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#215002
Yeah, i was wondering what happened to Sutil. Why did he stop twice?

I think he had a collision on the first lap.

Hulkenberg is finally showing us some good stuff; I always liked him in GP2, but when he got in F1 he was slower than expected, I guess.
Now he is beginning to show what he can do.
I hope he continues like this.
By roo59
#215009
after watching the Italian Grand Prix i cant help but feel that Red Bull are trying to sabotage Mark Webbers championship hopes, :confused:
it may sound ridiculos i know,
but how many more poor decisions are the Red Bull strategists going to make, :confused:
after Hamilton was knocked out of the race they immediately should went to work trying to figure out how maximise Webber's advantage in the championship
instead they give the best pit strategy to guy whos running 4th in the championship, makes no sense to me ,what were they thinking, honestly Horner needs to pull his head in :irked:
and to top it off Vettel gets a new engine and Webber doesn't ????? i mean wt..... :bs:
WAKE UP RED BULL and start supporting the guy who has run better all year
User avatar
By scotty
#215010
Merged with existing GP thread.
#215014
after watching the Italian Grand Prix i cant help but feel that Red Bull are trying to sabotage Mark Webbers championship hopes, :confused:
it may sound ridiculos i know,
but how many more poor decisions are the Red Bull strategists going to make, :confused:
after Hamilton was knocked out of the race they immediately should went to work trying to figure out how maximise Webber's advantage in the championship
instead they give the best pit strategy to guy whos running 4th in the championship, makes no sense to me ,what were they thinking, honestly Horner needs to pull his head in :irked:
and to top it off Vettel gets a new engine and Webber doesn't ????? i mean wt..... :bs:
WAKE UP RED BULL and start supporting the guy who has run better all year

Not the team's fault; all down to that brilliant strategist, Vettel.

Identifies Webber as a significant threat - takes him out in Turkey. Think how far ahead Mark would have been if he'd won there?

Realises Button's on a run and takes him out at Spa. Jenson would have been leading the WDC at this point if not for that DNF.

Knows that the stewards will help Hulkenberg delay Webber's charge so he opts to stop out on the same tyres until it's safe to pit and still retain his place.

Yep, everyone thinks he's a loose cannon, liable to explode at any moment with major collateral damage, but it's all part of his brilliant master plan to eliminate his rivals. Not sure he's worked out how to actually end up as WDC himself but I'm sure something will come to him.
#215022
AKR would tell you with a straight face that Luca Badoer was a great driver. :P

The other day, I was doing some work around the house, and I cut my finger. When I bled, it was the color RED. I think this Tifosi thing is contagious.


