FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[darwin dali]

Ecclestone was locked in talks with team principals on Friday afternoon, and although the subject of their chat remains unknown, it is certain he will have impressed upon them in no uncertain terms the need to satisfy their paymasters.

"Don't be fooled," he said prior to the race. "We have been lucky with the rain. We have got to do something. For the first time the teams have realised that they have to do something about it. We don't need reverse grids, we just need more overtaking."

Asked how he would achieve that he said he would "make the front wing smaller and get rid of the double diffuser".

Then he thought for a minute. "Actually why not just get a beautiful girl in and draw out the drivers for the top 10 [on the grid]?"

It is unlikely to catch on, but his message to the teams was clear: the action had better improve – in all conditions – or else.

[ivey]

That way Lewis would get pole every single time lol.

Actually I'm really looking forward to next season when double diffusers are banned, because I'm pretty certain that they're one of the reasons overtaking sucks at the moment. But where is the source for these news?

[cap-dude]

No
If someone got drawn out as number 10 on the grid every race they'd be pretty pissed off.

[Denthúl]

Changes to the diffuser I can understand, but why make the front wing smaller? They've already lost grip at the front due to the tyre-width reduction...

[7UpJordan]

Get rid of Diffusers completely + widen the cars back to 1997 spec = everything's cushty.

Enough said.

[Frosty]

Reduction in overall downforce take out the double diffuser gives less downforce at the rear so to balance it take some downforce from the front as well. Aerodynamics need to make up far less of grip if we want to see more overtaking the aerodynamics need to go.

It's simple lets pretend a car has 50% of it's grip from aerodynamics and 50% from mechanical grip. So our pretend car is in a race and it's catching up another car when it gets about 1 second away from the car it's chasing it gets into the wake of the car ahead. Now that the pretend car is in the wake it looses some aerodynamic performance lets say half of it's original 50% so the car now has 50% mechanical grip and 25% aerodynamic grip a total of 75% but the car in front still has 100% grip so the pretend car now has less grip than the one in front and can no longer overtake it. Now if the cars had no aerodynamic grip then they wouldn't loose any when they reach the car's in front wake with both cars having 100% of their grip the faster car will overtake.

[hwang2000]

Yeah lets get rid of some areodynamics, but what we have got to do is make the teams design cars to overtake. Engineers are always looking to make the cars faster and hold road with arodynamics, so they will just keep finding other loopholes.

I say we need to make them look at overtaking in the cars design.

So we need to look at making them overtake to win the championship.

Say the top ten in Quali get championship points. then take the top 10 and put them in revese order to the back of the field. So 1st is last and 11 place would become pole.

For the race we should only have one tyre that will last two thirds of the race distace and only one compond. the top 10 in qualy all get one point more than if the had been in the race. So starting from the back and getting to 10th will still gets you more points than a win from 11th. We just need a points system to ensue there is no points advantage being 10th in the last Qualy and working your way to 1st, with the fastest on the grid receving less for a 10th place finish. I'm sure there is number crunchers that can make a fair system.

Now if your fastest in Quali and win your going to get say 51 points. while if you only got 11th in Qualy, dispaeared during the race you get 25 points. Just one rule, to get any points during the weekend you need to finish the race.

Will any ideas ever be looked at on this forum by Bernie.. I dont think so. but it is the public that pay to see F1 and without racing the way the public wish to see it, F1 will disapear. Not that Bernie needs to worry, he has made his money over and over!

I'm sure combining all the idea's on here will come up with better racing. I miss the days of Senna, Prost, Mansel. Maybe we should just rip up next years rules and make them race in the old cars and call it (historic) H1

[7UpJordan]

Yeah lets get rid of some areodynamics, but what we have got to do is make the teams design cars to overtake. Engineers are always looking to make the cars faster and hold road with arodynamics, so they will just keep finding other loopholes.

I say we need to make them look at overtaking in the cars design.

So we need to look at making them overtake to win the championship.

Say the top ten in Quali get championship points. then take the top 10 and put them in revese order to the back of the field. So 1st is last and 11 place would become pole.

For the race we should only have one tyre that will last two thirds of the race distace and only one compond. the top 10 in qualy all get one point more than if the had been in the race. So starting from the back and getting to 10th will still gets you more points than a win from 11th. We just need a points system to ensue there is no points advantage being 10th in the last Qualy and working your way to 1st, with the fastest on the grid receving less for a 10th place finish. I'm sure there is number crunchers that can make a fair system.

