FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[deMuRe]

You'll believe whatever you want/are hypnotised into anyway. If you tell a lie for a certain period of time you'll believe it is true.

McLaren Fan you’re on a roll.
You've been spinning your lie for a while now & it looks like you have well and truly convinced yourself.
Good on u, you’ve just proven your own point

Several people on this forum have proven in recent months how Ferrari has shafted the rest of the teams.

I must have blinked, I did not read anything close to proving it except for a few posts which were "based on ifs, buts, maybes, rumours, vendettas and grudges, flimsy evidence and supposition + Jealousy & Assumptions"

Several people on an internet forum? They can prove nothing.

Max's points were good ones, never before has a team had such intimate details on how another team operates and McLaren are lucky they are the only ones taking the fight to Ferrari at the moment.

It was in Ferrari's best interests to keep McLaren in F1, if they have no competition nobody would watch F1.

I feel if there were more teams at Ferrari's/McLarens level there would no longer be a commercial need to keep McLaren in F1 and they would have been banned for good.

[texasmr2]

True Ferrari and McLaren, imho, are what drive's F1 these day since there is no more Brabham, Lotus and Tyrell to name a few. Let's all just pray that lesson's have been learned, on both side's, and for the '08 season they will let ALL decision's be made on the track and not in the court's.

[McLaren Fan]

True Ferrari and McLaren, imho, are what drive's F1 these day since there is no more Brabham, Lotus and Tyrell to name a few. Let's all just pray that lesson's have been learned, on both side's, and for the '08 season they will let ALL decision's be made on the track and not in the court's.

Sadly, with the FIA at the helm there is no guarantee of that.

[texasmr2]

The FIA will be with us till the end so we must learn to deal with that. The FIA is now the scape goat due to the fiasco's of '07 and the opinion that Ferrari run's the FIA's decision process. I agree with everyone that Ferrari seem's to have alot of pull with the FIA's decision's with is very unfair to F1 in general. We all have our personal solution's to fix that, I would really like the FIA to take the fan's concern's and complaint's into consideration. If they were smart and wanted only the best future for F1 they should consider a public voting process as to who sit's on the board of director's. Then we would only have ourselve's to blame.

[bud]

Several people on an internet forum? They can prove nothing.
Max's points were good ones, never before has a team had such intimate details on how another team operates and McLaren are lucky they are the only ones taking the fight to Ferrari at the moment.

Never before? can Max or you categorically say that this has never happened on this level before? If you can youre a clarevoyant!!!!

[darwin dali]

McLaren are penalised for supposedly favouring Hamilton over Alonso and have an inspector at the final race of the season to ensure things are equal between them. Meanwhile, other teams, most notably Ferrari, have a number one and number two driver policy and have given one driver priority over the other in terms of equipment, time and strategy. Why weren't these teams penalised? Why was there a massive outcry about McLaren's punishment on this matter in the Formula One community? You'll believe whatever you want/are hypnotised into anyway. If you tell a lie for a certain period of time you'll believe it is true.

Because it's a team sport and one of the Ferrari drivers didn't have any chance anymore to win the title while the other still had. That's different from the McLaren situation where both drivers still had a shot at the title and none should have been given priority - duh!

Jealous of Ferrari? No. Ferrari may be the oldest team in the sport, a nice touch but so what? What did they do all of those years? The only team I come close to being jealous of is Lotus. They did ten times more than any other team in advancing Formula One. Another thing, Ferrari don't have the monopoly on passion. Overall, I'm extremely comfortable and proud of my views on Formula One and my allegiance to McLaren.

This lie doesn't become truer by repeating it. Just today I read the following on F1live:

Nigel Mansell used the first modern semi-automatic gearbox in the history of F1 in the 1989 Brazilian Grand Prix on the Ferrari 640.

This type of transmission provided a concrete answer to a problem that was as old as the hills: each time the clutch is disengaged and then reengaged is a period when the power of the engine is not being transmitted to the track. The Scuderia bet on lightning-fast changes to gain several seconds over a race distance, a significant amount. The system invaded the paddock after a difficult debut due to sorting out problems with the hydraulic linkage.

The appearance of semi-automatic gearboxes also modified F1 driving techniques in depth. It led to the generalisation of left-foot braking, the disappearance of the clutch pedal and in addition, the driver could keep both his hands on the wheel. It also played a major role in making engines more reliable, preventing over-revving or clutch damage. In short, it revolutionised F1.

[bud]

revolutionised F1 to the point where it took away driver skill! thanks Ferrari thank you !!

