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#271890
What no one outside the team truly can know is how much better the RB7 has got because of Vettel being their test pilot. It's obvious he gets more out of the chassis than Webber, and I suspect their set-ups are very different as well. Which probably means his development work is substantially more relevant to his own chassis than to his teammate's. But I can't remember when last I heard such glowing reports of a young driver's ability to communicate with his car's developmental engineers.

And there's tragic news for all the Haytas. Vettel keeps improving. In the past, when he's not been at the front, neither has he made best of his overtaking opportunities. But he made an enormous mental adjustment after winning WDC. This season, he's been taking his A Levels in overtaking, particularly the four most recent races.

And he's already got the world champion's mentality sussed. So much was made that he'd fallen off pace for three races. I think he realized he didn't have the tenth tenth at those circuits so he contented himself with driving conservatively and minimized what damage the others could do to his lead. Unlike the previous two seasons, he didn't do anything rash, rather he drove to preserve his title. Unlike other F1 wunderkinds of late, it does not appear Vettel's skill sets plateaued before the had the Airbus 318 paid for. The Elite was a necessity so he could show up Ruben's tiny little 37-passenger Embraer, but I'd have gone for the Gulfstream 650 (it's bloody fast!! ).
#271957
Remember one thing: At the end of the day, only the wins count!


Great way to dodge anything anyone will say about vettel. If he was so incredible and the car is hardly helping him, where was he at bmw and torro rosso? I'm not the person to say he doesn't deserve what has been given, he may be the best between himself and webber, however I don't believe for a damn second if schumi, alonzo, or hamiliton was in that bull next to him, he's be looking so smooth. He might still get poles and 1st places but it would be a back and forth.
#271975
The thing is this...

We had a poll a year or so ago, and most people thought the car made the majority of the difference. That has not changed. The Red Bull is massively fast and is the best car on the grid.

The problem is that people use this as a stick to poke the Vettel fans, and they say that is the only reason for his wins. But we all know deep down inside that is not true. He is a great driver, driving a great car. Hamilton is a great driver, driving a great car. Alonso is a great driver driving a very good car. Button is a very good driver driving a great car.

Vettel will win his second world championship this year (and deserve to have done so). His perfection as extracting everything he can from the car especially wringing out a perfect lap in quali is amazing.
#271997
When Vettel won at Monza in a Toro Rosso back in '08, that was enough to convince me he was a star. All he's done since then has cement that view.
#272006
Monza 2008 was a good weekend for Torro Rosso. Qualified 1st and 4th. Pity Bourdais only managed 14th in the race or it would have been even more of a story book weekend for what was really Minardi with Red Bull input.
#272011
Heres me thinking this thread might be civil, its the Vettel fanboys and the Hamilton fanboys as per usual.
#272017
Where's the uncivility?



Its there alright, "get a grip" courtesy of vlad

" here what what will annoy all the haytas" courtesy of Fred Dobs

Its there ^
#272020
It's just some gentle fun poking I think (from Vlad at least). Wait until Vettel's sealed the deal 'cos I'm going to do one hell of a boastful post (all in good fun of course), as I would expect anyone who's driver has won a championship to do.

Relax Fraffy, it's all good. :silly: It'll be you're turn next year to have a boast, I'll eat my hat if it isn't.
#272023
It's just some gentle fun poking I think (from Vlad at least). Wait until Vettel's sealed the deal 'cos I'm going to do one hell of a boastful post (all in good fun of course), as I would expect anyone who's driver has won a championship to do.

Relax Fraffy, it's all good. :silly: It'll be you're turn next year to have a boast, I'll eat my hat if it isn't.



I bloody hope so! I thought after 2008 he'd be winning all the time (Hamilton) but F1 has never worked that way, Vettel will have s*it times too, its all about enjoying it whilst and when you can, so enjoy it!


Hope the Red Bull domination ends next year though, please god let it end next year, more then half my time watching F1 since 2007 has been red bull domination now, time to end.
#272026
Part of me loves the domination of one team and driver. 2000 - 2005 was great for me being a Schumacher fan and this was before I grew disgusted by Ferrari. It was great seeing a driver and a team at the absolute top of their game, but I can see how it can be boring for those that don't see it like that.

I am too young to remember the Prost and Senna days so seeing someone who will regarded as one of the (if not the greatest) all time greats racing at the top of their game was pretty special as I doubt we'll see domination like that for a long time.

As for Red Bull, they have a secret weapon in Adrian Newey but McLaren and Ferrari have pretty much caught up. Every genius has a duff idea so it stands to reason that Newey will design a duff car at some point. It's happened before and it'll hapen again. It's just the nature of things when new theories are being developed.
#272040
Over the past few years since the Ferrari domination it's been quite ridiculous - the rules keep changing and one team wins the first bunch of races until the rest of the field catch up.

That is a fake Formula One in my opinion, and I'll be happy to see some dominating for a few years... :thumbup:
#272061
The thing is this...

We had a poll a year or so ago, and most people thought the car made the majority of the difference. That has not changed. The Red Bull is massively fast and is the best car on the grid.

The problem is that people use this as a stick to poke the Vettel fans, and they say that is the only reason for his wins. But we all know deep down inside that is not true. He is a great driver, driving a great car. Hamilton is a great driver, driving a great car. Alonso is a great driver driving a very good car. Button is a very good driver driving a great car.

Vettel will win his second world championship this year (and deserve to have done so). His perfection as extracting everything he can from the car especially wringing out a perfect lap in quali is amazing.


No we're saying that Vettel has only measured against Webber,whereas FA/LH/JB have all competed against each other and can be compared. Unless Vettel fans think Webber is a top 5 driver.
Webber was leading the WDC standings until the last race last year,he's 2nd this season without any wins and having problems with the tires and starts.Thats how good the RB cars have been.I dont even need to look at vettel,all I gotta look at is Webber,
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