FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Jabberwocky]

:spaz: So after making a huge fuss and nicking real Lotus' name, Renault now dont want it anyway? Is that the gist of it?

I think it is more a case of Lotus group not wanting anything to do with Genii/Renault.

From Lotus Group point of view it is a good deal they are getting all the free advertising of having a team called Lotus but not paying a penny for it.

[andrew]

:spaz: So after making a huge fuss and nicking real Lotus' name, Renault now dont want it anyway? Is that the gist of it?

I think it is more a case of Lotus group not wanting anything to do with Genii/Renault.

From Lotus Group point of view it is a good deal they are getting all the free advertising of having a team called Lotus but not paying a penny for it.

Beat me to it Jabberwocky. Lotus have pulled out, not been pushed is my understanding.

[racechick]

Its too confusing and Im fed up with the word lotus now. Shame they've done this to such a great name.

[Jabberwocky]

Does Tony Fernandez still own the name "Team Lotus"?

[andrew]

Its too confusing and Im fed up with the word lotus now. Shame they've done this to such a great name.

It is indeed a tangled web that they weave.

Does Tony Fernandez still own the name "Team Lotus"?

I think he pretty much owns most British brands!

I think he still own the rights to use the name. Does Team Lotus not form part of The Caterham Group?

[Jabberwocky]

For all that want a shorterned version of the Lotus story http://wp.me/p2d1qR-8H (yes I know shamless advertising of my own blog)

I can not find anywhere where it says that the name Team Lotus has changed hands so he must still do.

[scotty]

So basically Lotus are retaining the name for the sake of it... bizarre...

A bit more back on topic James Allison has had the following to say recently:

We're bringing new parts which should add up to around two tenths of a second improvement in lap time. It may not sound like much, but given how close the grids have been so far this season, that is a big deal.

Our latest set-up now gives Kimi sufficient assistance in the high speed, high load corners, but we still have yet to give him a power steering unit which offers the finesse he wants. We're making progress in this area, but the way Kimi drives the car is to find the limit on the front axle and then adjust the car very delicately around that limit; he can only do that if the steering is giving him exquisite feedback. We are working hard to provide him with perfect equipment so that he can deliver those last few tenths in qualifying.

Hopefully these steering rack improvements and car updates might, might just enable a challenge for the front row and a couple of podiums sometime this season, ideally sooner rather than later...

[vaptin]

Don't they get extra money for having a historical name like Lotus? Mosely I think was forced to concede it when the teams shot down his cost cutting sortie.

[bud]

The true value of Lotus F1
09/04/2012
We realise that Pitpass' recent article on the Lotus F1 team may have left some readers a little confused.

After all, whilst Lotus F1's ultimate owner Gerard Lopez went to great pains to tell one of the sport's websites that the team's sponsorship deal with Group Lotus has been terminated, Pitpass' business editor Christian Sylt revealed here that in fact, Group Lotus' parent company, Proton, has given the team a huge loan so, since it will still carry the name of the historic marque, the new development changes little both internally and externally. Likewise, whilst Lopez also announced that Group Lotus no longer has an option to buy 50% of Lotus F1, Pitpass revealed that if the team fails to repay the loan to Proton then Group Lotus' owner will get not just 50% of it but effectively 100%.

As Pitpass pointed out, by taking a business story to a sports journalist the door was opened to follow up reports just like this so, for the sake of transparency, we are attaching here the key documents relating to the Proton loan. They will be eye-opening for any budding F1 team owner.

The first page (pdf) confirms that this relates to "a debenture dated 3 February 2012 made between the Company (formerly known as Lotus Renault GP Limited) and the Lender (as defined below)." The second page (pdf) confirms the key point that "the Company charges with full title guarantee in favour of the Lender by way of first fixed charge... as continuing Security for the payment and discharge of the Secured Obligations all of the Company's rights to and title and interest from time to time in the Plant and Equipment, Real Property and Work-in-Progress." In itself this proves the existence of the loan and the fact that it is secured on plant, equipment, property and work-in-progress meaning that the lender will get all this if the money is not repaid. However, how do we know that Proton is the lender and just what exactly is the plant, equipment, property and work-in-progress?

