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Denthul the stars are aligned!
Look Hamilton lied with the team for his benefit...so take the punishment with the team! take responsibility for his own actions, he was a key player in this!
That's confusing... When the team loses WDC points doesn't he lose those also? He wasn't a key player he was a puppet in Mclaren's poor team management, maybe he's not getting a worse penalty because FIA understands this.....
Don't be silly. He was quite involved in the whole thing. You're believing exactly what McLaren want you to!
Of course he's involved He's a Mclaren employee and being so he's being steered in the wrong direction due to Mclaren's piss poor team managing. I'm sorry but I think it's childlike for people to think that driver's are saints, and should always do the right thing in regards to Morals. If you want a saint driving your car go hire Ghandi.
To sit behind a keyboard pointing a finger at a driver saying he's scum for lying is infantile. Hamilton is paid a huge sum of money to be a team player, and when your team says lie you lie. I think it's total BS for anyone here to say they wouldn't do the same thing. People on this Forum lie for free imagine what morals they'd break for several million dollars a year, and a chance to just travel with a top F1 team.
Hey. I could have been £5,000 better off if I'd lied and submitted a claim for compensation when the accident was entirely my fault. There was nobody to disprove me, so I'd easily have gotten away with it. But I didn't do it. I don't care how much I'm paid, I value my morals far more than I value being a 'team player'. To lie for such benefit, in the way that Lewis and McLaren did, would be to compromise my beliefs and that is something I am not willing to do.
Oh, OK I'm sure you've never lied .... sorry for assuming you would, Hey how's your bid going to be the next Pope?
Denthul the stars are aligned!
Look Hamilton lied with the team for his benefit...so take the punishment with the team! take responsibility for his own actions, he was a key player in this!
That's confusing... When the team loses WDC points doesn't he lose those also? He wasn't a key player he was a puppet in Mclaren's poor team management, maybe he's not getting a worse penalty because FIA understands this.....
Don't be silly. He was quite involved in the whole thing. You're believing exactly what McLaren want you to!
Of course he's involved He's a Mclaren employee and being so he's being steered in the wrong direction due to Mclaren's piss poor team managing. I'm sorry but I think it's childlike for people to think that driver's are saints, and should always do the right thing in regards to Morals. If you want a saint driving your car go hire Ghandi.
To sit behind a keyboard pointing a finger at a driver saying he's scum for lying is infantile. Hamilton is paid a huge sum of money to be a team player, and when your team says lie you lie. I think it's total BS for anyone here to say they wouldn't do the same thing. People on this Forum lie for free imagine what morals they'd break for several million dollars a year, and a chance to just travel with a top F1 team.
Hey. I could have been £5,000 better off if I'd lied and submitted a claim for compensation when the accident was entirely my fault. There was nobody to disprove me, so I'd easily have gotten away with it. But I didn't do it. I don't care how much I'm paid, I value my morals far more than I value being a 'team player'. To lie for such benefit, in the way that Lewis and McLaren did, would be to compromise my beliefs and that is something I am not willing to do.
Although Mclaren have given him a competitive car in 2007 and 2008, their situation with the Stewards and Fia have left alot to be desired. For everyone that thinks Hamilton is to blame for lie-gate you only have to go back to 2007 to realize it's not the first time that Mclaren asked it's drivers to lie about rules and regulations to the governing body. IMHO I don't think Hamilton wants to leave as much as he wants Mclaren to clean up their act with the Stewards and FIA. It's hard enough to become the WDC against so many other talented drivers, but having to win against the Stewards and FIA, make his job even harder. For all the Hamilton Haters, you wanted to see what he could do in an uncompetetive car and (team management aside) He's done pretty damn well this year, much better than his team mate and much better than the 2 Ferrari drivers who have a much better car this year. So now that he's proved you wrong again, you all jump on the bandwagon that Mclaren Management had nothing to do with his lies to the Stewards.
Of course for all the Hammy Haters you will continue to hate him no matter what he does, You're in denial that he's a fantastic driver which to me is more important in an F1 driver than anything that happens off of the race course, But you would rather judge him by what the press says about him when he's off the race track.
