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[Denthúl]

Race Control's not getting back to McLaren and Ryan and Hamilton's lying to the stewards are separate issues, however I would say the former is one of several mitigating circumstances.

Yeh if the 1st hand happened the 2nd wouldn't of.

There are a million things that, had they not happened, Ryan and Hamilton wouldn't have lied. But it was Ryan and Hamilton who took the conscious decision to lie, and to continue lying after being found out. That was their decision, and blame for that falls squarely on their shoulders.

Yes but the point i'm getting at is if at Spa, and and in Oz we had decent stewards who knew about racing there would be no reason for them to lie.

There was no (good) reason for them to lie in the first place.

[EwanM]

Race Control's not getting back to McLaren and Ryan and Hamilton's lying to the stewards are separate issues, however I would say the former is one of several mitigating circumstances.

Yeh if the 1st hand happened the 2nd wouldn't of.

There are a million things that, had they not happened, Ryan and Hamilton wouldn't have lied. But it was Ryan and Hamilton who took the conscious decision to lie, and to continue lying after being found out. That was their decision, and blame for that falls squarely on their shoulders.

Yes but the point i'm getting at is if at Spa, and and in Oz we had decent stewards who knew about racing there would be no reason for them to lie.

There was no (good) reason for them to lie in the first place.

Exactly. Corrupt Stewards or not, they weren't to blame for this one, I'm sorry.

[Gaz]

Race Control's not getting back to McLaren and Ryan and Hamilton's lying to the stewards are separate issues, however I would say the former is one of several mitigating circumstances.

Yeh if the 1st hand happened the 2nd wouldn't of.

There are a million things that, had they not happened, Ryan and Hamilton wouldn't have lied. But it was Ryan and Hamilton who took the conscious decision to lie, and to continue lying after being found out. That was their decision, and blame for that falls squarely on their shoulders.

Yes but the point i'm getting at is if at Spa, and and in Oz we had decent stewards who knew about racing there would be no reason for them to lie.

There was no (good) reason for them to lie in the first place.

I never said there was, but i can see the reason why they did it.

[Denthúl]

Race Control's not getting back to McLaren and Ryan and Hamilton's lying to the stewards are separate issues, however I would say the former is one of several mitigating circumstances.

Yeh if the 1st hand happened the 2nd wouldn't of.

There are a million things that, had they not happened, Ryan and Hamilton wouldn't have lied. But it was Ryan and Hamilton who took the conscious decision to lie, and to continue lying after being found out. That was their decision, and blame for that falls squarely on their shoulders.

Yes but the point i'm getting at is if at Spa, and and in Oz we had decent stewards who knew about racing there would be no reason for them to lie.

There was no (good) reason for them to lie in the first place.

I never said there was, but i can see the reason why they did it.

Because they felt stupid after realising that they didn't have to give their place up. I didn't say that there wasn't a reason at all.

[darwin dali]

JS at his best - opening his trap and crapping all over FIA w/o constructive criticism. He's just an annoying crotchety geezer

[FerrariFan63]

JS at his best - opening his trap and crapping all over FIA w/o constructive criticism. He's just an annoying crotchety geezer

JYS's criticisms are often valid. I wonder if this one has suffered from editing and/or poor headline choice.

[Gaz]

JS at his best - opening his trap and crapping all over FIA w/o constructive criticism. He's just an annoying crotchety geezer

He is giving construtive Criticism hes saying there should be somone for racing rules and regs that can make rapid decsions.

and another for Safty.

Thats how it should be, the FIA shouldn't be changing results time after time.

[Jensonb]

There was no (good) reason for them to lie in the first place.

I never said there was, but i can see the reason why they did it.

It's not a bad point, but reasons and excuses are different. Race Control being too busy caused them to be in a situation where they chose to lie, that's about all that can be said.

[csrracer]

I agree that it was unhelpful that the stewards didn't reply to the query. But this in no way excuses what Ryan and Hamilton did. These are separate issues.

No its all part of one big FIA duck Stewarts right.

No. They are seperate issues.

Race control were simply unable to answer a (rather insignificant at the time) request from McLaren because they were dealing with the string of crashes involving Vettel and Kubica. They had the safety car out, and the medical car appeared to follow it out of the pit lane. Even though it wasn't used, race control's attention was focused on something far more important in those last three laps of the race.

The Stewards and race control were to busy deciding who had to receive an unfair penalty for a simple racing incident, to bother with the running order of the actual race..

[Denthúl]

I agree that it was unhelpful that the stewards didn't reply to the query. But this in no way excuses what Ryan and Hamilton did. These are separate issues.

No its all part of one big FIA duck Stewarts right.

No. They are seperate issues.

Race control were simply unable to answer a (rather insignificant at the time) request from McLaren because they were dealing with the string of crashes involving Vettel and Kubica. They had the safety car out, and the medical car appeared to follow it out of the pit lane. Even though it wasn't used, race control's attention was focused on something far more important in those last three laps of the race.

The Stewards and race control were to busy deciding who had to receive an unfair penalty for a simple racing incident, to bother with the running order of the actual race..

When the medical car is sent out, there are far more serious things to deal with than telling a team what they should do when they should know the regulations.

[Gaz]

I agree that it was unhelpful that the stewards didn't reply to the query. But this in no way excuses what Ryan and Hamilton did. These are separate issues.

No its all part of one big FIA duck Stewarts right.

No. They are seperate issues.

Race control were simply unable to answer a (rather insignificant at the time) request from McLaren because they were dealing with the string of crashes involving Vettel and Kubica. They had the safety car out, and the medical car appeared to follow it out of the pit lane. Even though it wasn't used, race control's attention was focused on something far more important in those last three laps of the race.

The Stewards and race control were to busy deciding who had to receive an unfair penalty for a simple racing incident, to bother with the running order of the actual race..

When the medical car is sent out, there are far more serious things to deal with than telling a team what they should do when they should know the regulations.

Yeh hence why they should be kept seperate

[Denthúl]

I agree that it was unhelpful that the stewards didn't reply to the query. But this in no way excuses what Ryan and Hamilton did. These are separate issues.

No its all part of one big FIA duck Stewarts right.

No. They are seperate issues.

Race control were simply unable to answer a (rather insignificant at the time) request from McLaren because they were dealing with the string of crashes involving Vettel and Kubica. They had the safety car out, and the medical car appeared to follow it out of the pit lane. Even though it wasn't used, race control's attention was focused on something far more important in those last three laps of the race.

The Stewards and race control were to busy deciding who had to receive an unfair penalty for a simple racing incident, to bother with the running order of the actual race..

When the medical car is sent out, there are far more serious things to deal with than telling a team what they should do when they should know the regulations.

Yeh hence why they should be kept seperate

I agree, but at the moment there is no capacity for that. It's another issue that the FIA need to address quite soon.

[Gaz]

i don't belive thats the case.

[Denthúl]

i don't belive thats the case.

Don't believe what? It's quite obvious that race control is made up of too small a number of people for it to be capable of keeping the issues separate...

[Gaz]

i don't belive thats the case.

Don't believe what? It's quite obvious that race control is made up of too small a number of people for it to be capable of keeping the issues separate...

I don't belive its the case because the FIA has the recouces to invovle more people.