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[cap-dude]

You have to admit, it is kinda true.

Red Bull should've been fast at Spa but it would seem perhaps the lack of a Merc engine hurt them. They also lost out to quite a number of reliability problems, whilst Mercedes engines. I think not a single faliure. Can't remember the last time a Merc engine actually failed.

[al4x]

i dont think vettel is as good as alonso or lewis, but possibly just behind them 2 and in front of the rest

[ivey]

yeah i'd like to see vettel as lewis' teammate. we've seen lewis and alonso in one team and they were practically equal

[Hexagram]

The Renault engine is roughly worth 9.8 seconds over a race distance with its low fuel consumption. If that is not the most competitive advantage engine wise this season I don't know what is.

The spark plug problem was also related to Red Bull's weird exhaust as the exhaust apparently made the car extremely hot and caused the spark plug failure in the first place.

I also question Red Bull's handling of the Renault Engine? How come the works Renault team last year had next to no engine issues and even Alonso looked strong at Spa if you remember?

Actually looking at Alonso's results in 2009 his only DNFs were wheel issues and the third that silly crash caused by Trulli/Sutil.

I think it is all too easy for Red Bull to point the finger at Renault everytime they have a failure, because Red Bull; the only other team on the grid using the same engine you do does not have these failures.

[cap-dude]

The Renault engine is roughly worth 9.8 seconds over a race distance with its low fuel consumption. If that is not the most competitive advantage engine wise this season I don't know what is.

But what good is that advantage when you lose out in quali, and get stuck behind another car the whole race.

I think the surprise of 2010 is that the race doesn't really matter. It's all about Quali right now.

[Trypt]

I think the surprise of 2010 is that the race doesn't really matter. It's all about Quali right now.

That's quite a thing to say after one race... And Bahrain to boot.. I think we better give F1 the benefit of the doubt and wait until at least a couple more races are done before making these types of conclusions.

[al4x]

The Renault engine is roughly worth 9.8 seconds over a race distance with its low fuel consumption. If that is not the most competitive advantage engine wise this season I don't know what is.

But what good is that advantage when you lose out in quali, and get stuck behind another car the whole race.

I think the surprise of 2010 is that the race doesn't really matter. It's all about Quali right now.

i think its been like that a fair few years now, which is a shame, but now with flat out quali, yep its way more about quali than race

[bud]

The Renault engine is roughly worth 9.8 seconds over a race distance with its low fuel consumption. If that is not the most competitive advantage engine wise this season I don't know what is.

But what good is that advantage when you lose out in quali, and get stuck behind another car the whole race.

I think the surprise of 2010 is that the race doesn't really matter. It's all about Quali right now.

Redbull took pole, wouldnt say they lost out in Q

[Hexagram]

The Renault engine is roughly worth 9.8 seconds over a race distance with its low fuel consumption. If that is not the most competitive advantage engine wise this season I don't know what is.

But what good is that advantage when you lose out in quali, and get stuck behind another car the whole race.

I think the surprise of 2010 is that the race doesn't really matter. It's all about Quali right now.

Redbull took pole, wouldnt say they lost out in Q

Ya. I really don't think there is that much of a power difference between Renault engines & Mercedes engines that Red Bull Racing like you to believe.

Alonso out qualified both Red Bulls last year at Monza when they were moaning about lack of power, he was way behind them in Spa but we had loads of cars suddenly doing brilliant as the low down force characteristics of the circuit suited them.

Also all RBR's complaints aside they should be happy now, Renault have been allowed to make a number of requested changes to their engine for the 2010 season.

Renault has been given approval to make a 'large' number of improvements to its engines for cost and reliability reasons, AUTOSPORT has learned, even though the FIA has ruled out any form of power equalisation for this year.

The French car manufacturer wrote to the FIA in the build-up to the season requesting a number of changes be made to its power unit - amid some suggestions that the FIA could even equalise engine performance for 2010.

This comes after Renault's customer partner Red Bull Racing openly felt it was unfair that not all engines were equal despite an engine freeze.

Red Bull Racing team principal Christian Horner said: "I think the problem is if you don't allow some development, then you freeze in an advantage for one team or a disadvantage for another.

"So there has to be a balancing of that, otherwise we will end up with Mercedes-powered cars winning all the races - which I think is not good for F1. And other manufacturers may choose to leave F1 off of the back of that.

"The engine isn't supposed to be a key performance differentiator and therefore hopefully the ruling body will balance out somewhat the differences there at the moment."

AUTOSPORT understands that the FIA decided against any move towards 'equalisation' because it felt there was not enough evidence to suggest there was a big performance difference between the various power units.

However, Renault has been told that it can make a number of changes to its engine for cost and reliability reasons - with all its requests in this area being approved by the FIA.

It is understood that further changes that were requested, which would have helped improve Renault's fuel consumption, were rejected because these were purely for performance reasons - and not on the 'fair' basis of the other changes that are open to all car makers

Renault team principal Eric Boullier said about the changes: "Like every manufacturer here, we have some allowance to fit our engine and have a better integration with the chassis.

"So, I think, out of the requests that were requested - some of them were quite tricky so the FIA was not positive, but I think most of them have been approved."

[Jamie]

In this case Lewis and his McLaren will be far more successful IMO than Vettel + a RedBull Merc will ever be

I don't know about that, if anything, Vettel has shown that he is a serious racer, perhaps better then Lewis.