[Mikep99]

Jelous of Ferrari? No. Ferrari may be the oldest team in the sport, a nice touch but so what? What did they do all of those years? The only team I come close to being jealous of is Lotus. They did ten times more than any other team in advancing Formula One. Another thing, Ferrari don't have the monopoly on passion. Overall, I'm extremely comfortable and proud of my views on Formula One and my allegiance to McLaren.

I find it funny when people criticize Ferrari for not being innovative when from day dot they have done everything in house - Design/engineering/manufacture/testing etc.
Which other team can say the same & have been so succesful to boot

Would you be as proud if your team was know as the McLaren/Daewoo

[McLaren Fan]

Because it's a team sport and one of the Ferrari drivers didn't have any chance anymore to win the title while the other still had. That's different from the McLaren situation where both drivers still had a shot at the title and none should have been given priority - duh!

Sorry. You've totally missed the point. I'm sick, sore and tired of typing the same old thing out again and again.

This lie doesn't become truer by repeating it. Just today I read the following on F1live:

Nigel Mansell used the first modern semi-automatic gearbox in the history of F1 in the 1989 Brazilian Grand Prix on the Ferrari 640.

This type of transmission provided a concrete answer to a problem that was as old as the hills: each time the clutch is disengaged and then reengaged is a period when the power of the engine is not being transmitted to the track. The Scuderia bet on lightning-fast changes to gain several seconds over a race distance, a significant amount. The system invaded the paddock after a difficult debut due to sorting out problems with the hydraulic linkage.

The appearance of semi-automatic gearboxes also modified F1 driving techniques in depth. It led to the generalisation of left-foot braking, the disappearance of the clutch pedal and in addition, the driver could keep both his hands on the wheel. It also played a major role in making engines more reliable, preventing over-revving or clutch damage. In short, it revolutionised F1.

I thought somebody may say that, however, it's only one major development out of dozens. Compare Ferrari, McLaren, Williams or anybody to Lotus. They're all insignificant in comparison.

[bud]

Would you be as proud if your team was know as the McLaren/Daewoo

are you proud of Ferrari being a FIAT?

[Mikep99]

Would you be as proud if your team was know as the McLaren/Daewoo

are you proud of Ferrari being a FIAT?

Its all done in Maranello bud the home of Ferrari. All Ferrari expertise & development, FIAT just bank roll it.
Good try but not the same thing at all.

And I am proud it is 100% Ferrari & Italian

[bud]

Would you be as proud if your team was know as the McLaren/Daewoo

are you proud of Ferrari being a FIAT?

Its all done in Maranello bud the home of Ferrari. All Ferrari expertise & development, FIAT just bank roll it.
Good try but not the same thing at all.

And I am proud it is 100% Ferrari & Italian

well in your scenario do you suggest F1 engines to come out of Korea? nice try!

but without FIATs money Ferrari would be long gone. so they are very FIAT

im glad youre a Proud Italian, thought you were Australian

[texasmr2]

I find it funny when people criticize Ferrari for not being innovative when from day one they have done everything in house - Design/engineering/manufacture/testing etc.
Which other team can say the same & have been so succesful to boot

I have wanted to say that from day one, thank's Mikep99. It's an undisputeable fact so any argument raised against it is imho frivolous and kinda narrow minded. LOTUS was great but their true innovating died along with Colin Chapman or the attempt at 'active suspension'.

Disclaimer: I like and respect all other team's in and throughout F1 history. These view's are strictly mine and at no time are they that of Forumula1.com . No animal's were hurt during this statement nor were any F1 team's or fan's ego's meant to be subjected to bias.

[McLaren Fan]

I respect Ferrari's standing as the oldest team in the sport, their Italian soul and building all of the car. I would be lying if I said I didn't. However, what I cannot stand are the blinkered views from most Ferrari fans about FIAT's role and that Ferrari have some sort of monopoly on history and passion in Formula One. I think it's offensive to the other teams and people who have done so much for the sport, more than Ferrari, a fact which the Tifosi must understand. Gregg seems to be the one exception to this, however, I'm not sure what he means by mentioning Lotus' demise. Without FIAT God knows where Ferrari would be.

[texasmr2]

I set Ferrari and Lotus upon the same pedestal and mere word's cannot express my love for Lotus or how much I miss them. We all know that Lotus's contribution to F1 was very significant, if my word's were taken as demise I appologize, I just meant that the steady stream of significant innovation's from Lotus stopped after CC's passing. The 'active suspension' was ground-breaking it's too bad their budget could not support it's further developement.

I think you are correct also concerning FIAT's backing and without it Ferrari's 'bad year's' would have caused even greater hardship's. I do believe though, or want too in my own little world , that someone else would have come along to make sure they were still able to compete in F1, maybe Alfa Romeo since they were the basis of Ferrari's intro into car manufacturing and racing.