Although Mclaren have given him a competitive car in 2007 and 2008, their situation with the Stewards and Fia have left alot to be desired. For everyone that thinks Hamilton is to blame for lie-gate you only have to go back to 2007 to realize it's not the first time that Mclaren asked it's drivers to lie about rules and regulations to the governing body. IMHO I don't think Hamilton wants to leave as much as he wants Mclaren to clean up their act with the Stewards and FIA. It's hard enough to become the WDC against so many other talented drivers, but having to win against the Stewards and FIA, make his job even harder. For all the Hamilton Haters, you wanted to see what he could do in an uncompetetive car and (team management aside) He's done pretty damn well this year, much better than his team mate and much better than the 2 Ferrari drivers who have a much better car this year. So now that he's proved you wrong again, you all jump on the bandwagon that Mclaren Management had nothing to do with his lies to the Stewards.
Of course for all the Hammy Haters you will continue to hate him no matter what he does, You're in denial that he's a fantastic driver which to me is more important in an F1 driver than anything that happens off of the race course, But you would rather judge him by what the press says about him when he's off the race track.
Very well said.
I have another thought on this. Just supposing it was all Lewis' decision to lie and he told Ryan to agree with him. Then as a senior manager Ryan's behaviour was very poor. Lets continue on this assumption. Lewis asked Ryan to lie(despite just telling the press the opposite), but anyway they continue with this until sommoned again to the stewards. At this point whether they were aware before or not you can be damn sure McLaren top brass were aware now of the situation. So they go into damage limitation mode. Now who is the most expendable? A guy fairly close to retirement in a management position or a world champion top line driver??? This is no disrespect to Ryan, his abilities or his loyalties. Its common sense.This is big business not a Sunday school picnic. So they make their decision. Pay Ryan off and try to limit the damage.
Now to Lewis. People say he has not been punished enough and he should take more blame. What do you suggest he does?.Goes to the FIA and asks to be suspended? Refuses to take any more points this season? McLaren wouldnt let either of those things happen because he's the only one at the moment able to score any points for them.
And to Billindenver. He was up to 3rd at Australia before all this kicked off. In an uncompetitive car.
I never claimed to have never lied. But you're trying to pass this off as a simple white-lie, as if it were insignificant. I have never lied in order to cheat my way in to a better position or f*** somone over. Lied about eating the last chocolate digestive? Yes. Lied about forgetting to shut a window when it's raining? Yes. Lied to get myself a bonus and stop someone else getting one (which, in the corporate world, is the equivalent of what Lewis did)? No. That's where the difference lies. Stop trying to make out like Lewis commited the equivalent of a little misdemeanour, it was the equivalent of gross misconduct!
I never claimed to have never lied. But you're trying to pass this off as a simple white-lie, as if it were insignificant. I have never lied in order to cheat my way in to a better position or f*** somone over. Lied about eating the last chocolate digestive? Yes. Lied about forgetting to shut a window when it's raining? Yes. Lied to get myself a bonus and stop someone else getting one (which, in the corporate world, is the equivalent of what Lewis did)? No. That's where the difference lies. Stop trying to make out like Lewis commited the equivalent of a little misdemeanour, it was the equivalent of gross misconduct!
Gross misconduct? It's still a sporting event isn't it? I guess every soccer player to ever over react to a shove to draw a fowl are also scum. He was told to lie by his team and was being a good employee and did what he was told.
I'm not saying it was a white lie I'm saying Hamilton is unhappy with Mclaren right now because of their poor management. The whole situation was handled in a pathetic manner right from the safety car, someone on the team should have been asking the stewards where Hamilton should have been. Mclaren should have been honest and pleading their position to the stewards before the checkered flag ever came out. If Mclaren's management wasn't pushing the Lie, than why didn't the team go into damage control right after the first stewards meeting instead of letting it go on for a week? There's a simple answer poor team management.
I'd be surprised that people were falling for it, but then I've discovered that people seem to be somewhat blinkered in situations like these.
I think Hamilton lost a lot of fans over this, but you'll always have the hardcore supporters who view their drivers/teams with rose tinted specs regardless of the situation - we're all guilty of it really. Still annoying though 
The equivalent of gross misconduct, yes.
