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[Bladesman]

The Red Bull chassis will win the championship not Vettel.

Tell that to Webber!

True I was expecting more from Webber this season.

I don't think he is happy at all at the moment.

[myownalias]

The Red Bull chassis will win the championship not Vettel.

Tell that to Webber!

True I was expecting more from Webber this season.

I don't think he is happy at all at the moment.

But that said; Mark Webber started to come strong at this point last year and almost won the championship!

[acosmichippo]

Ferrari is out for this yr. They might develop their car a bit, only to save some face.

In regards to the profit sharing between the teams, isn't it in their interest to place as high as possible even if they don't win?

[vaptin]

Well, that was stop and start.

Haven't read the thread,

Massa putting it into the wall was inevitable really, at least he showed some pace though. Alonso getting punted off didn't help, I guess the stewards gave leeway because it was wet, Hamilton's move on Webber was unpunished as well I think, and it was almost the same incident.

Jenson didn't get a penalty for either the Hamilton or Alonso incident? But he served a drive through for something, can't remember what. Think I blame Jenson mainly for both those incidents though.

Exciting race though.

It seems Vettel's getting a lot of criticism for slipping up? I didn't think he would, but s*** happens.

[Fluffy]

At those conditions it is very difficult to see what is going on behind you, Although Jenson looked at his mirror he couldn't see where exactly Lewis was or the speed he had. Anyway he was just holding his racing line and if you look at Shumi's line, Jenson didn't go as left as Shumi did, or as left as he did in his previous lap. If anyone is to blame this is Ham
I am a huge MAc n Hamilton fan, but in this case he should be more causious trying to pass his teamate, especialy in low visibility conditions. As for him leaving F1, it is just rediculus. He is obviously faster than Jenson in most cases, but he is not calm enough to make wise decisions during the race. I am very disappointed to see him so offen in accidents
As for Jenson, I was very happy when he joined the Macs, and I believe he is a great value for the team!


Additionally, Hamilton also has a "Crying wolf" stigma at this point. He does questionable stuff so often, it has to make you wonder. Nobody's perfect, but Jenson is an historically responsible driver, so I think we have to give him the benefit of the doubt - especially in these difficult conditions as PartsaS mentioned


PartsaS, acosmichippo I respect your opinions, but personally i think that Lewis was screwed and i am not buying that jenson didn't see him coming, that accident was atleast 75% jenson's fault.
Jenson said in an interview today (or was it yesterday?) that this year he can be a front runner, he said that cause he KNOWS (well actually he is a part of screwing lewis as i wrote on page 39) that Lewis is going to get screwed this season.
A last comment on this matter, i hope that lewis wont leave McLaren and move to Red Bull, it will be a fatal career move, but i won't be surprised if these kind of thoughts are crossing his mind, after all in recent weeks he isn't getting the support he deserves from McLaren, which is a shame, and it's a bigger shame that things that have nothing to do with sports are involved in it.

LOL tin hats out by any chance? Lewis tried to overtake in an impossible situation, why go on the outside on that part of the track when they swing over to the left? Would have been much easier to stay right and have the inside of turn one.

[myownalias]

I do believe that stewards give more leeway in tricky conditions; I believe that drivers are punished more harshly in general because of modern F1's Health & Safety mentality; I would prefer the Lewis Hamilton incidents in Monaco to be declared as racing incidents but that's not the way F1 works today. I love Stirling Moss' comments about the Canadian GP; "motor racing is a dangerous sport, if you don't want danger, then you should go fishing or something..." when commenting on the two hour red flag situation, saying in his day they'd just keep driving!

[bud]

Well, that was stop and start.

Haven't read the thread,

Massa putting it into the wall was inevitable really, at least he showed some pace though. Alonso getting punted off didn't help, I guess the stewards gave leeway because it was wet, Hamilton's move on Webber was unpunished as well I think, and it was almost the same incident.

Jenson didn't get a penalty for either the Hamilton or Alonso incident? But he served a drive through for something, can't remember what. Think I blame Jenson mainly for both those incidents though.

Exciting race though.

It seems Vettel's getting a lot of criticism for slipping up? I didn't think he would, but s*** happens.

Every point you brought up is to do with lack of penalties? Im glad they allowed racing as they were all just racing incidents. Not worthy of any punishments.

[vaptin]

Well, that was stop and start.

Haven't read the thread,

Massa putting it into the wall was inevitable really, at least he showed some pace though. Alonso getting punted off didn't help, I guess the stewards gave leeway because it was wet, Hamilton's move on Webber was unpunished as well I think, and it was almost the same incident.

Jenson didn't get a penalty for either the Hamilton or Alonso incident? But he served a drive through for something, can't remember what. Think I blame Jenson mainly for both those incidents though.

Exciting race though.

It seems Vettel's getting a lot of criticism for slipping up? I didn't think he would, but s*** happens.

Every point you brought up is to do with lack of penalties? Im glad they allowed racing as they were all just racing incidents. Not worthy of any punishments.

I thought top of everyones list for stewards was consistency?

It's not really racing if drivers have to retire because another driver drove into them, Lewis's incident in particular could have easily been avoided on Jenson's part.

