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#248183
And besides, I'd like to hear some insights as to whether RB's pull rod suspension could have been tweaked in a fashion that makes it at least partly responsible for what's going on. Isn't one of the advantages of pull rod suspensions that they allow the car to be closer to the ground and help lower the C of G?
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By smokin
#248184
I fail to see where that article is compelling - I've watched the video several times...


The movement isn't huge, but its clearly there. They suggest looking at the nose camera, personally I see it more clearly by staring at the very front edge of the nose that you can see.

Can't see it. :confused:
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By f1ea
#248186
I fail to see where that article is compelling - I've watched the video several times...


The movement isn't huge, but its clearly there. They suggest looking at the nose camera, personally I see it more clearly by staring at the very front edge of the nose that you can see.


yup; after braking, the nose moves up... its only a little bit, but it moves. You will only notice it on 3 occasions: at the beginning on entry to t1, about mid-lap (where button passed massa for the penalty) and again after the pit straight into t1. thing is, it was doing the same last yr :confused:
#248189
It's easier to see it the second time into T1 I think
#248203
IMO there is certainly grounds for the FiA to investigate this.

Passing tests does not mean your car is legal. If you rob a bank, your a thief even before the police get enough evidence to try and then successfully convict you. The article purporting that Charlie says the RB7 is legal is a misrepresentation, what CW says is they haven't found anything .... yet.

However, there is a tide in the media starting on this, and I don't see it slowing down. Here is yet another compelling article coming down against the RB7.

Red Bull probably shot themselves in the foot when they put in such a crushingly great Q time with one of their cars. It was clear, no matter how good Seb is as a driver, that there was something very unusual about his car.

Is there a prima facie case against RB - a definite yes. There are two ways that I think they may be breaking the rules. Tech regulations 2011, article 3.17.8. It is very clear that the nose moves or appears to move while the car is in motion. Second part is that, if the leading edge of the wing ever goes lower than the plank (reference plane) this would also be a breach of the rule (in fact this would be a breach of last years rule and - could throw the FiA a huge problem if they decided to test the RB6 for this). Here is the reference for my second possible breach.

Is there an argument to say that it only moves a little so that should be ok, or the rules don't specify a measurable distance/quantity? Well, quite simply no. When you think about it, that's silly. If you go down that path, then what other things are acceptable, engines can rev an extra 500 because that's a small amount, or, we can drop off a kilo or two here and there because that's small? Perhaps we change the weight distribution a tiny amount, or make my rear wing just a a centimeter or so wider - nope, the "it's only a little bit" argument is ridiculous.

To be fair, if the nose moves, it should be declared illegal. There is no argument that cheating is being clever or that it is sour grapes from other teams. Being brilliant is working within the rules. Body parts are not allowed to move - period. If you design body parts to move, then you're cheating.

If the nose moves and it isn't declared illegal then the winners will be Red Bull and the teams with the money to copy it - McLaren and Ferrari. The biggest losers will be the teams who just don't have endless supplies of money to throw around - that would be a big injustice.


i think even if the fia investagate, still think it will pass the test.....
By Gaz
#248231
I fail to see where that article is compelling - I've watched the video several times...


my god you are such a rbr/vettle fan boy.

Its it clearly springs up as he brakes.
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By bud
#248240
Hmmm I put a ruler to the camera and it doesn't change position from this angle through out the lap. Needless to say im not dismissing that the nose is moving just this video isnt proving it.
#248242
I fail to see where that article is compelling - I've watched the video several times...


The movement isn't huge, but its clearly there. They suggest looking at the nose camera, personally I see it more clearly by staring at the very front edge of the nose that you can see.


To really notice the movement, it helps if you put your mouse cursor tip right at the edge of the front camera winglett, and then watch it as it brakes for a corner... the wing moves about one or two pixels past your mouse cursor tip.

EDIT: use windows magnify if you've got it as a mouse option.
#248245
And besides, I'd like to hear some insights as to whether RB's pull rod suspension could have been tweaked in a fashion that makes it at least partly responsible for what's going on. Isn't one of the advantages of pull rod suspensions that they allow the car to be closer to the ground and help lower the C of G?


The pull rod suspension allows the suspension components to be positioned lower so lower the cog, other than that i'm not sure if it allows for significantly different suspension geometry.
#248252
I fail to see where that article is compelling - I've watched the video several times...


The movement isn't huge, but its clearly there. They suggest looking at the nose camera, personally I see it more clearly by staring at the very front edge of the nose that you can see.


To really notice the movement, it helps if you put your mouse cursor tip right at the edge of the front camera winglett, and then watch it as it brakes for a corner... the wing moves about one or two pixels past your mouse cursor tip.

EDIT: use windows magnify if you've got it as a mouse option.

This works. If you do this, the camera springing up by a few pixels is clearly noticeable
By Gaz
#248257
And besides, I'd like to hear some insights as to whether RB's pull rod suspension could have been tweaked in a fashion that makes it at least partly responsible for what's going on. Isn't one of the advantages of pull rod suspensions that they allow the car to be closer to the ground and help lower the C of G?


The pull rod suspension allows the suspension components to be positioned lower so lower the cog, other than that i'm not sure if it allows for significantly different suspension geometry.


the Wing is moving independently of the rest of the car in the video.
By Gaz
#248262
I cant see it, might try it on a bigger monitor.


Its Very Sublet but it appears the whole nose cone moves up.

Its more obvious a few corners after the first breaking zone so watch the whole video.
#248267
This GIF makes it a little easier to see :-)

Pretty condemning as well as compelling.

RB7.gif
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By Gaz
#248268
This GIF makes it a little easier to see :-)

Pretty condemning as well as compelling.

RB7.gif


how many seconds/frames are those two images apart?

Regadless it proves the WHOLE NOSE is flexing.
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