It's good to see anyone showing their support for their team like the Tifosi, but also the Macca, RB and all the other teams' fans.
Without them watching we'd be pretty lonely. :)
#215033
Overall this was a great race to watch. I really enjoyed it.
My first comment is that the real stars of the day, for me, were the Tifosi. I've seen it so many times, but the Tifosi at Monza, well, there's just nothing like it in the world, the after race celebrations, the giant "prancing horse" flag on the track, stupendous!
Next, Monza, what a circuit. I won't get into a is it the best in the world, I'll just leave it that it is unique and produces great races and everyone wants to win there.
Obviously a great day for Ferrari, the team and their drivers. They have been under a lot of media pressure recently, they soaked it all up and channeled that into positive energy. Superb strategy backed by an excellent pit stop gave Ferrari the win. For Fernando an excellent drive, clearly the fastest driver on the track and thoroughly deserved the win. Felipe again proved to be a match for Fernando on the soft tyres, they traded fastest laps, and, on the softs Jenson was also trading times with them. But on the hards, Fernando proved to be clearly faster than both Felipe and Jenson. All fastest laps were done on the prime tyre and Fernando was nearly half a second faster than both Felipe and Jenson on that tyre.
2 other winners on the day were the FiA Championships - both invigorated by this Monza result.
McLaren, I think the team suffered from indecisiveness. They definitely had the fastest car coming to Monza this year and most would have penciled in a 1-2 for the team. I really think their F-Duct non-decision was their downfall. Hindsight (always makes it easier) says they should have done what Ferrari and RB did, create a special, Monza-only rear wing/F-Duct solution. Ferrari and RB both made small F-Ducts with flatter rear wings (but not as flat as the normal Monza rear wing would be). Jenson was decisive and reaped the rewards. It could so easily have been a win to him. His strategy from the start was perfectly executed, he knew he had the best entry to turn one and he knew that once he hit speed he'd get added traction from the high downforce setup. He planned it and it worked perfectly. Nothing more needs to be said about Lewis's crash, another mistake and he gets punished for it this time. Lots of people have said that McLaren had to really perform at Spa and Monza, because the rest of the circuits will suit the RB and Ferrari's F10s more. There might be a small amount of truth in this, but, I'm sure it won't be that significant. baring development break-throughs, the Maccas will definitely be at the pointy end of qualifying and race day for the rest of the season.
RB came to Monza in a "damage control" mindset. Mark just wanted points and to stay in touch, Seb wasn't quite as in sync with the team plan because he wanted to turn his season around. If Mark doesn't win the WDC this year, he will look to his race starts. What is going on here? I know he works hard on the RB simulator and, its supposed to be pretty good, but I just wonder if there is some significant difference between the car and the sim that is could be contributing here, ie the sim is practicing him the "wrong" way? It's only been this season it has been such a problem for him. They need to iron this out asap to give him his best chance at winning the WDC. Seb drove a good race and the team strategy proved really clever. This makes twice this year running super long stints (to nearly the race end) has paid off - Kobayashi and Seb.
Lap times are really interesting. Fernando (fastest) and Mark were in a class of their own just a little over a tenth between them. Rosberg continues to make his car outperform its apparent capabilities and, he returned the 3rd fastest lap although his was already a third of a second behind Fernando. Seb was next but just a few thousandths behind. Then we get a gaggle of four in this order Kubica, Massa, Hulkenburg then Button. Although they are only separated by a few hundredths, they are all nearly half a second a lap off the leader. Another race where Fernando is doing times much faster than Felipe, but, I still believe Felipe is not back to his best after his accident.
Lastly I'd like to comment on Hulkenburg holding up Mark. Some people have said that the rule needs refining. I tend to disagree. The rule is fine, it is just its selective implementation that is the problem. The rule clearly state a driver cannot benefit (gain or maintain a position) by going off track. No need to clarify or change that. The question is, why wasn't it used? Although the media in the UK doesn't seem to be giving Charlie Whiting's performances much coverage, it is a very different story in the rest of Europe and Asia. Now, with the WMSC waging into the debate and backing Ferrari's claim that team orders have been used by other teams but ignored by the officials there is probably good reason to review the position of race director and stewards to raise their performance to at least acceptable and gain some consistency here. Drivers have to go through a lot to get their super licenses, perhaps it's time the officials have to train, study and be tested. At the same time, just as was done in cricket, we could get a better spread of representation. I know some will say that Lewis will have benefited the most by Hulkenburg not being penalized (being allowed to hold Mark up), I would really feel for Mark if he ended up loosing the title by a point having seen this obvious penalty go begging.
Last edited by spankyham on 13 Sep 10, 04:19, edited 1 time in total.
#215038
Wow, man. Use paragraphs.

