FORUMula1.com

[kerc]

ii'm hoping for rain

Why are you hoping for rain? ah i know, Jenson can only win in the rain, it's pathetic really, he makes so many dumb excuses it's getting embarrassing.


Same car as your teammate Jenson, shut up and drive instead of criticizing your team, if it was Lewis making the same statements the press and these forums would be all over him, i guess you really aren't as good as everyone likes to think you are.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 807305.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Do I hear barking?

Sounds more like whining to me .

I didn't mean Jenson.

[EwanM]

Gee. Webber is pretty pissd at the issue with the front wing he got from the team...

That is total bs from Red Bull. The crazy thing is that Webber is actually faster than Vettel.

Vettel broke his front wing in FP3 so Red Bull give him Mark's one. Rich.

Red Bull Racing team principal Christian Horner insists that Mark Webber was not 'stitched up' by his team in qualifying for the British Grand Prix, after the outfit was plunged in to a fresh favouritism controversy.

Just three races after Red Bull's handling of the Turkish Grand Prix collision between Webber and Sebastian Vettel prompted suggestions that the outfit was deliberately favouring its German driver, the outfit has again had the spotlight thrown on to it.

This time, it is because the team opted to take a new front wing design off Webber's car before qualifying and hand it to Vettel because his own had broken in the final free practice session.

After Vettel took pole position, Webber was left visibly annoyed in the post-session press conference - and cheekily suggested that at least the team would be 'happy' with the result today.

Horner moved quickly, however, to defend the decision – saying that he felt the outfit had a duty to hand the wing to the driver who was leading the championship. He also suggested that there was no lap time difference between the two designs.

When asked whether the team's move meant Vettel was now officially the favoured driver, Horner said: "I don't think so. I think that you could see today that the performance today between the guys was very, very close and very, very tight.

"Unfortunately we found ourselves in a situation with only one front wing of a certain specification which was slightly different in characteristics. Both drivers tried it yesterday and one had a better preference for it over the other. And it was tried by both again this morning.

"Unfortunately sometimes I have to make a difficult decision – and with only one wing available and the facts to hand that we had, and based on championship position – which was the criteria that we used – that wing went to Sebastian today."

Horner said that if the team was adopting a policy to favour one driver over the other then it would not even have let Webber have the wing in the first place.

"We don't plan to have a scenario like this," he said. "If we were favouring one driver we would give that driver a spare wing as well. We would not run with having two available to one driver.

"We will continue to support both drivers in the best and absolute fairest way that we can. But on some occasions you have to make a difficult decision, and today was one of those instances."

Horner denied that the front wing decision had left the team open to fresh accusations of favouritisms – coming so close after Turkey.

"I don't think so," he said. "Our job is to do the best job we can as a team. Sometimes you have to make difficult decisions. It is the first time we have been in a situation where we have only had one component, and I am sure that happens up and down the pit lane.

"Obviously when you have two drivers running at the front, there is perhaps a bit more emotion attached to it. But if you take away the emotion and you look at the facts, it was an entirely logical thing to do."

When asked if he had some sympathy for Webber who may felt he had been stitched up, Horner said: "I don't think he was stitched up at all. It is a difficult situation where we haven't got two components. If I'd have given it to Mark you've the same situation in reverse."

He added: "Mark knows the way we operate as a team. He knows that with that decision there was no malice behind it. There was no manipulation. It was purely that we found ourselves with a single component and, from a team point of view, some days I have to make difficult decisions."

Thanks for posting that. Surely this is a bigger issue than McLaren's failure :p?

[Denthúl]

More bollocks from Mr. Horner. Brilliant.

[EwanM]

Someone needs to put Vettel's nose out of joint... oh wait...



ok I am milking the picture a little.

[Hexagram]

Surely this is a bigger issue than McLaren's failure :p?

You would think so wouldn't you.

Could you imagine if this had happened with McLaren. Button getting the new front wing from Hamilton after breaking his.

Or in Ferrari? Massa has his new front wing taken from him for Alonso who broke his!? Would love to read what RC would have to say about that.

[Denthúl]

I think James Allen has it spot-on.

Red Bull wing controversy – A decision that didn’t need to be taken

Posted on | July 10, 2010 | by | 1 Comment

The F1 paddock is abuzz this evening after Red Bull team principal Christian Horner took the decision to take the new front wing off Mark Webber’s car and give it to Sebastian Vettel for qualifying. It has triggered a new row about favouritism, which first reared its head after the pair collided in Istanbul.

The German went on to take pole position today ahead of his team mate by 0.14 seconds.


The difference between the two wings is quite clear, as you can see from these two pictures. The older one (pictured above on Webber’s car in the garage tonight) has a single vane on the outer end plate, the new one (below) has a double.


Another difference is a double vent in the side of the new wing, as opposed to a single vent on the one on Webber’s car. Webber said this evening that the team is still evaluating wings and felt that the new one was probably worth “about a tenth”. These things tend to be the product of many hours in the wind tunnel and significant investment. As as the airflow over the rest of the car is dictated by what comes off the front wing, it is quite a significant change.

Horner: Did he need to choose one driver to favour?

