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By Woodchip
#21572
Good job Mikep99. I've never looked at the WCC in this way.


I'll second that.

Looking at certain time periods is a complete sham, and it's clutching at straws.


Really, so a season with 5 races is the same as one with 19....???
Apparently so, especially when Ferrari are the only major manufacturer involved and all the others are built in someone's shed.
By Ron Dennis
#21574
i think this thread proves that there are three types of lies:-

Lies, damn lies and statistics!

And statistic's dont lie.
:lol:
User avatar
By texasmr2
#21576
i think this thread proves that there are three types of lies:-

Lies, damn lies and statistics!

And statistic's dont lie.
:lol:

Well they dont. I as much as everybody else know's your outlook on this matter RD all I'm saying is the record book's, no matter how tainted you or other's think they are, is all that really matter's in the grand scheme of thing's.
By Ron Dennis
#21585
Tex I am simply saying that statistics can be manipulted to show pretty much any darn thing you like - hence the saying lies, damn lies and statistics

I can show you statistics that clearly show McLaren are the most successful team of the 20th Century, and I am sure you could show me statistics to say that Ferrari were.

I dont hide my bias, and at times I am wrong. I like to think I am right more often....but I could be wrong!
User avatar
By texasmr2
#21592
Good post RD I appreciate you not taking mine as anything else other than my outlook.
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By darwin dali
#21669
Using the official site for each team I've worked out the number of race wins, world drivers', and world constructors' titles per each team's time in the sport. As the points system has changed so many times over the years it's a very dubious way of stating who is the most successful team ever. The results are to four decimal points.

McLaren:

Victories per Grand Prix Entry:

631 Grands Prix contested/155 victories = 4.0709

World Drivers' Championships won per seasons competed in:

41 seasons contested/11 victories = 3.7272

World Constructors' Championships per seasons competed in:

41 contested 10 victories = 4.1 OR 41 seasons contested/8 victories = 5.125

Ferrari:

Victories per Grand Prix Entry:

758 Grands Prix contested/201 victories = 3.771

World Drivers' Championships won per seasons competed in:

57 seasons contested/15 victories = 3.8

World Constructors' Championships per seasons competed in:

49 contested 15 victories = 3.2666 OR 49 seasons contested/13 victories = 3.7692
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Given the political influence of Formula One, I think it's reasonable to use the second set of figures pertaining to the constructors' title. Therefore, McLaren have more victories per Grand Prix entry, regardless of your views on the politics of the sport; Ferrari are first in terms of more drivers’ titles being won per season entered, again, regardless of the politics; If you believe, as I do, that McLaren really have ten constructors’ titles, they are first. If you believe McLaren have only eight Ferrari are the most successful in that department.




This is the most disingenuous post I've seen in a while from somebody who has absolutely no idea what he's talking about, i.e., statistics! :x

You title your stats with Victories per GP entry, but then go ahead and divide the GP entries by the victories - exactly the opposite of what you claim to show with your calculation. Of course this way McLaren appears to look better because the resulting number is higher. However, it's the wrong number and actually means GP entries per victory, i.e., how many GP's did they need to achieve a victory (and the lower the number, the better the performance, so compare McLaren and Ferrari and weep).

The correct stats would be (I just did it for victories, but you can do it for the rest if you like):

155 victories per 631 GP contested = 0.2456 for McLaren

and

201 victories per 758 GP contested = 0.2651 for Ferrari.


I strongly suggest to stick your nose into this (or similar) book http://tinyurl.com/yv8cba
before you post ANY other stats of yours laced with amateurish mistakes.
By Ron Dennis
#21675
all this fighting talk
By Mikep99
#21700
Good job Mikep99. I've never looked at the WCC in this way.


I'll second that.

Looking at certain time periods is a complete sham, and it's clutching at straws. Which is all McLaren fans have to clutch to these days.

Ferrari have been able to keep it alive in F1 longer then anyone else, which is a hard thing to do. Teams come and go but Ferrari have stood the test of time.

These McLaren fools are turning me into a Ferrari supporter, I'm finding myself constantly jumping to Ferrari's defences because I simply can't let logic so flawed be posted without a response.


deMuRe were trying to debate with children here.
I am a Ferrari fan but I hope I am at least 90% unbias in the way I look at things.
If I am sticking up for the Ferrari cause here its only because of these McLaren losers making every excuse under the sun.
:lol:
By Mikep99
#21702
i think this thread proves that there are three types of lies:-

Lies, damn lies and statistics!


There is only one type of D Head & your it mate with a capital D
By Mikep99
#21709
Image=Image


I like it bud. Good quality............................... I especially like the thing after =
User avatar
By deMuRe
#21811
Good job Mikep99. I've never looked at the WCC in this way.

Ferrari have been able to keep it alive in F1 longer then anyone else, which is a hard thing to do. Teams come and go but Ferrari have stood the test of time.


Not that hard when FIAT buys out the majority shares way back when all other F1 teams notably in Britain were still all privately owned entrys.


I'll take my hat off to Williams, they are still a private team.

You can hardly call McLaren a private team these days. I'm sure once Ron steps down they will be owned my Merc.
By Ron Dennis
#21813
I think once Ron steps down the McLaren marque will vanish and we will see BMW's racing Mercedes racing Ferrari racing Honda racing Toyota racing Renault.....
User avatar
By texasmr2
#21822
I think once Ron steps down the McLaren marque will vanish...

Man I hope that does not happen it would be a tragedy and a severe loss to F1.

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