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[Denthúl]

Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

But Coke tastes awful, too.

[andrew]

Your so called sense of humour isn't funny. By the way you must be a bandwagon supporter. A Redbull supporter. Yeah ok. Redbull who cares. When they eventually go bust, no one will care. At least go for McLaren since they are the second most sucessful team in F1 and the second longest running team in F1. And guess what, F1 to me is all about McLaren versus Ferrari. That is what excites me and always has been from as far as I can remember. McLAREN VS FERRARI. 2 teams with 700 and 700 plus races, a handful of championship wins and so on. Redbull is boring and the drink tastes aweful too. Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

By the way have you ever seen an Australian V8 Supercar race? Well I have and it is all about Ford vs Holden. If it all of a sudden it became Nissan vs Holden, the crowds would not be happy, except of course if Holden still won. So in F1 screw Redbull vs McLaren or Redbull vs Ferrari. McLAREN VS FERRARI. Enough said. Amen.....

My sense of humour isn't funny, your attitude to someone that doesn't support Ferrari stinks - sunrise sunset. But don't tell me who support. I have supported Red Bull since they entered F1 and supported Stewart GP when they started in 1997 so no I'm not a bandwagon supporter. However to be an F1 fan you don't have to support any team(s) or driver(s). Many people just enjoy the racing.

You have displayed typical Tifosi arrogance. Ferrari are not bigger than F1. F1 would survive without Ferrari (or McLaren), the universe doesn't centre around Maranello, geese would still fly south for the winter, the world will keep on turning and Red Bull would keep on winning. OK F1 would be different but another aother team would fill the gap eventually. You only support Ferrari as you are Italian and for no objective reason whatsoever. You don't support them because they do something well or you like the way they work, you support them because of blind patriotism and nothing more. So whose jumping on the bandwagon now? You are - the one that you feel obliged to jump on. Saying that someone can only support Ferrari and McLaren is surely encouraging people to be "bandwagon supporters" so I take it that is all you are. It's a shame that you can't respect others for choosing to support a team that is not Ferrari or McLaren, it is very narrow minded. Just because a team has been round for 60 years does not give them the automatic right to win or be labelled the best. Judge the team b on-track performance, not on the record books.

So what if Red Bull tastes awful, doesn't bother me. Just because I support their F1 team does not mean that I sit chugging gallons of their product. It is laughable that anyone buys something just because it is plastered along the side of their favourite teams car.

Your statistics about Ferrari and McLaren are largely meaningless unless you want to tell you future grandchildren nice stories in the long dark winter evenings. There is nothing to be gained by looking on past glories as that won't win you any championships. All that matters is what is happening now and what is happening now is that Red Bull are beating McLaren and Ferrari and well done to them.

[darwin dali]

How can you not like it Andy? I love the Redbull drink, I don't drink coffee so can't go a day with out one

You might as well go out and buy a bag of sugar It's disgusting.

I guess as red bull is basicly a sugar boost that the sugar free one is full of sugar substitutes or sweeteners ?.I have no idea ,never tried it.It must have something like that to give you the boost?.Or have they made a drink that might even pass as drinkable

The boost is mostly from the caffeine and taurine.

[bud]

I usually get the sugar free variants anyways this is about McLaren how about a Lucozade?

[LRW]

Your so called sense of humour isn't funny. By the way you must be a bandwagon supporter. A Redbull supporter. Yeah ok. Redbull who cares. When they eventually go bust, no one will care. At least go for McLaren since they are the second most sucessful team in F1 and the second longest running team in F1. And guess what, F1 to me is all about McLaren versus Ferrari. That is what excites me and always has been from as far as I can remember. McLAREN VS FERRARI. 2 teams with 700 and 700 plus races, a handful of championship wins and so on. Redbull is boring and the drink tastes aweful too. Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

By the way have you ever seen an Australian V8 Supercar race? Well I have and it is all about Ford vs Holden. If it all of a sudden it became Nissan vs Holden, the crowds would not be happy, except of course if Holden still won. So in F1 screw Redbull vs McLaren or Redbull vs Ferrari. McLAREN VS FERRARI. Enough said. Amen.....