Horner said it was a “difficult decision” to prioritise one driver and one he took based on championship position and performance in practice.

But it is a decision which didn’t need to be taken, in my view, as there was no obvious threat from outside the team to pole position, so better to let them fight it out fairly between them. Ferrari’s Fernando Alonso was just under two tenths slower in the final free practice session, but the Red Bulls always step up the pace in qualifying and in the end the margin over Alonso was 0.8 seconds, which is huge.

The downside to the team harmony, by favouring one driver over the other in this way, far outweighs the fractional gain in performance from the new wing. Horner said this evening that they had to run the wing because Adrian Newey was very keen to use it, but in this case surely it could have been argued that it would only have been fair for both drivers to run without it.

Vettel in Practice 3 shortly before the new wing broke (Getty)

The fact that the wing physically had to be taken off Webber’s car and placed on Vettel’s when it had not been either driver’s fault that the original Vettel wing had broken makes it an impossible choice. Better to avoid the choice than create a potentially damaging rift.

And it goes further than that because if Vettel wins on Sunday and then goes on
to win the world championship, the Istanbul and Silverstone episodes will make the public feel that there was a finger on the scales in this championship battle and as we know from the Michael Schumacher era at Ferrari, that doesn’t play well.

McLaren boss Martin Whitmarsh said that a situation like this “would not happen in our team” and offered his view on it, ” I think if you are in a very strong position then even more cause to be as fair as you are with the drivers,” he said.

“The cohesiveness of the team is such that you don’t need to set up those kinds of tensions and if you are in a strong position you need to be careful to hold it together.”

Inevitably some people will read this and believe that it shows bias towards an English speaking driver, but if the positions were reversed it would still be wrong.

Sometimes the togetherness and morale of a sporting team is more important than a tiny bit of extra performance and this was one of those occasions.

[myownalias]

Ah yes, more favouritism controversy from Red Bull; it's pretty obvious to everyone that Red Bull favour Vettel. I was loving Eddie Jordan giving Horner a hard time on the BBC coverage, I think the BBC should get Paxman to interview Horner, that'd b fun! But the real talking point is JB and his lack of pace; was it a setup issue on Jenson's part or was he simply struggling to drive the car; we all know that JB is quick in a balanced car but struggles with a car that is difficult to drive; Lewis is a much better driver of an unstable car; I feel that Lewis gets the best of the a bad car much more than Jenson, wringing it's neck for every last 100th of a second.

[EwanM]

I agree with James Allen.


Anyways I've just read a Q&A with Eddie Jordan. Here are the most important quotes:

All the drivers love the first section of Silverstone through Copse, Maggotts and Becketts - and the good news for them is that part of the circuit hasn't been changed. The new section that has changed from Abbey back round to Brooklands is a bit bumpy. That's because when the track was laid there were fairly extreme weather conditions which froze up the ground and delayed the setting of the track. Silverstone should be able to sort that out, though. Generally, there has been a seal of approval from the drivers; they all like it apart from the bumps.

I think it's all too cosy between the two of them (Lewis and Jenson)... I'd like to see Button in particular have a more aggressive attitude.

The reintroduction of Kers for 2011 shouldn't be a huge problem as the drivers have all run with it before and they will adapt very quickly again. I do think there are easier ways to find a solution to overtaking without bringing in the adjustable rear wing, which for me is a surprise.

I change my glasses quite a lot as it's something I'm interested in. I've designed styles of glasses in the past too. The ones I wear now are extremely light; I choose different colours and get them made in Germany.

It would appear that he's (Fernando Alonso) not totally happy either with McLaren or Hamilton or both.

No, I don't take inspiration from Paxman, but I do like his questions.

He (Michael Schumacher) chose to come back and if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen.

[Hexagram]

Someone needs to put Vettel's nose out of joint... oh wait...



ok I am milking the picture a little.

[EwanM]

Eddie Jordan. Will someone give this man a chat show?

[scotty]

Actual lmfao if Red Bull had a batch issue with that new wing and Vettel's went tomorrow.

[Denthúl]

Actual lmfao if Red Bull had a batch issue with that new wing and Vettel's went tomorrow.

That would be hilarious. You know, as long as Vettel was okay after any possible accident.

[trailertrash]

That there dude Alonos will spend the hole race waying at folks what dont let him pas jest like he did in qualyifing..

[What's Burning?]

That there dude Alonos will spend the hole race waying at folks what dont let him pas jest like he did in qualyifing..

He done hollerin at em too, but you caint hear cuz of the helmut an all.

[f1ea]

I think James Allen has it spot-on.

Red Bull wing controversy – A decision that didn’t need to be taken

The fact that the wing physically had to be taken off Webber’s car and placed on Vettel’s when it had not been either driver’s fault that the original Vettel wing had broken makes it an impossible choice. Better to avoid the choice than create a potentially damaging rift.

Sometimes the togetherness and morale of a sporting team is more important than a tiny bit of extra performance and this was one of those occasions.

definitely

Webber had been really fast up until the last instant when Vettel grabbed pole. Maybe if Vettel had made a small mistake, the whole wing scenario would have been overlooked and still RB would have locked the front row.

Vettel better not go swimming in the ocean anytime soon....