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[andrew]

One has twice as many titles as the other.

Ok. So that counts a lot for you. Others may value different things.

All that matters when everything is said and done is the records.

To you. Others may think differently. Gilles Villeneuve is one of the all time greats in my book. No records.

He had some amazing wins and he was a cut above the rest and had his career was over too soon in tragic circumstances but drivers like him a few and far between.

I see you're enjoying the Vettel thread you Vettel fan you.

[racechick]

One has twice as many titles as the other.

Ok. So that counts a lot for you. Others may value different things.

All that matters when everything is said and done is the records.

To you. Others may think differently. Gilles Villeneuve is one of the all time greats in my book. No records.

He had some amazing wins and he was a cut above the rest and had his career was over too soon in tragic circumstances but drivers like him a few and far between.

I see you're enjoying the Vettel thread you Vettel fan you.

Which proves my point that statistics dont tell the whole story.

[andrew]

One has twice as many titles as the other.

Ok. So that counts a lot for you. Others may value different things.

All that matters when everything is said and done is the records.

To you. Others may think differently. Gilles Villeneuve is one of the all time greats in my book. No records.

He had some amazing wins and he was a cut above the rest and had his career was over too soon in tragic circumstances but drivers like him a few and far between.

I see you're enjoying the Vettel thread you Vettel fan you.

Which proves my point that statistics dont tell the whole story.

Not always.

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

71% of all statistics are made up.

[QuoththeRaven]

I think people have to remember that being a great driver is not the same as being able to be a consistent WDC, at least not these days it seems. People have to separate those who are great drivers and those who are able to be consistent WDCs.

Raw speed alone will not win you races anymore, especially not with the new tires being used. You have to manage your car, pace it and not burn up your tires. It seems to me that the drivers also have to be careful how much they attack. To do so too often will use up the tires and leave them stranded being back markers. It seems that if you attack, you had better make it stick quickly and decisively or else you are in a heap of trouble. With the use of DRS and KERS, this has caused overtaking to be more about staying close until you can push a button in order to pass than doing some heroic driving. Only when teams have gambled on their gear ratios, have we seen people not be able to easily pass while using DRS. Does take the suspense out of it.

[racechick]

I think people have to remember that being a great driver is not the same as being able to be a consistent WDC, at least not these days it seems. People have to separate those who are great drivers and those who are able to be consistent WDCs.

Raw speed alone will not win you races anymore, especially not with the new tires being used. You have to manage your car, pace it and not burn up your tires. It seems to me that the drivers also have to be careful how much they attack. To do so too often will use up the tires and leave them stranded being back markers. It seems that if you attack, you had better make it stick quickly and decisively or else you are in a heap of trouble. With the use of DRS and KERS, this has caused overtaking to be more about staying close until you can push a button in order to pass than doing some heroic driving. Only when teams have gambled on their gear ratios, have we seen people not be able to easily pass while using DRS. Does take the suspense out of it.

Some interesting thoughts there. Which comes back to what I said a while back.Who we think is the best driver depends on the skills we value most.
A fan valuing consistency, car management and an accumulation of statistical records will no doubt support a different driver to a fan who likes balls out driving, an ability to make the car do insane things, but who sometimes gets it wrong. And then theres a whole raft of drivers somewhere in the middle. Just down to choice.

[andrew]

71% of all statistics are made up.

Including this one.

[Vetteldaman]

One has twice as many titles as the other.

Ok. So that counts a lot for you. Others may value different things.

I think titles are one thing additude is another. Hamiltons attitude blows it for me. Vettel seems honestly gracious. Having his crew on his helmet to me says something about the guy. I guess we can never know the real driver but from what I see on tv nomatter what Hamiton does on the track he can never beat Vettel when attitude is taken into consideration. Although its somewhat understandable. To get destroyed race after race after race by Vettel I'm sure gets to him. And to be fair it's easy for Vettel to be gracious when he is winning seemingly so easily. I'll have to wait for Vettel to lose like Hamiton is losing, if that ever happens, to see if Vettel's attitude is true. Vettel also truly seems like he loves what he does and I value that in any athlete I am a fan of. You don't get to live every man's dream and act like its just a job.

But nomatter what, I'm thankful for all the drivers that make F1 possible. I think it's the greatest sport ever played and I honestly don't know what I'm going to do with myself when the season is over. Probably end up watching the season over again a few times.

[Hammer278]

One has twice as many titles as the other.

Ok. So that counts a lot for you. Others may value different things.

I think titles are one thing additude is another. Hamiltons attitude blows it for me. Vettel seems honestly gracious. Having his crew on his helmet to me says something about the guy. I guess we can never know the real driver but from what I see on tv nomatter what Hamiton does on the track he can never beat Vettel when attitude is taken into consideration. Although its somewhat understandable. To get destroyed race after race after race by Vettel I'm sure gets to him. And to be fair it's easy for Vettel to be gracious when he is winning seemingly so easily. I'll have to wait for Vettel to lose like Hamiton is losing, if that ever happens, to see if Vettel's attitude is true. Vettel also truly seems like he loves what he does and I value that in any athlete I am a fan of. You don't get to live every man's dream and act like its just a job.

But nomatter what, I'm thankful for all the drivers that make F1 possible. I think it's the greatest sport ever played and I honestly don't know what I'm going to do with myself when the season is over. Probably end up watching the season over again a few times.

Vettel...where are u...I no see you....

[Vetteldaman]

That's funny. Made me think of how boring it is being a Vettel fan. Other than qualifying he is never on the screen. That's one area where I envy the Hamilton fans, between him crashing into others and throwing hissy fits he gets quite a bit of camera time. Maybe next year they can slow Vettel down so I can see him more often.

[brionella]

Another record for Vettel today Most laps led in a season breaking Mansells record. In that season though there were only 16 races so how is it a fair test? Surely as this is the 17th race this season the record isn't actually beaten?

[mnmracer]

Another record for Vettel today Most laps led in a season breaking Mansells record. In that season though there were only 16 races so how is it a fair test? Surely as this is the 17th race this season the record isn't actually beaten?

How do you know how many more laps Mansell would have led if there had been a 17th race in 1992?
As a statistician, my general rule of thumb is that if they are within about 5 to 10% percentage-wise, you can consider it a fair record, because you never know what the other drivers would have done if given more races.

With 694 out of 1036 laps in 1992, Mansell led 66,99% of all the laps.
With 651 out of 947 laps after 16 races in 2011, Vettel led 68.74% of all the laps.
With now 711 out of 1007 laps, Vettel has now led 70.6% of all the laps, closing in on Jim Clark's 1963 record of 71.47%.

[LewEngBridewell]

That's funny. Made me think of how boring it is being a Vettel fan. Other than qualifying he is never on the screen. That's one area where I envy the Hamilton fans, between him crashing into others and throwing hissy fits he gets quite a bit of camera time. Maybe next year they can slow Vettel down so I can see him more often.

The only people that can slow him down now is his own team. And maybe they'll do just that next season!

[darwin dali]

I vaguely remember Steve Matchett saying that SV's record of most laps led in a single season is more than all the laps put together that JB led in his entire career (incl. a world champion season)!

[andrew]

I vaguely remember Steve Matchett saying that SV's record of most laps led in a single season is more than all the laps put together that JB led in his entire career (incl. a world champion season)!