Seriously dude. You need to get over yourself. It's supporters like you that give Ferrari the bad name. F1 to you is about Ferrari vs McLaren??? s*** you must have boring Sundays.

[killem2]

Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

But Coke tastes awful, too.

[AKR]

Your so called sense of humour isn't funny. By the way you must be a bandwagon supporter. A Redbull supporter. Yeah ok. Redbull who cares. When they eventually go bust, no one will care. At least go for McLaren since they are the second most sucessful team in F1 and the second longest running team in F1. And guess what, F1 to me is all about McLaren versus Ferrari. That is what excites me and always has been from as far as I can remember. McLAREN VS FERRARI. 2 teams with 700 and 700 plus races, a handful of championship wins and so on. Redbull is boring and the drink tastes aweful too. Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

By the way have you ever seen an Australian V8 Supercar race? Well I have and it is all about Ford vs Holden. If it all of a sudden it became Nissan vs Holden, the crowds would not be happy, except of course if Holden still won. So in F1 screw Redbull vs McLaren or Redbull vs Ferrari. McLAREN VS FERRARI. Enough said. Amen.....

My sense of humour isn't funny, your attitude to someone that doesn't support Ferrari stinks - sunrise sunset. But don't tell me who support. I have supported Red Bull since they entered F1 and supported Stewart GP when they started in 1997 so no I'm not a bandwagon supporter. However to be an F1 fan you don't have to support any team(s) or driver(s). Many people just enjoy the racing.

You have displayed typical Tifosi arrogance. Ferrari are not bigger than F1. F1 would survive without Ferrari (or McLaren), the universe doesn't centre around Maranello, geese would still fly south for the winter, the world will keep on turning and Red Bull would keep on winning. OK F1 would be different but another aother team would fill the gap eventually. You only support Ferrari as you are Italian and for no objective reason whatsoever. You don't support them because they do something well or you like the way they work, you support them because of blind patriotism and nothing more. So whose jumping on the bandwagon now? You are - the one that you feel obliged to jump on. Saying that someone can only support Ferrari and McLaren is surely encouraging people to be "bandwagon supporters" so I take it that is all you are. It's a shame that you can't respect others for choosing to support a team that is not Ferrari or McLaren, it is very narrow minded. Just because a team has been round for 60 years does not give them the automatic right to win or be labelled the best. Judge the team b on-track performance, not on the record books.

So what if Red Bull tastes awful, doesn't bother me. Just because I support their F1 team does not mean that I sit chugging gallons of their product. It is laughable that anyone buys something just because it is plastered along the side of their favourite teams car.

Your statistics about Ferrari and McLaren are largely meaningless unless you want to tell you future grandchildren nice stories in the long dark winter evenings. There is nothing to be gained by looking on past glories as that won't win you any championships. All that matters is what is happening now and what is happening now is that Red Bull are beating McLaren and Ferrari and well done to them.

According to you I am a bandwagon supporter because I am Italian and I feel obligated to support Ferrari. Yeah ok whatever you say. Except I could quite easily turn this around and make it backfire on you (with the being Italian part and being obligated to support Ferrari part) but wont since this is supposed to be about McLaren.

But on the topic of McLaren, they have been or about to be around for 700 races. I don't really like McLaren, but then again they like Ferrari have made F1. I tell you what, you go celebrate you little Red Bull victories. Eventually they will run out of money or perhaps get sick of racing and pull out. Or maybe they will be called something else. Because they were once Stewart, and then Jaguar (really Ford) and then Red Bull. Some history that is. At least McLaren was always McLaren and same with Ferrari. But do not worry, Ferrari and McLaren have always been the teams with the money and always the top teams. Red Bull (Like Brawn F1), only got to where they are because of the rule changes of 2009 and they somehow did a better jon than the 2 big F1 giants. But don't worry, once McLaren and Ferrari catch up and once Red Bull run out of novac, then it will be McLaren vs Ferrari again. And of course fun times again. I will be telling future grand childdren how this once annoying drinks company got lucky (with the rule changes of 2009) and won a few championships in a world dominated by McLaren and Ferrari.