He did use paragraphs, just with the blank line between them missing! In the grand scale of things; missing line breaks aren't that important!
User avatar
By smhasan7
#215043
Overall this was a great race to watch. I really enjoyed it.
My first comment is that the real stars of the day, for me, were the Tifosi. I've seen it so many times, but the Tifosi at Monza, well, there's just nothing like it in the world, the after race celebrations, the giant "prancing horse" flag on the track, stupendous!
Next, Monza, what a circuit. I won't get into a is it the best in the world, I'll just leave it that it is unique and produces great races and everyone wants to win there.
Obviously a great day for Ferrari, the team and their drivers. They have been under a lot of media pressure recently, they soaked it all up and channeled that into positive energy. Superb strategy backed by an excellent pit stop gave Ferrari the win. For Fernando an excellent drive, clearly the fastest driver on the track and thoroughly deserved the win. Felipe again proved to be a match for Fernando on the soft tyres, they traded fastest laps, and, on the softs Jenson was also trading times with them. But on the hards, Fernando proved to be clearly faster than both Felipe and Jenson. All fastest laps were done on the prime tyre and Fernando was nearly half a second faster than both Felipe and Jenson on that tyre.
2 other winners on the day were the FiA Championships - both invigorated by this Monza result.
McLaren, I think the team suffered from indecisiveness. They definitely had the fastest car coming to Monza this year and most would have penciled in a 1-2 for the team. I really think their F-Duct non-decision was their downfall. Hindsight (always makes it easier) says they should have done what Ferrari and RB did, create a special, Monza-only rear wing/F-Duct solution. Ferrari and RB both made small F-Ducts with flatter rear wings (but not as flat as the normal Monza rear wing would be). Jenson was decisive and reaped the rewards. It could so easily have been a win to him. His strategy from the start was perfectly executed, he knew he had the best entry to turn one and he knew that once he hit speed he'd get added traction from the high downforce setup. He planned it and it worked perfectly. Nothing more needs to be said about Lewis's crash, another mistake and he gets punished for it this time. Lots of people have said that McLaren had to really perform at Spa and Monza, because the rest of the circuits will suit the RB and Ferrari's F10s more. There might be a small amount of truth in this, but, I'm sure it won't be that significant. baring development break-throughs, the Maccas will definitely be at the pointy end of qualifying and race day for the rest of the season.
RB came to Monza in a "damage control" mindset. Mark just wanted points and to stay in touch, Seb wasn't quite as in sync with the team plan because he wanted to turn his season around. If Mark doesn't win the WDC this year, he will look to his race starts. What is going on here? I know he works hard on the RB simulator and, its supposed to be pretty good, but I just wonder if there is some significant difference between the car and the sim that is could be contributing here, ie the sim is practicing him the "wrong" way? It's only been this season it has been such a problem for him. They need to iron this out asap to give him his best chance at winning the WDC. Seb drove a good race and the team strategy proved really clever. This makes twice this year running super long stints (to nearly the race end) has paid off - Kobayashi and Seb.
Lap times are really interesting. Fernando (fastest) and Mark were in a class of their own just a little over a tenth between them. Rosberg continues to make his car outperform its apparent capabilities and, he returned the 3rd fastest lap although his was already a third of a second behind Fernando. Seb was next but just a few thousandths behind. Then we get a gaggle of four in this order Kubica, Massa, Hulkenburg then Button. Although they are only separated by a few hundredths, they are all nearly half a second a lap off the leader. Another race where Fernando is doing times much faster than Felipe, but, I still believe Felipe is not back to his best after his accident.
Lastly I'd like to comment on Hulkenburg holding up Mark. Some people have said that the rule needs refining. I tend to disagree. The rule is fine, it is just its selective implementation that is the problem. The rule clearly state a driver cannot benefit (gain or maintain a position) by going off track. No need to clarify or change that. The question is, why wasn't it used? Although the media in the UK doesn't seem to be giving Charlie Whiting's performances much coverage, it is a very different story in the rest of Europe and Asia. Now, with the WMSC waging into the debate and backing Ferrari's claim that team orders have been used by other teams but ignored by the officials there is probably good reason to review the position of race director and stewards to raise their performance to at least acceptable and gain some consistency here. Drivers have to go through a lot to get their super licenses, perhaps it's time the officials have to train, study and be tested. At the same time, just as was done in cricket, we could get a better spread of representation. I know some will say that Lewis will have benefited the most by Hulkenburg not being penalized (being allowed to hold Mark up), I would really feel for Mark if he ended up loosing the title by a point having seen this obvious penalty go begging.



hey, rather than searching the net for brief and silly blogs by so called pundits, why shouldn't I just read your posts. Man you covered nearly every driver and very precisely and also loved your conclusions. really made for good reading.

