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[CookinFlat6]

So if a driver gambles heavily on setup and royally screws up mostly (I am dazed and confused) and then gets lucky once he is now a great driver?

One race where everything falls into place vs many many where he comes last and is unable to best a Caterham and we bust our arms clapping him on the back?

So lets see how the great driver that is Button handles the pressure of his home race (clue = he hasnt managed to in 12 years)

[vaptin]

So if a driver gambles heavily on setup and royally screws up mostly (I am dazed and confused) and then gets lucky once he is now a great driver?

One race where everything falls into place vs many many where he comes last and is unable to best a Caterham and we bust our arms clapping him on the back?

So lets see how the great driver that is Button handles the pressure of his home race (clue = he hasnt managed to in 12 years)

I specifically said I didn't think he was a great driver, but in that race I do give him a lot of credit. I'll respond to the rest of your post at the end, I don't know why I'm bothering too though.

I'm not claiming he'll do great in Sliverstone or is a great F1 driver, I just thought credit was due for his performance in Canada, I really enjoyed watching him in that race, especially as we were held in the grip of Vettel dominance.

Well, you think credit is due while some others think he won based on the fact that he knocked out his teammate, and Fernando, and nobody else were really capable of challenging him since the McLaren was the second fastest car after the Redbull then...and Sebastian was having trouble since he wasn't on a wet setup. So credit to Button for picking a wet setup and crashing out 2 competitors to help him to victory then.

He made up loads of positions in that race, considering how fast he was at the end, I can't say and I don't see how you can whether Alonso and Lewis retiring would have made much of a difference.

I don't know about Vettel having trouble, he was comfortably in the lead for most of the race.

The race also has it's own wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_Grand_Prix.

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Where are the many races where he comes last and was unable to beat a Caterham? I'm not sure he royally screws up mostly either, are you basing this on his career as a whole? Or just this years patch of poor form? If your simply taking into account his recent performances, you could probably apply the same to Lewis last year then.

[CookinFlat6]

Lewis has had many great races and few stinkers

Button has had many stinkers and a few great races

But to many Buttons one great race confirms his greatness, the nature of his stinkers although a world part from Lewis' (who gets lapped by his teammate in normal race?)

All these F1 drivers are capable of doing what Button did that day in the car, its just that only a few can do it consistently.

Button has said he is going for the win this weekend, lets watch for signs of greatness

[vaptin]

How do you work out many stinkers? He's generally been fairly solid given the cars he's been driving.

He's not performed that well this season no, but I think it's unfair to discount his two good years with McLaren and question his place in the team.

[What's Burning?]

He made up loads of positions in that race, considering how fast he was at the end, I can't say and I don't see how you can whether Alonso and Lewis retiring would have made much of a difference.

I don't know about Vettel having trouble, he was comfortably in the lead for most of the race.

The race also has it's own wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_Grand_Prix.

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I had the good fortune of making that race my very first grand prix experience.

Button gave us a show, but what made that race "historic" was that it was Vettel's first real choke under pressure. The McLaren was a solid performer that day, but Button's display there was just as much due to the fickle aspect of racing that's called luck than pure talent.

There is a reason why there is no longer two DRS zones in Canada like there was in 2011... Button has two collisions that could have ruined his car/race but they didn't. Alonso and Lewis were both out of the race by Button's hand, and had Vettel not choked, the race would have gone into the annals of just another rain affected race, not into the hall of fame it now resides in.

[scotty]

The McLaren was a solid performer that day, but Button's display there was just as much due to the fickle aspect of racing that's called luck than pure talent.

Had he not charged up behind Vettel he wouldn't have been close enough to benefit would he? You make your own luck to a very large extent. I think the idea of claiming things as lucky in sport is fickle in itself, and so think it is best avoided.

[What's Burning?]

I agree it's not even worth having the luck discussion. But luck, good or back is a component of the sport. That's not the meat of my comment however, but you can't argue there is only luck, not skill in bumping both Lewis and Alonso and having his car come out unscathed, whereas the other driver's ended their races because of it. It was a great race and I'm glad I saw unfold in front of me.

As fans we're always playing hypotheticals and would have could have should have, is the reason this forum exist.

[myownalias]

Safety cars + DRS + having the best car + wasting two better drivers = fortuitous win + gushing team principal + deluded fans

Oh, come one... If Lewis did all the same things that Jenson did; you'd all be crowing about what an amazing drive against adversity it was...

[LewEngBridewell]

So much hate in this thread. It really is depressing.

[What's Burning?]

Dedicated to you Lew.

[youtube]WpYeekQkAdc[/youtube]

[darwin dali]

[PartsaS]

His main competitor in that race was Lewis and Sebastian, He took out one of them, and beat the other one on track, Alonso wasn't nearly as fast as Button at that race, and I think he would overtake him at same point.
I don't know if he can be considered a great driver overall but at that race it was a great drive despite his ''luck''. Afterall that wasn't the first ''lucky'' win in f1.

[geetface9]

Safety cars + DRS + having the best car + wasting two better drivers = fortuitous win + gushing team principal + deluded fans

Oh, come one... If Lewis did all the same things that Jenson did; you'd all be crowing about what an amazing drive against adversity it was...

^

[What's Burning?]

Safety cars + DRS + having the best car + wasting two better drivers = fortuitous win + gushing team principal + deluded fans

Oh, come one... If Lewis did all the same things that Jenson did; you'd all be crowing about what an amazing drive against adversity it was...

Well maybe you're right... But then again he didn't get a chance.

[CookinFlat6]

True, Wb, its hard to drive through the field when you have been pasted into the wall by your teammate