As you know I was stirring bud around with the comment. We like to share a sense of humour. However in all seriousness, for the respect of a great F1 team that McLaren is, I congratulate them on the milestone of reaching 700 GPs and wish them all the best for many more to come. I do not believe that one day I would be saying this for Red Bull as I doubt they will ever be around to achieve such a milestione.

Oh and while I am at it, both McLaren and Ferrari were founded by 2 men that actually started by racing their cars. Bruce McLaren and Enzo Ferrari respectively. Who the hell are Red Bull again. They have no such legacy. Please do not waste my time with souless teams like RedBull anymore.

[AKR]

Your so called sense of humour isn't funny. By the way you must be a bandwagon supporter. A Redbull supporter. Yeah ok. Redbull who cares. When they eventually go bust, no one will care. At least go for McLaren since they are the second most sucessful team in F1 and the second longest running team in F1. And guess what, F1 to me is all about McLaren versus Ferrari. That is what excites me and always has been from as far as I can remember. McLAREN VS FERRARI. 2 teams with 700 and 700 plus races, a handful of championship wins and so on. Redbull is boring and the drink tastes aweful too. Maybe Coca Cola will invest in F1 soon and make a Coke team.

By the way have you ever seen an Australian V8 Supercar race? Well I have and it is all about Ford vs Holden. If it all of a sudden it became Nissan vs Holden, the crowds would not be happy, except of course if Holden still won. So in F1 screw Redbull vs McLaren or Redbull vs Ferrari. McLAREN VS FERRARI. Enough said. Amen.....

Seriously dude. You need to get over yourself. It's supporters like you that give Ferrari the bad name. F1 to you is about Ferrari vs McLaren??? s*** you must have boring Sundays.

Get this very important thing right from now, I am NOT a dude.

[andrew]

According to you I am a bandwagon supporter.....

According to you I am a bandwagon supporter because I am Italian and I feel obligated to support Ferrari. Yeah ok whatever you say. Except I could quite easily turn this around and make it backfire on you (with the being Italian part and being obligated to support Ferrari part) but wont since this is supposed to be about McLaren.

Well you are as much a bandwagon supporter in that you support your team because of blind patriotism, nothing more. Don’t see how you could turn that around as I don’t feel obligated to support a British team.

But on the topic of McLaren, they have been or about to be around for 700 races. I don't really like McLaren, but then again they like Ferrari have made F1.

No they have not. F1 was around for a good few years before McLaren existed and Grand Prix racing existed before Ferrari. F1 would exist without either or both teams and would still have the same attraction to spectators. Ferrari are just a car manufacturer and F1 team, just the same as McLaren are just an F1 team and car manufacturer. Neither are, ever have been or ever will be bigger than F1. Both of them need F1 to survive.

I tell you what, you go celebrate you little Red Bull victories.

Thank you, I will.

Eventually they will run out of money or perhaps get sick of racing and pull out. Or maybe they will be called something else. Because they were once Stewart, and then Jaguar (really Ford) and then Red Bull. Some history that is. At least McLaren was always McLaren and same with Ferrari. But do not worry, Ferrari and McLaren have always been the teams with the money and always the top teams. Red Bull (Like Brawn F1), only got to where they are because of the rule changes of 2009 and they somehow did a better jon than the 2 big F1 giants.