Hamilton did not have to go along with the lie. Don't pull the 'team orders' crap on me. Just look at Hungary 2007 for an example of why you shouldn't believe Hamilton is going to do everything the team tells him.
McLaren were in contact with race control straight away, but race control had more important matters to deal with and with there only being two laps left, there wasn't time to give an answer.
It is simply unacceptable to put this down to poor team management - both parties (Lewis and McLaren) are just as much to blame for this mess as each other. There is no denying that and it is unfair even to try. You are, once again, doing exactly what McLaren want you to do in believing that it's all the team's fault. This is what they set out to do as soon as it became apparent that Lewis had lied. I'd be surprised that people were falling for it, but then I've discovered that people seem to be somewhat blinkered in situations like these.
The equivalent of gross misconduct, yes.
Hamilton did not have to go along with the lie. Don't pull the 'team orders' crap on me. Just look at Hungary 2007 for an example of why you shouldn't believe Hamilton is going to do everything the team tells him.
McLaren were in contact with race control straight away, but race control had more important matters to deal with and with there only being two laps left, there wasn't time to give an answer.
It is simply unacceptable to put this down to poor team management - both parties (Lewis and McLaren) are just as much to blame for this mess as each other. There is no denying that and it is unfair even to try. You are, once again, doing exactly what McLaren want you to do in believing that it's all the team's fault. This is what they set out to do as soon as it became apparent that Lewis had lied. I'd be surprised that people were falling for it, but then I've discovered that people seem to be somewhat blinkered in situations like these.
And this is what I cannot comprehend. Why do Mclaren wish to continue to protect Hamilton after all of the speculation of him leaving? Even without that, they know that the experiences of 2007 done nothing but harm the team.
I can see the same thing happening again.
Very true and it is those who I eluded to in my previous post on another thread.
I never claimed to have never lied. But you're trying to pass this off as a simple white-lie, as if it were insignificant. I have never lied in order to cheat my way in to a better position or f*** somone over. Lied about eating the last chocolate digestive? Yes. Lied about forgetting to shut a window when it's raining? Yes. Lied to get myself a bonus and stop someone else getting one (which, in the corporate world, is the equivalent of what Lewis did)? No. That's where the difference lies. Stop trying to make out like Lewis commited the equivalent of a little misdemeanour, it was the equivalent of gross misconduct!
Gross misconduct? It's still a sporting event isn't it? I guess every soccer player to ever over react to a shove to draw a fowl are also scum. He was told to lie by his team and was being a good employee and did what he was told.
I'm not saying it was a white lie I'm saying Hamilton is unhappy with Mclaren right now because of their poor management. The whole situation was handled in a pathetic manner right from the safety car, someone on the team should have been asking the stewards where Hamilton should have been. Mclaren should have been honest and pleading their position to the stewards before the checkered flag ever came out. If Mclaren's management wasn't pushing the Lie, than why didn't the team go into damage control right after the first stewards meeting instead of letting it go on for a week? There's a simple answer poor team management.
The equivalent of gross misconduct, yes.
Hamilton did not have to go along with the lie. Don't pull the 'team orders' crap on me. Just look at Hungary 2007 for an example of why you shouldn't believe Hamilton is going to do everything the team tells him.
McLaren were in contact with race control straight away, but race control had more important matters to deal with and with there only being two laps left, there wasn't time to give an answer.
It is simply unacceptable to put this down to poor team management - both parties (Lewis and McLaren) are just as much to blame for this mess as each other. There is no denying that and it is unfair even to try. You are, once again, doing exactly what McLaren want you to do in believing that it's all the team's fault. This is what they set out to do as soon as it became apparent that Lewis had lied. I'd be surprised that people were falling for it, but then I've discovered that people seem to be somewhat blinkered in situations like these.
And this is what I cannot comprehend. Why do Mclaren wish to continue to protect Hamilton after all of the speculation of him leaving? Even without that, they know that the experiences of 2007 done nothing but harm the team.
I can see the same thing happening again.
Very true and it is those who I eluded to in my previous post on another thread.
He may have lost a few bandwaggoners, not his real supporters!
- By darwin daliYeah, not very active here, unfortunately. Is it […]
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