The incidents with Lewis and Webber and Alonso and Jenson, reminded me of Vettel and Webber in Turkey last year, if I was watching this grand prix in the 2010 season I wouldn't be expecting a penalty, but seeing the penalties handed out so far, those looked certain to me.

[Flynn]

Jenson was like the terminator out there. He's the first driver to press Sebestien into a mistake. His pace was incredible, people used to say smoothness was his speciality, bullpoo, everything is his speciality, he is one of the greatest drivers out there, up there with Lewis et al.

[Fact Man]

It was a crazy race, no doubt about it. I am a little pissed at the fact that Alonso was robbed again of a chance of winning (Monaco & Canada).
Well, one can assume that the incident with Button was a racing incident and unfortunately that ruined Alonso's race. He was about to pass JB and who knows he could have at least made it to the podium or even better we could have seen a battle between FA and SV.
Seeing that Vettel made a mistake in Canada, who knows he could have made one in Monaco if Alonso kept the pressure on him and the race did not get red flagged.
But if Button did not deserve a penalty according to the stewards, then where is the consistency? They can't penalize one driver in one race, and let another one off the hook in another race. Both incidents with Hamilton and Alonso were mostly Button's fault, yet he walks away with no penalties. Also, why did they wait till after the race to investigate them when there was plenty of time to make those decisions during the race.
Button had the pace to pass a lot of cars but he was about to be overtaken by Alonso! Yes he made it all the way from the back but was helped a lot by all the safety cars. I think that after the race restarted , if there were no more SC, it was less likely for Button to win and considering that Alonso was going to pass him, he might have finished 2nd at best.
Anyways, I would like to see consistency from the stewards. Either they should let the drivers race or should have the same mind set regarding all the drivers during all races.

[nikon133]

But if Button did not deserve a penalty according to the stewards, then where is the consistency? They can't penalize one driver in one race, and let another one off the hook in another race. Both incidents with Hamilton and Alonso were mostly Button's fault, yet he walks away with no penalties. Also, why did they wait till after the race to investigate them when there was plenty of time to make those decisions during the race.

I think you are simplifying things a bit... All those incidents might look the same as seen on TV, but claiming that they are exactly the same... it is pretty hard to figure that out based on what we see on TV as small variables can make huge difference... At least I'm hoping stewards have more data to work with when deciding on such matters.

Regarding this race, Lewis accepted responsibility for accident with Button, and I haven't heard from Alonso but I would expect Ferrari to be much more vocal should they have any real concerns regarding foul play. Even Lauda blasted Lewis' "irresponsible" driving but hasn't mention Button, much as I am aware.

So... While I agree they cannot penalize one driver in one race, and let another one off the hook in another race for exactly the same incidents, I don't think you can have exactly the same incidents on different tracks and under different weather conditions.

[nikon133]

The Red Bull chassis will win the championship not Vettel.

Tell that to Webber!

True I was expecting more from Webber this season.

I don't think he is happy at all at the moment.

He did say he is having a problem to adapt to new tires. If he is, in general, slow adapter, theory about him excelling in second half holds water.

[acosmichippo]

But if Button did not deserve a penalty according to the stewards, then where is the consistency? They can't penalize one driver in one race, and let another one off the hook in another race. Both incidents with Hamilton and Alonso were mostly Button's fault, yet he walks away with no penalties. Also, why did they wait till after the race to investigate them when there was plenty of time to make those decisions during the race.

I think you are simplifying things a bit... All those incidents might look the same as seen on TV, but claiming that they are exactly the same... it is pretty hard to figure that out based on what we see on TV as small variables can make huge difference... At least I'm hoping stewards have more data to work with when deciding on such matters.

Regarding this race, Lewis accepted responsibility for accident with Button, and I haven't heard from Alonso but I would expect Ferrari to be much more vocal should they have any real concerns regarding foul play. Even Lauda blasted Lewis' "irresponsible" driving but hasn't mention Button, much as I am aware.

So... While I agree they cannot penalize one driver in one race, and let another one off the hook in another race for exactly the same incidents, I don't think you can have exactly the same incidents on different tracks and under different weather conditions.

^^^This.

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

The Red Bull chassis will win the championship not Vettel.

And, naturally, the Red Bull chassis was developed with absolutely no input from Vettel.

[What's Burning?]

I do believe that stewards give more leeway in tricky conditions; I believe that drivers are punished more harshly in general because of modern F1's Health & Safety mentality; I would prefer the Lewis Hamilton incidents in Monaco to be declared as racing incidents but that's not the way F1 works today. I love Stirling Moss' comments about the Canadian GP; "motor racing is a dangerous sport, if you don't want danger, then you should go fishing or something..." when commenting on the two hour red flag situation, saying in his day they'd just keep driving!

There were about 300 thousand fans that would have agreed with him. It rained pretty much for 3.5 hours after the start, it was drizzling all morning long, but actual time when it was raining hard enough to cause a red flag was about an hour. I think their intent was to wait it out since it did clear up and run a full race rather than a half race with half points. In the end, it was a phenomenal GP.

DRS whaaaa?