FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[carmonwebber]

Jenson definitely put the squeeze onto Lewis be-it unintentionally or intentionally. I think he knew full well, but at the same time I also think his move was legit as mentioned by 'chippo'.

Either way, I believe the onus was on Lewis to avoid that situation and move away from Jenson (like Barrichello did), use the brakes, or go the other side if he had room. There was a wall there on this occasion and Lewis still decided to commit to the first option. If I remembered correctly, Lewis was quite quick at that stage of the race and in hindsight, probably could have waited for another occasion.

"You know what, I think you make your own luck," Hamilton added. "I feel very blessed to be here still in F1, fit, healthy and alive and still racing. There are many, many drivers that wish they could be in our position.

"Of course you could always hope for things to be better, but good times do come to those who wait. So I'll just bide my time and hope that at some stage it will be mine."

I hope his words are a sign that he could pull it together after the last 2 races and start putting some heat on SV.

[Peng]

Other ways of passing is to use different lines and apexes into various corners, if you put your apex later then the guy in front has to go wider after your apex and simply has to leave you room, as long as your car can turn in where required and brake later as needed. But that later braking and ability to get the car turned in, or save your tyres that little bit more than the guy ahead so that you could use them to make the pass.

That way of overtaking is exactly what is happening and the guy in front simply isn't leaving any room which makes that type of overtake pretty much impossible.

Button for example was right alongside Alonso into that turn and the only reason Button hit him in the side pod was that Alonso braked later trying to defend, so in that situation who was more at fault? Button for attempting an overtake? or Alonso for braking later and trying to take the outside line?

Most say it was Buttons mistake but since he had the inside line and had no where else to go where as alonso could have quite easily braked later and avoided the incident i would say it points more towards Alonso's mistake.

Don't get me wrong though i agree 100% these are racing incidents and should be given no penalties but since they are being given penalties (atleast for some drivers) who would be at fault? because from some peoples views the defending driver can do no wrong so it seems like its always going to point to Button in that type of scenario.

[Jabberwocky]

"You know what, I think you make your own luck," Hamilton added. "I feel very blessed to be here still in F1, fit, healthy and alive and still racing. There are many, many drivers that wish they could be in our position.

"Of course you could always hope for things to be better, but good times do come to those who wait. So I'll just bide my time and hope that at some stage it will be mine."

Almost sounds as if has found religion.

[acosmichippo]

or is heavily coached.

[spankyham]

I think this is a very well balanced article by MB. I'd have to say I agree with most it.

[PartsaS]

regarding the Schumi/Reubens incident, didn't Schumi move OFF of the racing line then? Jenson made NO move against the racing line. He was moving over (gradually, before hamilton made the pass attempt), but that's where the racing line went. Just look at the cars in front of Jenson - they were all on the same line.

Furthermore, I'd think the best judge of this would be the guy in the trailing cockpit. Reubens clearly thought something was off, but Hamilton has since accepted fault and was even partying with the team after the race. Given his recent PR blunders, I'd find it hard to believe he'd do that if he honestly thought otherwise.

And finally, I admit this is slightly more open to debate, but after watching it on youtube, it seems to me when Jenson looked in his mirror, Lewis was still directly behind. And Just after Jenson looked back to the track, Hamilton made his move to the outside.

[vaptin]

Other ways of passing is to use different lines and apexes into various corners, if you put your apex later then the guy in front has to go wider after your apex and simply has to leave you room, as long as your car can turn in where required and brake later as needed. But that later braking and ability to get the car turned in, or save your tyres that little bit more than the guy ahead so that you could use them to make the pass.

That way of overtaking is exactly what is happening and the guy in front simply isn't leaving any room which makes that type of overtake pretty much impossible.

Button for example was right alongside Alonso into that turn and the only reason Button hit him in the side pod was that Alonso braked later trying to defend, so in that situation who was more at fault? Button for attempting an overtake? or Alonso for braking later and trying to take the outside line?

Most say it was Buttons mistake but since he had the inside line and had no where else to go where as alonso could have quite easily braked later and avoided the incident i would say it points more towards Alonso's mistake.

Don't get me wrong though i agree 100% these are racing incidents and should be given no penalties but since they are being given penalties (atleast for some drivers) who would be at fault? because from some peoples views the defending driver can do no wrong so it seems like its always going to point to Button in that type of scenario.

Alonso showed him the inside line, Button should've worked out that meant Alonso would've been on the inside for the next kerb, and unless he [Button] slowed down enough, he would be driving into Alonso, Button in this case knew where Alonso was and that he didn't have the entire track available (some of it was occupied by Alonso), it was his responsibility to react accordingly. Alonso isn't expected to simply back of and yield position, its the responsibility of the driver who makes the move to be able to see it through safely, Alonso already gave Button a gap to go up the inside, its Button's fault that Button wanted more space than that to make the corners. It was probably due to the rain that Button couldn't slow down enough, but I'm surprised that the stewards were so lenient.

[bud]

Most Vaptin agree it was just a racing incident. Your Alonso bias is showing through it seems.
[youtube]C0h0C5nL5SM[/youtube]

Jenson is right along side and has the line, if anything it was up to Alonso to give him a bit more room instead of turning in on him when he knew he was there.

[vlad]

I still think Alonso had a better drive through that corner and that it's Button's fault.

[bud]

I still think Alonso had a better drive through that corner and that it's Button's fault.

how is that so? Alonso missed the apex totally because Button was there. Its not so one sided as some would like to think.

[vlad]

He was a bit more brave on braking than Button! So, Button lost the benefits of his positioning. Clear deal.

[bud]

He was a bit more brave on braking than Button! So, Button lost the benefits of his positioning. Clear deal.

More Brave under brakes? um if you say so. I take it you have their telemetry data then?

[vlad]

See it for yourself. Button was braking earlier than Alonso there. Webber had the same case later in the race when he was trying to overtake Schumacher.

[bud]

See it for yourself. Button was braking earlier than Alonso there. Webber had the same case later in the race when he was trying to overtake Schumacher.

oh yeah when you said Webber broke early and yet straight lined a chicane? that is the biggest contradiction ive yet heard i think!


End of the day Button had the inside line for the first part of the chicane, he was a bit early in to the corner, which is why you assume he broke earlier, he is in a tighter line this would be the reason. You can see from the rear view of the Merc where Schumi takes the apex, Jenson is a bit earlier because of the tighter line. Alonso misses the corner and the apex all together because he didnt have track position for the first part of the chicane.

I would say it was 50/50 and a racing incident which is the way the stewards saw it.

[What's Burning?]

Button was ahead of him and on the inside! This was a mistake on Fernando's part in his unwillingness to yield the position and he paid the price, and Button was lucky to remain unscathed. I'm sure Alonso would do it differently if he had the chance... just a racing incident.