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[zurich_allan]

In fact, it's not in my nature to give information unsubstantiated - so lets have a look at some factual evidence. I've taken a few times from testing that can be compared (this is built on the assumption that the fastest time from each driver at each test was in comparable circumstances (i.e. low-ish fuel run on similar tyres), or if not in individual cases, then across the field it would balance out. I've not even gone for first test compared to last, because they were at different tracks. I've gone for times from day one the first Barcelona test in February compared to times from the last test day of testing at Barcelona in March. Let's see:

Vettel - 1.27.374 to 1.22.933 - 4.4 second improvement

Alonso - 1.25.485 to 1.21.614 - 3.8 second improvement

Schumacher - 1.27.512 to 1.21.268 - 5.7 second improvement

Kobayashi - 1.25.641 to 1.22.315 - 3.3 second improvement

Di Resta - 1.26.575 to 1.23.653 - 2.9 second improvement

Alguersuari - 1.25.638 to 1.22.675 - 3 second improvement

Barrichello - 1.26.912 to 1.22.233 - 3.3 second improvement

Average just of these drivers / cars (seven different teams) = 3.77 second improvement


Logically therefore, the HRT ought to be able to find AT LEAST 3.77 seconds of pace given that the first Barcelona test was NOT the first test of the season, and thus every team that had already shaken down their 2011 car prior to the first Barcelona test would have already improved and found some pace before even coming to Barcelona...

Do you care to say that HRT will be different to literally every team on the grid and not improve their pace once they've got some miles (from practice sessions) and data under their belts? If so, I'm afraid you are the one having a laugh...

[zurich_allan]

If they don't qualify for the race they should alteast be able to run a test session to get SOME data otherwise they will be falling further and further behind

Agreed that they should be given some test time, however HRT ought to be able to find substantial pace fairly quickly, likely not at the next GP, but the one after (as the data they'll have got from the 20 min quali session won't be great, but info from 3 practice sessions at the next GP (circa 4 hours track test time effectively for them) should provide them with plenty to work on.

Of course every team around them will find pace, but it tends to be smaller margins of pace through the season itself (McLaren 2009 aside!) - the initial leaps and bounds of big chunks of time are usually pre-season - effectively the stage HRT are currently at. HRT do have some experienced design staff now, so as I maintain - as long as they have the funding to keep going for the first few races even if they don't qualify for the next - their situation should improve well before race 4 / 5.

[myownalias]

The problem for HRT (on top of their financial issues) is the moving target that is F1; no doubt the rest of the teams will gain some more time before we arrive at the next grand prix. And the bigger teams, Red Bull, McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes will move forward (in lap time) much more than teams like HRT, Virgin and Team Lotus, simply because they have many more resources.

[Hammer278]

I'm actually more concerned about Virgin. HRT are on the way up, they just need some time to understand their car, like McLaren did.

Virgin on the other hand....are still in their own world with their CFD nonsense. When every other team on the grid focus on CFD as well as Wind Tunnel testing, the arrogance of Virgin thinking they know better has got them falling off the pace more and more. I think HRT will beat them again by the end of this year. By hook or by crook.

[Robert12010]

In fact, it's not in my nature to give information unsubstantiated - so lets have a look at some factual evidence. I've taken a few times from testing that can be compared (this is built on the assumption that the fastest time from each driver at each test was in comparable circumstances (i.e. low-ish fuel run on similar tyres), or if not in individual cases, then across the field it would balance out. I've not even gone for first test compared to last, because they were at different tracks. I've gone for times from day one the first Barcelona test in February compared to times from the last test day of testing at Barcelona in March. Let's see:

Vettel - 1.27.374 to 1.22.933 - 4.4 second improvement

Alonso - 1.25.485 to 1.21.614 - 3.8 second improvement

Schumacher - 1.27.512 to 1.21.268 - 5.7 second improvement

Kobayashi - 1.25.641 to 1.22.315 - 3.3 second improvement

Di Resta - 1.26.575 to 1.23.653 - 2.9 second improvement

Alguersuari - 1.25.638 to 1.22.675 - 3 second improvement

Barrichello - 1.26.912 to 1.22.233 - 3.3 second improvement

Average just of these drivers / cars (seven different teams) = 3.77 second improvement


Logically therefore, the HRT ought to be able to find AT LEAST 3.77 seconds of pace given that the first Barcelona test was NOT the first test of the season, and thus every team that had already shaken down their 2011 car prior to the first Barcelona test would have already improved and found some pace before even coming to Barcelona...

Do you care to say that HRT will be different to literally every team on the grid and not improve their pace once they've got some miles (from practice sessions) and data under their belts? If so, I'm afraid you are the one having a laugh...

but my only quipe is this, they didnt find any pace last year, and they wont this year, and they should leave now before its ridiculous and im glad that the fia didnt allow them to race too

[Denthúl]

but my only quipe is this, they didnt find any pace last year, and they wont this year, and they should leave now before its ridiculous and im glad that the fia didnt allow them to race too

Your comparison is unfair. Last year there was no car development whatsoever, and yet still they managed to finish ahead of Virgin. This year they are able to develop their car, so it's quite possible that they will find some pace.

[Robert12010]

but my only quipe is this, they didnt find any pace last year, and they wont this year, and they should leave now before its ridiculous and im glad that the fia didnt allow them to race too

Your comparison is unfair. Last year there was no car development whatsoever, and yet still they managed to finish ahead of Virgin. This year they are able to develop their car, so it's quite possible that they will find some pace.

well i put that down to luck

[Denthúl]

but my only quipe is this, they didnt find any pace last year, and they wont this year, and they should leave now before its ridiculous and im glad that the fia didnt allow them to race too

Your comparison is unfair. Last year there was no car development whatsoever, and yet still they managed to finish ahead of Virgin. This year they are able to develop their car, so it's quite possible that they will find some pace.

well i put that down to luck

Perhaps it was, but the fact is, they were able to maintain pace enough to be in a position to capitalise on any misfortune on Virgin Racing's part which allowed Hispania to creep ahead.

