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[riminovZ]

This is my first year watching Formula 1. I have started to notice that, especially with regard to the mid-tier teams like Renault, Sauber, and Force India, it may be an advantage with these Pirelli tires to post one qualifying lap and sit out the rest of qualifying. These teams seem to benefit from having the extra tires. In Australia, Sutil qualified 16th and finished 9th, and Heidfeld qualified 18th and finished 12th. This has been happening all year, including Webber's amazing 18th to 3rd in China. So what I am asking is, is it an advantage for some teams to only post one lap in qualifying and save the tires for the race?

[vlad]

Well, it depends from team to team, driver to driver. Each track has it's own characteristics, and that's a lot of calculating. But, top teams will always have a good race pace, you can count on that.


Pozdrav, Zvonimire!

[riminovZ]

That is true. As a new fan, it is almost becoming boring to watch Vettle win every race, usually with a McLaren right behind him.

[vlad]

Well, not if you're a Vettel fan!

[riminovZ]

Is it usual for someone to dominate like Vettle? Is he really that good, or is he just hot right now? 5 out of 6 is really impressive.

[What's Burning?]

The answer is that what you're watching this year is not or has not been the norm in years past. But like Vlad said, it depends on the track the drivers the teams. No matter how many fresh tires they've got left, we're not going to be seeing Lotus finishing in 8th place because of tire strategy. In a track like Monaco however, because passing is so difficult for current F1 cars, qualifying position still means plenty.

HEY! One question at a time! You're opening up a huge can of worms with that Vettel question, read through a few of the prevailing opinions on that subject there are a few juicy Vettel threads.

BTW give yourself a proper introduction in the intro section.

[riminovZ]

give yourself a proper introduction in the intro section.

Will do, thanks.

[texasmr2]

After thinking about this I would like to add that with today's Tilke 'no passing' track design's and the massive effect the current aero rules are effecting the car's qualifying is very very important. Did that make sense ??

[acosmichippo]

The problem with these observations is that there's no control to compare them to. You are comparing them to other teams, when we should be comparing each driver to himself. So, in the case of Webber's 18th to 3rd... where would he have finished if he started 11th? 5th? 3rd? 1st?

It depends greatly on the actual position they get. If a driver makes it to Q3, breaks out a brand new set of options for a couple hot laps, and only qualifies in p10, i'd say they are at a disadvantage to the driver who qualified in p11 who did not have to use that extra set AND can start the race on whatever set of tires they choose. With this in mind, i think it's fair to say that the drivers with the best chance of having a good race are the ones who qualified at the top of their respective qualifying session: P1, P11, P18. Vettel fits into this, Webber's 18th to 3rd race fits in here, heidfeld's 18th to 12th, and Sutil's 16th to 9th is not far off.

I'd be curious to see a graph of the change in positions based on each driver's original starting position. I might do that later.

[riminovZ]

acosmichippo, I love your avatar picture.

[f1ea]

The answer is that what you're watching this year is not or has not been the norm in years past. But like Vlad said, it depends on the track the drivers the teams. No matter how many fresh tires they've got left, we're not going to be seeing Lotus finishing in 8th place because of tire strategy. In a track like Monaco however, because passing is so difficult for current F1 cars, qualifying position still means plenty.

[acosmichippo]

acosmichippo, I love your avatar picture.

heh. thanks. I have it in t-shirt form too.

just to illustrate (poorly) what I was talking about in my previous post... i think the graph might look something like this (maybe a little more chaotic and less exaggerated):

[scotty]

I think the answer is no. Performances like Webber's are bad reference points for this year's tyres because he did have the fastest car, and it's not like it's anything new for a guy in a quick car to go for broke and get from the back of the grid right up to the front. For example, one race last year Alonso got from dead last up to 6th. At Monaco. That's just one easy example, there's loads more!

At the front it's a major benefit being further ahead (again, still) because gaining track position is easier at the start of the race itself, and having track position gives a fair few easily exploitable advantages when it comes to strategies, or more to the point, if you don't have track position you can be compromised from not being able to run maximum pace during a stint which allows those that do have position to be able to build up a gap. This is something that's becoming a common theme with Vettel being able to escape in races while others squabble behind him...

[acosmichippo]

I had some time tonight to make this graph.



Also keep in mind that the bars are much bigger as you go back because there are simply more places ahead to overtake, and especially at the very back because of retirements, shunts, etc. With that in mind, i created an "adjusted" graph, which i did by just taking the average number of positions gained and divided that by the number of possible positions to be gained (P1 cannot gain any positions, P2 can only gain 1, P3: 2, P4: 3, etc). So it gives more of a relative percentage. I'm not 100% sure of the logic, so i'm open to criticism, but it does help even-out the graph.



You can see bumps at P10 P15 and P16 which goes against what i would think would happen if tires make a bigger difference than grid position. I would have expected those places to be much lower than P11 and P18. But i'll be interested to see how this fleshes out throughout the season.

[What's Burning?]

I think there are just too many variable to accurately chart. You're probably right that whatever trends will show, would be clearer towards the end of the season as the extraneous factors average out, the biggest of which is that some drivers are simply better suited for certain tracks than others, the same for certain cars.