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[texasmr2]

Yep Massa is out of the WDC hunt but I like his mojo and think he will do what he can for the team as a whole.

[racechick]

No I recognise the team element, I recognise the WCC. There is also a WDC.

Yes, there is a WDC. And you know what... Massa is out of it. He was out of it in Germany, and Alonso was POSSIBLY in it. And this is not just you and i discussing this. THE WHOLE PADDOCK KNEW THAT. Including Ferrari management.
Hence ferrari made the decision. As a result now Alonso has some posibilities, and Massa is still out of it.

Dislike what you want about it... makes perfect sense.

Hmm, now let me think. why was he out of it in Germany?

[vaptin]

No I recognise the team element, I recognise the WCC. There is also a WDC.

Yes, there is a WDC. And you know what... Massa is out of it. He was out of it in Germany, and Alonso was POSSIBLY in it. And this is not just you and i discussing this. THE WHOLE PADDOCK KNEW THAT. Including Ferrari management.
Hence ferrari made the decision. As a result now Alonso has some posibilities, and Massa is still out of it.

Dislike what you want about it... makes perfect sense.

Hmm, now let me think. why was he out of it in Germany?

He was out of it going into Germany more or less and it would've overall benefited the team to have Alonso first as he was closest to the WDC leader but still far enough behind to really need every point he could get, its the "team mate taking points of you" scenario.

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

It's a Ferrari family tradition. In the mid-70s, when Clay Regazzoni was il numero due to Niki Lauda, Regazzoni was famous/infamous for driving what the motoring press termed "the world's widest Ferrari."

[texasmr2]

It's a Ferrari family tradition. In the mid-70s, when Clay Regazzoni was il numero due to Niki Lauda, Regazzoni was famous/infamous for driving what the motoring press termed "the world's widest Ferrari."

[f1ea]

Hmm, now let me think. why was he out of it in Germany?

For the same reasons Alonso was ALMOST in the verge of being out. With the added: Struggling with the hard tires and to find consistent pace.

Alonso and the team made mistakes in the first half. But his pace has always been consistent. Massa's been incosistent with HIS OWN PACE (as well as the team's stuff and/or whatever mistakes). Look for the races. Yes, Massa has had a few good races, but on the times he was ahead Alonso it was by a reasonable margin, and on the race you could say even. Even in Turkey, which was a track Massa outdid Alonso reasonably.

However, when Massa's been struggling he's been considerably behind Alonso. And to give you one example: Alonso fighting for the win, while Massa gets outdone for P4 by a half-ailing struggling Mclaren!

Sorry... if I were a team principal, i would not bet on the struggling guy who is behind on points. That's what Mclaren fans would want, and Ferrari dont care about.

[racechick]

Hmm, now let me think. why was he out of it in Germany?

For the same reasons Alonso was ALMOST in the verge of being out. With the added: Struggling with the hard tires and to find consistent pace.

Alonso and the team made mistakes in the first half. But his pace has always been consistent. Massa's been incosistent with HIS OWN PACE (as well as the team's stuff and/or whatever mistakes). Look for the races. Yes, Massa has had a few good races, but on the times he was ahead Alonso it was by a reasonable margin, and on the race you could say even. Even in Turkey, which was a track Massa outdid Alonso reasonably.

However, when Massa's been struggling he's been considerably behind Alonso. And to give you one example: Alonso fighting for the win, while Massa gets outdone for P4 by a half-ailing struggling Mclaren!

Sorry... if I were a team principal, i would not bet on the struggling guy who is behind on points. That's what Mclaren fans would want, and Ferrari dont care about.

Im not suggesting you 'bet' on Massa, let him have what he justly earned thats all. And as a Lewis fan Im not bothered really (bothered for Massa yes),but if Alonso wins in that way so be it.

[darwin dali]

It's a Ferrari family tradition. In the mid-70s, when Clay Regazzoni was il numero due to Niki Lauda, Regazzoni was famous/infamous for driving what the motoring press termed "the world's widest Ferrari."

Ah Clay, il svizzero con occhi bellissimi!

[vaptin]

The team are more interested in going for the championship, sometimes you have to be ruthless.

[texasmr2]

Too win sometimes one must be ruthless and if the said governing body cannot extract their cranium from their rectum who is really to blame?

[racechick]

Ruthless yes. Take chances yes. Wee wee on your team mate. Nah, devalues the win.

[vaptin]

Ruthless yes. Take chances yes. Wee wee on your team mate. Nah, devalues the win.

Maybe, but you can't really judge it like that, say Alonso's win in Bahrain, Vettel broke down and he inherited the win, is it less impressive than Singapore, yeah. But when the championship points are totalled up, the one with the most wins it and deserves it more than the others who competed.

[racechick]

Ruthless yes. Take chances yes. Wee wee on your team mate. Nah, devalues the win.

Maybe, but you can't really judge it like that, say Alonso's win in Bahrain, Vettel broke down and he inherited the win, is it less impressive than Singapore, yeah. But when the championship points are totalled up, the one with the most wins it and deserves it more than the others who competed.

Im not quite sure what you mean. An inheited win by a competitor breaking down, or a loss of a win due to your own breakdown, well thats just luck, its not manufactured. But Im not sure if thats what you meant?

[texasmr2]

Ruthless yes. Take chances yes. Wee wee on your team mate. Nah, devalues the win.

I would agree with that but I know for a fact that if it was Lewis you would be singing a different tune and don't you alway's enforce the idea that it's about the team and not the driver? Lets get real for the first time in that the team matters more than the driver and once we agree on that realization we will get along alot more swimmingly .

[vaptin]

Ruthless yes. Take chances yes. Wee wee on your team mate. Nah, devalues the win.

Maybe, but you can't really judge it like that, say Alonso's win in Bahrain, Vettel broke down and he inherited the win, is it less impressive than Singapore, yeah. But when the championship points are totalled up, the one with the most wins it and deserves it more than the others who competed.

Im not quite sure what you mean. An inheited win by a competitor breaking down, or a loss of a win due to your own breakdown, well thats just luck, its not manufactured. But Im not sure if thats what you meant?

Yeah, thats what I meant, but sometimes teams and drives manufacture their own "luck", was Jenson lucky in Australia? Yeah, but he took the gamble, was Lewis unlucky in Singapore, yeah but he took the gamble.

Was Alonso "lucky" that the team decided to get Massa to move over (and Massa unlucky?), sort off, but he also put himself in the position where he was stronger than his team mate in the WDC, and Massa had himself in the position of points wise being fairly behind his team mate, without much indication he'll catch up and out preforming to the extent the team needed for the WDC.

Was there not a lot of skill in winning that race? Not anything stand out (compared to normal f1 race winning standards), but the same can be said for Bahrain or when a driver with the fastest car gets on pole and runs away with the win.