Total bovine manure! So what if a team has changed hands several times? It doesn’t make them any less of a team. I could say that Ferrari are just Fiat with a fancy badge using your logic seeing as Fiat had to bail them out. Ferrari and McLaren have not always been the top teams. Both have had numerous seasons where they have been at best 3rd. Having all the money doesn’t matter anymore seeing as the teams are all obliged to be within the RRA. A team could have £100 billion in their pocket, but they can only spend what is allowed by the RRA. Spending huge amounts does not guarantee or give an automatic right to success.

Red Bull would have still been at the top regardless of rule changes. Adrian Newey designed championship winning cars before the rules changes in 2009 so to say that they only won because of the rule changes is rubbish. They may have helped as some teams with the most money and (according to you) the correct heritage made a bum steer, but even with the rules being unchanged, I am certain Red Bull would still have been at the top. This years rules are pretty much the same as last years and Red Bull have won again. Blaming Ferrari and McLaren’s loss on the rule changes is nothing more than a cop out.

But don't worry, once McLaren and Ferrari catch up and once Red Bull run out of novac, then it will be McLaren vs Ferrari again. And of course fun times again. I will be telling future grand childdren how this once annoying drinks company got lucky (with the rule changes of 2009) and won a few championships in a world dominated by McLaren and Ferrari.

A world dominated by McLaren and Ferrari? Fancy telling me when one of these 2 last dominated? 2008 was it? 3 years ago. There are fun times now anyway. All true F1 fans deep down enjoy seeing someone at the top of their game.

Oh and while I am at it, both McLaren and Ferrari were founded by 2 men that actually started by racing their cars. Bruce McLaren and Enzo Ferrari respectively. Who the hell are Red Bull again. They have no such legacy. Please do not waste my time with souless teams like RedBull anymore.

So what? Doesn’t make them any less of a team in the least. Benetton were a fashion company. I guess they had no business winning either did they? Total snobbishness is all that is borne out of typical Tifosi arrogance and an intolerance of anyone who dares to beat the reds at their own game.

Even the most cynical Tifosi member has to admit that Red Bull have done an outstanding job for the past 2 years.

Get this very important thing right from now, I am NOT a dude.

If you say so. We can only take that at face value given the anonymous world of the internet.

[LewEngBridewell]

Just before this thread gets any more heated, I just thought I'd add in that AKR often enjoys pulling the leg of people who don't happen to support Ferrari... especially McLaren fans! I made the mistake once of taking her far too seriously and this is what's happening here. Let's just keep it at banter because I feel that was the intention at the start.

Sorry, I'm sounding like a mod now... didn't mean to! Andrew and AKR are both members I have a great respect for, just don't like to see you ripping the insides out of each other!

[killem2]

So she's a troll.

Got it. I'll go ahead and ignore her now.

Seriously, there isn't need for that.

[andrew]

Just don't appreciate intolerance. Support for a team is fine but belittling another team for beating the long established teams is pathetic and says to me that the person saying that is not a true F1 fan.

Thank you for your support Lew. I shall always wear it.

[AKR]

Just before this thread gets any more heated, I just thought I'd add in that AKR often enjoys pulling the leg of people who don't happen to support Ferrari... especially McLaren fans! I made the mistake once of taking her far too seriously and this is what's happening here. Let's just keep it at banter because I feel that was the intention at the start.

Sorry, I'm sounding like a mod now... didn't mean to! Andrew and AKR are both members I have a great respect for, just don't like to see you ripping the insides out of each other!

If I remember correctly, you told me you go for McLaren because they are British and that because you are British. And if I am not mistaken, that actualy pleased me. If you thus look at Andrew's post to me regarding the Italian/patriotism/Ferrari/bandwagon supporter, then he very much called you one too. Of course I wouldn't worry as neither of us are. We both just follow the very 2 teams that have the bulk of F1 fans. And it is the fans that watch F1 and make it happen. Most people I have met that like F1 like either Ferrari or McLaren. I've met a Williams supporter before (another great team with history that is sadly getting worse all the time) but no Red Bull supporters.

