due to the wishy-washy useless self serving inept breed of politicians we have today who seem unable to actually achieve anything and are seemingly determined to send us all back to the dark ages (though I might make the effort during the Scottish referendum to try and stop yon numpty from sending us all to the poorhouse). Someone like Margaret Thatcher in the next election would make me want to vote.

To be fair I'd vote for anyone with the balls, determination, and unselfish qualities of Thatcher regardless of political standing. Well maybe except the really extreme political parties.

[bud]

Please vote NO in the Scottish independence referendum Andy!