The third page (pdf) confirms that the lender "means Perusahaan Otomobil nasional Sdn Bhd" which, as can be seen from the small print on the bottom of its home page is Proton. This page also confirms that the plant and equipment which has been secured "means all plant, machinery, show cars, computers, office and other equipment and chattels, as detailed in schedule 1 (Details of Mortgaged Property and Plant, Machinery and Tools) of the Debenture as set out in continuation sheets 5 to 18." It also confirms that the real property which has been secured includes "the land...known as Whiteways Technical Centre, Enstone, Chipping Norton, the land...known as the Staff Flat, Oathill Lodge, Enstone, Chipping Norton," and "any freehold, leasehold or immovable property specified in schedule 1 (Details of Mortgaged Property and Plant, Machinery and Tools) of the Debenture as set out in continuation sheets 5 to 18." The fourth page (pdf) confirms that the Work-in-Progress which has been secured "means the Company's work-in-progress detailed in schedule 1 (Details of Mortgaged Property and Plant, Machinery and Tools) of the Debenture as set out in continuation sheets 5 to 18 and the Related Rights."

So, we know that the items which Proton's loan is secured on are set out on sheets 5 to 18 and they could well be useful to prospective F1 team owners. In total, Lotus F1's plant, equipment, real property and work-in-progress has a value of £44.9m as revealed in our previous report. However, we now spell this out in detail. Want to know what is in Lotus F1's machine shop? Click this link (pdf - use rotate function). Want to know when the items in the machine shop were manufactured? Just click on the link. How about finding out what is in the team's R&D test room and its rapid prototyping department? It is on the link. The names of the manufacturer of the key parts of the team's windtunnel are also on the link along with the dates they were manufactured. There are two pages showing items of computer equipment belonging to the team with a value of over £5,000 each. Then comes a list of improvements being made to the team's property as well as assets under construction which include a gantry for the windtunnel and new software for the driver simulator.

There is no indication that the loan from Proton has been settled yet and, until it is, there is a risk that the manufacturer could end up with all these items if Lotus F1 fails to repay the money. Bearing this in mind, Group Lotus seems to be in a better position now than before when its owner had the option to buy 50% of the team. Either Proton will get its money back or ownership of the team's most important assets. Time will tell which route it goes down.

http://www.pitpass.com/45967-The-true-value-of-Lotus-F1

Interesting.

[madbrad]

How will this affect Kimi's car? I bet he didn't count on this when he joined up.

[Blackavar]

If microsoft takes over I'm fully expecting apple to join f1 as well

If Micro$oft takes over, I fully expect a restart button in every car because they'll need it multiple times during a race

If Lotus (the brand) pull out of F1 then Lotus (the team) should change their name and I'm sure they will. Plenty of other brands would pay to have their name in F1 and it's no financial sense for Lotus (team) to keep it.

[andrew]

If microsoft takes over I'm fully expecting apple to join f1 as well

If Micro$oft takes over, I fully expect a restart button in every car because they'll need it multiple times during a race

If Lotus (the brand) pull out of F1 then Lotus (the team) should change their name and I'm sure they will. Plenty of other brands would pay to have their name in F1 and it's no financial sense for Lotus (team) to keep it.

Could be worse. Apple could take over and the entire team would have a false sence of thinkong they're better than everyone else.

[What's Burning?]

If microsoft takes over I'm fully expecting apple to join f1 as well

If Micro$oft takes over, I fully expect a restart button in every car because they'll need it multiple times during a race

If Lotus (the brand) pull out of F1 then Lotus (the team) should change their name and I'm sure they will. Plenty of other brands would pay to have their name in F1 and it's no financial sense for Lotus (team) to keep it.

Could be worse. Apple could take over and the entire team would have a false sence of thinkong they're better than everyone else.

Apple would charge twice as much for tickets to see their drivers in an F1 race, but the experience of going to that GP would be much nicer.

[Hammer278]

Yeah and instead of launching their new car once in a year, they'll have around 5 launches spread over 1 season.

[bud]

If microsoft takes over I'm fully expecting apple to join f1 as well

If Micro$oft takes over, I fully expect a restart button in every car because they'll need it multiple times during a race

If Lotus (the brand) pull out of F1 then Lotus (the team) should change their name and I'm sure they will. Plenty of other brands would pay to have their name in F1 and it's no financial sense for Lotus (team) to keep it.

Could be worse. Apple could take over and the entire team would have a false sence of thinkong they're better than everyone else.

nothing false about it, its Fact!