Vettel has shown nothing of the sort. Vettel has so far proved only that he can lead from the front. Whenever he's been put in a situation that required actual racing, he's been exceedingly average, occasionally outright abysmal - going into huffs and/or throwing the car into the wall.

Agree!!

He is a good driver but he has the car. He can lead from the front and maybe pull away, but the sign of things getting hard he just seems to lose his head! He could of captured 3rd in the race despite what others say! as Brundle said!!! He had the car and he lost it and missed apects and so forth! Now Lewis would of carried on! And so would the likes of Alonso, but Vettel just made a huge thing of it and acted like a 4 year old! Not a pro and not the attitude of a WDC. This year will be between Alonso,Massa + Hamilton. Jenson will show promise more near the back end of this season.

[ivey]

Most likely it will be between Vettel, Massa and Alonso. I'm sad to say so, but McLaren just isn't quick enough to compete with Ferrari and Red Bull, even if they will be after 5-6 races, it's too late. I'm not being pessimistic, just realistic imo. 1 second is a LOT to make up in F1

[vaptin]

Mercedes probably were scared, but meh, it's their engines and their right.

[bud]

Most likely it will be between Vettel, Massa and Alonso. I'm sad to say so, but McLaren just isn't quick enough to compete with Ferrari and Red Bull, even if they will be after 5-6 races, it's too late. I'm not being pessimistic, just realistic imo. 1 second is a LOT to make up in F1

we will see after Melbourne. the 1 second gap had more to do with getting the wrong setup in Q. Their race pace was on par with Redbull and Ferrari.

[Jamie]

Most likely it will be between Vettel, Massa and Alonso. I'm sad to say so, but McLaren just isn't quick enough to compete with Ferrari and Red Bull, even if they will be after 5-6 races, it's too late. I'm not being pessimistic, just realistic imo. 1 second is a LOT to make up in F1

we will see after Melbourne. the 1 second gap had more to do with getting the wrong setup in Q. Their race pace was on par with Redbull and Ferrari.

Agree at one point Hamilton was a major threat to Alonso, it will be Lewis & Fernando in there own league in OZ. Massa trailing, i think he does not have the confidence to attack yet, but if he was not fighting in Bahrain then i would hate to see him fight in OZ.

[scotty]

Horner's at it again:

Red Bull pushes for engine equalisation

Red Bull Racing team principal Christian Horner has made a fresh plea to try and get engine performance equalised for next season - with his outfit now set to remain with Renault for 2011.

Horner has made no secret of the fact that he believes the Renault is down on power compared to the benchmark Mercedes-Benz - even though his unit may have advantages in terms of weight, driveability and fuel consumption.

A push last season to make all engines equal did not result in any action being taken, and Horner is now keen for the matter to be looked at again – especially as he believes the importance of power will become more important as rival outfits close in on the chassis advantage that Red Bull currently enjoys.

"I think if you look at basic studies you would say we are about three per cent down on power – which is probably about 30-35bhp," said Horner. "That is as much as four tenths per lap, but until you run all the engines in the same conditions on a dyno and do a fair and proper comparison you can never be sure.

"You often hear Ross Brawn talk about weight distribution, or the centre-of-gravity and cooling efficiency so on, and the more power you have the more heat you generate.

"But you need to look at all the aspects in a collective format. The most important thing moving forward is that chassis will for sure converge, as there is freedom within the regulations, and that is where the engines will become a bigger factor."

He added: "It is getting a bit boring. Through the regulations, there is nothing that specifically deals with engine equality, and that is the problem. I think it is acknowledged that there are differences and there is a format that was agreed last winter to evaluate the engines, which was agreed upon by all the manufacturers, but some of the teams stopped that from happening. We are back in to that situation."

Last season Red Bull Racing chased a deal with Mercedes-Benz hard for 2010, but that move was scuppered when the plans were blocked by McLaren – who had a veto right over Mercedes-Benz expanding its customer supply platform.

And with Mercedes-Benz having said recently that it did not plan to provide an extra team with engines for next year, Red Bull Racing looks set to agree terms with Renault for at least one more season.

"In terms of supply, we are very happy with the relationship we have with Renault," explained Horner. "They treat us very well, and we have a very good partnership with Renault.

"Unfortunately the product, due to the homologation, is frozen and therefore you have a performance freeze.

"Mercedes have made it transparently clear that they will not be supplying any additional teams for next year- so we rely on the FIA and the teams and manufacturers to create a healthy situation. It is not healthy to have a situation where one engine is significantly ahead of the rest."

When asked to respond to suggestions that although the Renault may be down on power, it does have advantages in other area, Horner said: "The Renault engine is a tidy engine; it is a good engine, as is the Ferrari.

"But I think horsepower is such an over-riding element that that would come at the top - you would trade any of those aspects for horsepower.

"In terms of fuel consumption, when you have less horsepower you burn less fuel as you generate less temperature. But if you take more horsepower and you run conservatively, you can end up at the same point, but you've got it for when you need it. It is a key element, absolutely."

Amusingly, his own words best describe this round of comments: "It is getting a bit boring."

The Cossie is widely regarded as having the most outright horsepower, so going off of what he's saying here, he'll do anything to get their engines in next year!