FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Hanwombat]

Who said I was Glaswegian :p?

Well you live in Glasgow.

The English assume all Scots are Glaswegian.

Bloody scousers

I'm no bin Dipper i'm a Manc

Ahh I dont know any scousers... lucky me
Dont compare me with them

Im surrounded by farmer folks here

Cider Drinkers.

[Jensonb]

Blegh...Cider.

[7UpJordan]

Swiftly back on topic, I really hope this budget cap does get pressed through without this two-tiered system. A budget cap of say £80million should start things off nicely.

It'll give the newer teams a nice breathing space for whatever budgets they enter with, teams operating on shoe-strings like Williams the chance to show what they're good at with just a couple of coppers and a shilling, and for the teams who are capable of throwing money around a nice dilemma on how they're going to reduce their spending. Somebody on here mentioned a while back that Renault are already acting by using the wind-tunnel less and spending more time with a simple CAD computer program.

If the manufacturers are going to throw a panic and leave that's their bag, F1 can survive without them, it has before and it would only be a matter of time before they came crawling back as some kind of engine deal with privateer teams which took their places on the grid.

[Frosty]

Swiftly back on topic, I really hope this budget cap does get pressed through without this two-tiered system. A budget cap of say £80million should start things off nicely.

An £80 million budget cap excluding Drivers fees would be a great start I think all the teams would be able to work within that. Some of the bigger teams would have to maybe let go of a 3rd of their staff which would be a shame but Brawn bit the bullet earlier this year and did that. The problem is to get rid of the 2 tier system which I think everyone is against they would need Ferrari to agree to the budget cap and I'm not sure what price they would be willing to go for.

[7UpJordan]

If any staff were to be laid off, hopefully with the three new teams coming in next year a lot of the staff could find themselves new jobs there.

[scotty]

Swiftly back on topic, I really hope this budget cap does get pressed through without this two-tiered system. A budget cap of say £80million should start things off nicely.

It'll give the newer teams a nice breathing space for whatever budgets they enter with, teams operating on shoe-strings like Williams the chance to show what they're good at with just a couple of coppers and a shilling, and for the teams who are capable of throwing money around a nice dilemma on how they're going to reduce their spending. Somebody on here mentioned a while back that Renault are already acting by using the wind-tunnel less and spending more time with a simple CAD computer program.

If the manufacturers are going to throw a panic and leave that's their bag, F1 can survive without them, it has before and it would only be a matter of time before they came crawling back as some kind of engine deal with privateer teams which took their places on the grid.

Exactly. Like i said in the other thread, they've had their bluff called, yet are trying to change things under the guise of FOTA - to get the cap raised so their spending advantage isn't completely lost. I wouldn't like to see the cap go as high as £80m though, that would eliminate the point of it in my eyes...

[Frosty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

[Denthúl]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

But for some teams, £80m is still more than they spend (and possibly are able to spend). I think Force India spend less than that, and any new team entering the sport will likely be unable to make it to £80m, so wouldn't have any easy way of being competitive.

[scotty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

Then the top teams can operate under the uncapped rules until they sort themselves out...

[Frosty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

But for some teams, £80m is still more than they spend (and possibly are able to spend). I think Force India spend less than that, and any new team entering the sport will likely be unable to make it to £80m, so wouldn't have any easy way of being competitive.

I may be wrong but I think Force India do spend around the £80 million mark now, but I completely agree with you that new teams coming into the sport will probably struggle to even raise £40 million. That's why I think the budget cap is to small to fast and that it's also far to early to get new teams into the sport I would say bring the costs down over a couple of years and then get these new teams in. I think it is to much to ask for teams with 1100 staff to go down to 350 over a period of just a couple of months the restructuring process may also cause massive turmoil within the teams.

[Gaz]

Blegh...Cider.

your under 18 and you don't drink cider? lol thats all i ever drunk before i was 18



err.. Yeh but you shouldn't be drinking until your 18 and even then take it easy.

[Frosty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

Then the top teams can operate under the uncapped rules until they sort themselves out...

That won't work for two reasons. One is because you then have this stupid 2 tier system and the second is because the uncapped teams will have to spend even more not less because that is where there performance advantage will be they couldn't spend less because they would be chucking away there performance advantage eventually the teams would spend themselves to destruction and the parent companies would pull the plug.

[scotty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

Then the top teams can operate under the uncapped rules until they sort themselves out...

That won't work for two reasons. One is because you then have this stupid 2 tier system and the second is because the uncapped teams will have to spend even more not less because that is where there performance advantage will be they couldn't spend less because they would be chucking away there performance advantage eventually the teams would spend themselves to destruction and the parent companies would pull the plug.

They could definitely operate outside of the cap and cut their costs in the meantime. They wouldn't necessarily be competitive, but then it's not like they have a divine right to be is it?

[Frosty]

I have no problems with the cap going down to £40 million I just thing it needs to be done over a couple of years maybe £80 million for the first and £40 million for the second even then I think that's very steep for the top teams.

Then the top teams can operate under the uncapped rules until they sort themselves out...

That won't work for two reasons. One is because you then have this stupid 2 tier system and the second is because the uncapped teams will have to spend even more not less because that is where there performance advantage will be they couldn't spend less because they would be chucking away there performance advantage eventually the teams would spend themselves to destruction and the parent companies would pull the plug.

They could definitely operate outside of the cap and cut their costs in the meantime. They wouldn't necessarily be competitive, but then it's not like they have a divine right to be is it?

Teams like Ferrari and McLaren would never take the option of being deliberately uncompetitive I don't think so anyway I think their ego's would get in the way those two teams have an 'exist to win' mentality and will go to extremes to do so.

[EwanM]

The English assume all Scots are Glaswegian.

Nah, only half are, the more well spoken Scots are ALL from Edinburgh...

I'm not. Though I was in Edinburgh today.