By the way I am new to this forum, just registered today. so all the guys, hello from my side, and just like you all, i am F1 Fanatic
User avatar
By smhasan7
#215044
By the way guys just wondering if anyone of you have got the sector times Fernando did on his last lap in quali which he eventually abandoned. Looks like he was pretty quick on it too, maybe slightly better or matching his previous one.
User avatar
By smhasan7
#215049
He probably abandoned it to save the 6 extra kilometres that the engine would have done



Yup but he was pretty quick on that too, i looked at the live timing but I was also monitoring what others were doing so didn't really pick it up but I reckon it was darn quick too, so if anyone of you got it , pls post it

also his inlap before his pitstop was 0.575 quicker than Jenson's which made a huge difference. goes to show how quick he was in clean air
User avatar
By Flux
#215074
Red Bull has revealed it was a brake problem that slowed Sebastian Vettel on lap 20 of the Italian Grand Prix and nothing to do with his engine.

Vettel told his team over the radio that his car was losing engine power and the resulting dip in lap time allowed team-mate Mark Webber to power by. Just two laps later, Vettel was back up to pace but four seconds behind his team-mate.

Team boss Christian Horner later clarified that the problem was not caused by the Renault engine.

"At first we thought one of his visor tear-offs might have flown into the airbox, but it now looks as though his brakes were momentarily binding, probably as a result of hitting a kerb [too hard]," he said.

Post race analysis of Vettel's car confirmed it was due to the brakes.

http://en.espnf1.com/italy/motorsport/story/28284.html?CMP=OTC-RSS

there you go.
By vaptin
#215079
Andrew Benson's blog is up: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson ... ost_1.html

There were a lot of question marks hanging over Fernando Alonso and Ferrari before Sunday's Italian Grand Prix, his first since joining the team.


Both Alonso and Ferrari responded in style, with the Spaniard delivering the sort of remorseless, flawless performance that used to be his stock-in-trade. This was vintage Alonso, far from the mistake-prone, apparently vulnerable figure he has been this year.

Alonso has driven some great races this season - especially his comeback drives in Australia, China and Monaco - but most of them have come as he made up for errors that put him further down the field than he should have been.

The mistakes, which Alonso himself admitted in the course of this weekend, have come as he over-reached in a car that for a lot of the year has been close to the pace required to battle for the championship but not quite close enough.


Rarely more than a second behind, Alonso had two huge moments - one in the second Lesmo, the other in Parabolica - as he fought in the turbulent air behind the McLaren to get close enough to have a go at passing Button.

He never quite managed it, so the result came down to the pit-stop period. Alonso was 0.96 seconds behind Button on the lap before the McLaren made its stop, and praised his mechanics for a superb pit stop - 0.8secs faster than McLaren's - for getting him out ahead.

"I pushed 100%, the pit stop felt so quick," he said. "I stopped, they changed tyres and there was a green light. I didn't even have first gear in, so physically there was not time to do all the buttons and they had finished the pit stop. So a big thanks to the team. Most of the thanks for the win is to the mechanics."

He's actually selling himself short, though. The stop on its own, good as it was, was not quite enough to get him ahead. He also produced a fabulous in-lap - 0.575secs faster than Button's.


Alonso pointed out that Hamilton was still second despite crashing out in Monza - a luxury Alonso himself still does not have.

"Hamilton was leading and after this race with no points he is still fighting with no risk," Alonso said. "For us, if we make a mistake we are out of it.

"We need to find some consistency because this was a good weekend but Spa was bad and we cannot afford to have these bad weekends, we need to be on the podium all the time. Sometimes we are not doing 100% and that is what we have to concentrate on."


As good as Alonso was at Monza, Button matched him. But staying ahead was always going to be difficult when the Ferrari was the faster car and victories often hang on the fine margins displayed at Monza. But we've covered him before - and the story on Sunday was Ferrari.

The race was a blow for Hamilton and Webber, both of whom looked seriously hacked off afterwards.

Hamilton was right to say his was the sort of mistake that loses championships, but it was also his first serious one all year, and he remains in a strong position.
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