Now if your fastest in Quali and win your going to get say 51 points. while if you only got 11th in Qualy, dispaeared during the race you get 25 points. Just one rule, to get any points during the weekend you need to finish the race.

Will any ideas ever be looked at on this forum by Bernie.. I dont think so. but it is the public that pay to see F1 and without racing the way the public wish to see it, F1 will disapear. Not that Bernie needs to worry, he has made his money over and over!

I'm sure combining all the idea's on here will come up with better racing. I miss the days of Senna, Prost, Mansel. Maybe we should just rip up next years rules and make them race in the old cars and call it (historic) H1

I can imagine they will have to draw names from hats for the cars, imagine the reaction from one of the new drivers if they were given a car like the MP4/4 or the FW14B to drive?

[antoniob]

you guys are talking formula one, are you ?

[Frosty]

So we need to look at making them overtake to win the championship.

Say the top ten in Quali get championship points. then take the top 10 and put them in revese order to the back of the field. So 1st is last and 11 place would become pole.

For the race we should only have one tyre that will last two thirds of the race distace and only one compond. the top 10 in qualy all get one point more than if the had been in the race. So starting from the back and getting to 10th will still gets you more points than a win from 11th. We just need a points system to ensue there is no points advantage being 10th in the last Qualy and working your way to 1st, with the fastest on the grid receving less for a 10th place finish. I'm sure there is number crunchers that can make a fair system.

Now if your fastest in Quali and win your going to get say 51 points. while if you only got 11th in Qualy, dispaeared during the race you get 25 points. Just one rule, to get any points during the weekend you need to finish the race.

Will any ideas ever be looked at on this forum by Bernie.. I dont think so. but it is the public that pay to see F1 and without racing the way the public wish to see it, F1 will disapear. Not that Bernie needs to worry, he has made his money over and over!

I'm sure combining all the idea's on here will come up with better racing. I miss the days of Senna, Prost, Mansel. Maybe we should just rip up next years rules and make them race in the old cars and call it (historic) H1

I don't think any of that extra stuff is needed the drivers have the drive to try and overtake they just need the equipment to allow them to.

[EwanM]

Every woman, every man... join the Caravan of Love!

[arkady]

I believe there's a simple (if a little pricey) solution to the overtaking problem.

FIA create a sample front wing, or, say, use the one from the previous years' championship winning car.

This wing is then distributed to all teams for reference during their design phase.

An aero package is legal as long as that wing produces more than a certain amount of downforce, placed a standard distance behind the car.
Simple, easy to check (in a wind tunnel...) and no loopholes.

Teams can then design their own front wings to be less susceptible to turbulence and performance drop will be minimised.

[senna4ever]

Change this, change that, increase power here, drop power there, do this do that. Every year we see new rules and new this and that, what for?

Leave the rules the way they are now and make no more changes at all. Only if a situation of severe safety is on the cards, should a rule or rules changes be consider, else, leave it alone!!

Just what will happen if all 22+ cars are equal? Will there be overtaking because if cars are at the same speed just how can there be overtaking? Is it not the variables such as different interpretation of the rules, different designs, different drivers, tyres, fuel loads, tyre compounds, etc that allow DIFFERENCE. If all is the same then all we will see is one highspeed procession with no overtaking, no close racing, no action.

As the drivers get use to the cars under the revised rules, their convidence allow them to push their cars to the limits, take on overtaking and working out ways to beat their team mate and then the next team, etc.

I think the authorities need to back off with this ongoing rules changes as it only allow the teams with money to get up to speed quicker whilst the team with lesser funds take longer to catch up and just when they do, the rules change again.

Let it be and allow racing to continue as it is now ........................

[antoniob]

How about .. No !! some of the past "sins" needs to rectified first and they need to start by untying the hands of the engine developers. Kill the DDD and bring back refueling. those three will bring a serious change.

[racechick]

How about .. No !! some of the past "sins" needs to rectified first and they need to start by untying the hands of the engine developers. Kill the DDD and bring back refueling. those three will bring a serious change.

"racing as it is now" well it was due to bad weather and screw-up qualiffying by the big teams-otherwise it would have been a procession of fastest cars at the front and better or more racey drivers unable to overcome the problems which have built up in F1, they havent even got refuelling so that strategy can overcome lack of track action. Needs a big rethink not silly tinkering.