[AKR]

Well you are as much a bandwagon supporter in that you support your team because of blind patriotism, nothing more. Don’t see how you could turn that around as I don’t feel obligated to support a British team..

Easy to turn it around. At the convenience of the situation I am Slovenian, but still the same big Ferrari Tifosa you know. Where is the so called patriotism now? aahhh the joys of being a duel citizen. Now that voids your statement completely.

No they have not. F1 was around for a good few years before McLaren existed and Grand Prix racing existed before Ferrari. F1 would exist without either or both teams and would still have the same attraction to spectators. Ferrari are just a car manufacturer and F1 team, just the same as McLaren are just an F1 team and car manufacturer. Neither are, ever have been or ever will be bigger than F1. Both of them need F1 to survive.

Ferrari existed during the golden era of grand prix racing. Enzo Ferrari raced for Alfa Romeo and then managed his own Alfa team called Scuderia Ferrari. Most people I know and have met go for Ferrari, then followed by McLaren. I've seen a few Williams supporters but that is it. I cannot picture how these Ferrari and McLaren fans would be happy if all of a sudden there were no more Ferrari and McLaren in F1. I certainily wouldn't. If it were just Red Bulls and the others, it wouldn't be much more fun to watch than Formula Indy.

Total bovine manure! So what if a team has changed hands several times? It doesn’t make them any less of a team.

Oh but it is a big deal. Red Bull as result are soul less. It takes years and years to devolp "soul" in any make of car. And then great race car manufactuers make great supercars. Even McLaren understands this concept as they too make road cars like Ferrari (even if not in as big a scale). At least with Red Bull I can buy some aweful tasting drinks which is supposed to give me wings.

Red Bull would have still been at the top regardless of rule changes. Adrian Newey designed championship winning cars before the rules changes in 2009 so to say that they only won because of the rule changes is rubbish. They may have helped as some teams with the most money and (according to you) the correct heritage made a bum steer, but even with the rules being unchanged, I am certain Red Bull would still have been at the top. This years rules are pretty much the same as last years and Red Bull have won again. Blaming Ferrari and McLaren’s loss on the rule changes is nothing more than a cop out.

In 2008 like 2007 it was all Ferrari and McLaren. Red Bull were nowhere. Even Toro Rosso did better. If the rules remaining as in 2008 in 2009, or only minor changes were made, it would of still been Ferrari and McLaren. This why I hated the 2009 changes. What a boring season. Brawn F1 vs Red Bull. Nuh 2007 and 2008 really ripped the fire and passion out of me with all that Ferrari vs McLaren stuff.

So what? Doesn’t make them any less of a team in the least. Benetton were a fashion company. I guess they had no business winning either did they? Total snobbishness is all that is borne out of typical Tifosi arrogance and an intolerance of anyone who dares to beat the reds at their own game.

Yes and where are Benetton now. (apart from being Renault now) no one really cares. I bet it wouldn't be the case if Ferrari or McLaren dispeared. I bet it would be the case if Red Bull went the way of Benetton.

Oh and on the topic of Benetton. They were Italian. (despite them holding a British super licence up until the end of 1995 and then having an Italian one), Benetton is an Italian fashion company founded by Luciano Benetton. I never went for them as say a second team. Nooooooo, I actually didn't mind Williams as a second team and oh guess what, they are British (Williams). So you can stick your nonsense patriotism bandwagon claims from before to you know where.

Even the most cynical Tifosi member has to admit that Red Bull have done an outstanding job for the past 2 years.

Yeah they have, but who cares!
and although Vettel truely deserved to win the WDC this season, Alonso was robbed of it in 2010. For this I cannot stand Vettel or Red Bull as Alonso should of won the WDC in 2010. Yes I am still devestated so please leave this part at that.

Get this very important thing right from now, I am NOT a dude.

If you say so. We can only take that at face value given the anonymous world of the internet.

Whatever, as you English people like to say,"Jog on" will ya.

[bud]

Pole is a good start for the 700th GP