FORUMula1.com

[What's Burning?]

You guys don't want to end this weekend on the forum early. So let's cut the tell tale signs out now.

[FerrariFan63]

Personally I think Hulkenberg would be a safer bet in that I'm sure he would be a good solid driver. But Perez is the kind of driver that could possibly surprise, similar to how Alonso did when he was hired by Renault. But he could also be a bad bet, one of the drivers that can look impressive in a mid-field team, but be disappointing in a top team. Like Heinz-Harald Frentzen.

[bud]

Where do you come up with this crap mate?

well well well! from under a certain stone crawls out a great reductionist counter argument
well thought out, well reasoned and impressive contribution to the thread

a bit like the McLaren approach to problem solving

You just don't get it, there really is no point in rebutting a post full of bullpoo. And every post you make is something negative with one sided views (not facts) about McLaren.
You Lewis fans really have shown your colours of late, you all have little or no respect for any driver on the grid other than Lewis, you bag one of the greatest teams in the history of the sport like you could do better. Ultimately I think you're all sour folk and sooner Lewis leaves and is battling in the midfield the sooner his so called fans will shut up!!

[CookinFlat6]

yup continue to play the man instead of playing the ball

wheres your argument mate?

Try expressing yourself instead of criticising those with the gumption to formulate theories and opinions

How do you see Button and Perez qualifying next year and challenging? would Hulkenberg have beEN a better choice seeing as he has balls and raw pace?

dont worry andrew will be along to back you up

[andrew]

Truth is, McLaren are one of the most successful teams on the grid. Fact is they've won 25% of all the races they've entered. Only Ferrari have a higher win rate of just under 26%. Red Bull have won 23% of all the races they've entered and Williams 19%. All teams go through a rough patch/dry spell (call it what you like) with not too much success - Ferrari's lasted 16 years (constructors) and 21 years (drivers).

I back up Bud with this discussion 'cos I agree with what he's saying.

[CookinFlat6]

[racechick]

Timing is a wonderful thing

McLaren have achieved some great things in Motorsport, there's no denying that. And whatever folk think of Ron, you can't take away from him all he's built up . But we're talking about now. About the last few years and the next few years. Whitmarsh has done nothing to show me he is a visionary that can move McLaren forward. he's mismanaged one of the greatest talents in the sport, and has in fact said himself this weekend that McLaren, are risk averse and that being risk averse suits their image/clients. I find that statement very damning coming from the manager of one of the most successful teams in F1. They wouldn't have had the success they've had in the past if they'd been risk averse. I mean, if you're risk averse don't run a Formula 1 racing team. Maybe Lewis didn't suit the image, he certainly isn't risk averse.

And Bud I have huge respect for the vast majority of drivers on the grid. Huge respect. Despite being a Lewis fan and liking him the best.


Just realised I should probably have posted that in the straight McLaren thread rather than here, but it sort of followed a line of argument. I guess the threads are similar. I' ll try to think of something to say about Perez v Hulk

[CookinFlat6]

I have respect for Perez, Kimi, Alonso, Hulk, Seb. Lewis

Dont have respect for whinging politicking drivers or fans

I have raced cars on track at speeds where mistakes become a very big issue

For me driving fast is not like running the 100 meters like Usain Bolt where you can physically do it or not. Its more a mental issue, in identical cars the faster driver is the one prepared to suspend that fear that by continuing to keep your foot planted, the car could break, or you could spin off etc etc

fast drivers are braver than slow drivers, end of

For a slow politicking driver to be favoured is an abomination, and for fans who exhibit the 'Status Quo' bias and have the nerve to criticise those with the balls to question things is also an abomination

I get more out of watching the way Lewis took that car around the circuit today, late braking, 'flicking' it round the corners than I get out of watching a driver win a race with a car 2 seconds faster than everyone else

I seethe at the way the kid has had to fight hard every step of the way to be able to produce drives like today, compared to other spoilt pampered useless lazy drivers, and I seethe at the attitudes and ignorance shown towards a driver that any racing fan understands is as rare as they come

finally I despise those who hide behind their ' holier than thou' personas and snipe at players before ducking back under cover and I even more despise the buttom kissers who follow them

[Denthúl]

I seethe at the way the kid has had to fight hard every step of the way to be able to produce drives like today, compared to other spoilt pampered useless lazy drivers, and I seethe at the attitudes and ignorance shown towards a driver that any racing fan understands is as rare as they come

When you think back to Hamilton's entry into the world of F1, this is pretty funny.

[CookinFlat6]

I seethe at the way the kid has had to fight hard every step of the way to be able to produce drives like today, compared to other spoilt pampered useless lazy drivers, and I seethe at the attitudes and ignorance shown towards a driver that any racing fan understands is as rare as they come

When you think back to Hamilton's entry into the world of F1, this is pretty funny.

Yes lets think back to Hamilton's entry into the world of F1 without the usual attitudes and ignorance

How many other rookie F1 drivers have had to win every single series on their way into F1?
Compared to Button or Vettel, even after winning everything else, how old was he when he entered F1?
He was kicked off the young driver programme by Whitmarsh as he objected to being held back
He was only given a shot at Mclaren as there was no one else available, PDR was almost given the seat

So there you have it, the same ignorant attitudes, like he was handed a seat without having to fight every step of the way, like he didnt then have to almost win in his rookie year to retain the seat

Or maybe you have some info to back up what you find funny? pray enlighten us with facts, no smilies or one line retorts

[Hammer278]

I seethe at the way the kid has had to fight hard every step of the way to be able to produce drives like today, compared to other spoilt pampered useless lazy drivers, and I seethe at the attitudes and ignorance shown towards a driver that any racing fan understands is as rare as they come

When you think back to Hamilton's entry into the world of F1, this is pretty funny.

You mean his dad who had to work more than 2 jobs to help Lewis get into racing? Doesn't sound like Lewis was transported from his mansion to the kart track in a limo to me?

Or are you talking about his McLaren backing which came a bit later? Damn straight, if you're that good at what you do you deserve the damn backing and he repaid them in full - took F1 by storm during his rookie year and gave them a World Championship in his 2nd year.

If you worked your a&se of for a few years and knew you were a serious talent, and a giant backer comes to you and asks if you need help, what do you say? No, f**k off? Jeez, who gives a crap about all his pre-F1 stories anyway, its NOW we are talking about and how he keeps getting screwed by a faded version of a once great team over and over again. Anyway, it's all almost over thankfully for both McLaren and Lewis fans.

[andrew]

I seethe at the way the kid has had to fight hard every step of the way to be able to produce drives like today, compared to other spoilt pampered useless lazy drivers, and I seethe at the attitudes and ignorance shown towards a driver that any racing fan understands is as rare as they come

When you think back to Hamilton's entry into the world of F1, this is pretty funny.

There are not too many drivers who have been groomed/developed by a leading F1 team since they were 13 years old, that is a fact. I'm not saying it's a good or a bad thing but I do think it'll be something we will see more of in years to come as more teams extend their driver development schemes.

[racechick]

I think they're cutting them Andrew, due to finance..........which is a big shame. Talent will be lost.

[andrew]

I wonder how true talent managed before driver development schemes?

[racechick]

A lot didn't. Rich daddies. It was a rich mans sport .
Tommy Byrne? There's a story. Said to be faster than Ayrton but pissed off Ron Dennis. Long story but very interesting.