[What's Burning?]

I guess in a way, they're in a better to be talked about than not be talked about situation. They need funding which we don't know really where they are with that... the fact that the Toyota deal didn't go through means they're not too healthy but if they've got enough cash for the first 4 rounds of this year or for that 5th round back in Spain, I do believe they'll be able to perform.

Their competition is Virgin, which has a built in Sponsor name recognition and will have long term financial commitment from Marussia because of the interest in a Russian GP, two things that HRT do no have. I agree that their car may be fundamentally better and it was good to see what an established F1 driver could squeeze out of the car. They missed the 107% by a small margin given that it was the car's shakedown, and it had not turned a wheel previously.

I'd like to see them succeed (meaning stay on the grid) but they'll need funding and or sponsorship.

In my opinion though, they're very ripe for the picking, a manufacturer or a racing name wanting to get into the sport will probably take notice.

[Jensonb]

That may be true but HRT have to get within the 107% qualifying rule; how fast they are on race day is irrelevant if they can't pass the qualifying hurdle, sponsors are going to want the maximum exposure and if HRT can not make it onto the starting grid (how many casual viewers watch FP and Q?); then additional sponsorship is nothing but a dream!

Marussia Virgin Racing already got within the 107%, if the HRT is faster than them, they would obviously be within the 107%.

In fact, assuming HRT can get the cars running for Practice in Malaysia, it's Marussia Virgin who are at greater risk of being DNQs.

I'm actually more concerned about Virgin. HRT are on the way up, they just need some time to understand their car, like McLaren did.

Virgin on the other hand....are still in their own world with their CFD nonsense. When every other team on the grid focus on CFD as well as Wind Tunnel testing, the arrogance of Virgin thinking they know better has got them falling off the pace more and more. I think HRT will beat them again by the end of this year. By hook or by crook.

I think you're right. The Marussia Virgin is properly bad. I said it almost as soon as it took to the track in Australia. And I stand by it. Woeful Cosworth Engine, pitiful Xtrac drivetrain, CFD-developed evolution of the already pi**-poor also-CFD-developed Virgin Racing from last year...And they have like no money.

[killem2]

I was surprised to see virgin so low on the line up, their pockets are deeper than Red Bull, and could throw tons of money at their car.

As far as HRT I would love to see them succeed, but sadly I don't think they can cut it.

[Jensonb]

I was surprised to see virgin so low on the line up, their pockets are deeper than Red Bull, and could throw tons of money at their car.

Let's get one thing clear. Marussia Virgin Racing is not Virgin. Nor is Virgin Media actually Virgin. Virgin are rich because they do almost nothing. They just license their name for the most part. So Marussia Virgin Racing are in pretty constant poverty.

[scotty]

I echo the comments supporting HRT's potential. They did a bloody good job in Melbourne all things considered.

They were even running their old front wing (that hasn't been upgraded for a YEAR!), and the new one will be on the car in Malaysia. I would expect that alone to bring a sizable performance leap...

As for Virgin, they are in more trouble, as backward as that might seem. Glock is clearly becoming disillusioned at the team given what he's said to the press lately, and if they lost him they'll struggle imo. To be fair Glock's considerable ability is wasted in the car, he's good enough to run at the front of the midfield with ease.

[killem2]

I was surprised to see virgin so low on the line up, their pockets are deeper than Red Bull, and could throw tons of money at their car.

Let's get one thing clear. Marussia Virgin Racing is not Virgin. Nor is Virgin Media actually Virgin. Virgin are rich because they do almost nothing. They just license their name for the most part. So Marussia Virgin Racing are in pretty constant poverty.

I could have swore the Virgin Tycoon was at one of the races last year and martin brundle spoke to him or something. And if I have my stellar wiki research ( ) correct he is the one who founded Virgin the media conglomerate.

[Jensonb]

I was surprised to see virgin so low on the line up, their pockets are deeper than Red Bull, and could throw tons of money at their car.

Let's get one thing clear. Marussia Virgin Racing is not Virgin. Nor is Virgin Media actually Virgin. Virgin are rich because they do almost nothing. They just license their name for the most part. So Marussia Virgin Racing are in pretty constant poverty.

I could have swore the Virgin Tycoon was at one of the races last year and martin brundle spoke to him or something. And if I have my stellar wiki research ( ) correct he is the one who founded Virgin the media conglomerate.

Virgin Media is hardly a media conglomerate, nor did he found it. He founded Virgin. Which was originally a record company. They sold the record company some time ago. Virgin Media came much later. It was previously called NTL:telewest. Virgin kind of bought it, then sold it almost immediately, but continue to license the name. That's how they do practically everything. Likewise, they funded Virgin Racing and gave it their name, but they do not own it outright. Last year, they held an 80% stake, but they do not have the controlling stake any more. Marussia, the Russian car manufacturer, owns the controlling stake - I don't call them Marussia Virgin for fun, Marussia is running the show. The team is even officially considered to be a Russian entry. Virgin, you will notice, is British.

The team's name is a misnomer. They are called Marussia Virgin, but they are in fact, Virgin Marussia. Virgin is little more than a sponsor now. Why the inaccurate name? To avoid changing the chassis name and thus retain the TV Revenues due to Virgin. Just like why Lada is called Lotus Renault GP even though Renault have nothing to do with the team any more.