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[bud]

Ouch. Stephen sure ripped into JensonB there!
I agree with waht you have been saying also Stephen.

I don't really buy into the whole global warming thing, but if you say you don't alot of people tend to look at you like you are antichrist or something.

na they look at you like youre stupid

[headless]

Ouch. Stephen sure ripped into JensonB there!
I agree with waht you have been saying also Stephen.

I don't really buy into the whole global warming thing, but if you say you don't alot of people tend to look at you like you are antichrist or something.

na they look at you like youre stupid

They always give me a wierd look anyway, but yeah.
Something = stupid, sometimes

[Stephen]

Ouch. Stephen sure ripped into JensonB there!
I agree with waht you have been saying also Stephen.

I don't really buy into the whole global warming thing, but if you say you don't alot of people tend to look at you like you are antichrist or something.

na they look at you like youre stupid

They always give me a wierd look anyway, but yeah.
Something = stupid, sometimes

And this is the problem bud. This should be a science, but it's become almost religious with little foundation. I'm probably more green than most, and run my companies in such a manner also, but something just isn't right here - why are politicians falling over each other to lead on this subject, when they've only paid lip service to environmental campaigners in years gone by?

This is worth a read too. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/11/30 ... _analysis/

[bud]

suppose the hole in the ozone is a natural occurrence also?

[Stephen]

suppose the hole in the ozone is a natural occurrence also?

I'm not debating that, although they were wrong about the ice-age in the 1970s (ahem) - but at least that science was debated, peer-reviewed etc.

Have a watch of this - http://fascistsoup.com/2009/11/25/more- ... urce-code/ - if your jaw doesn't hit the floor, you might just want to grab a banana and go back to living in a tree.

[bud]

the fact human emitted gas CFC's were the route cause for the hole in the ozone. why then is it so hard to believe that human Co2 levels are contributing to the shithole our environment is in? we also forget though that deforestation and plenty of other human activities are stuffing around with the ecology which in tern is affecting climate change.

[Stephen]

the fact human emitted gas CFC's were the route cause for the hole in the ozone. why then is it so hard to believe that human Co2 levels are contributing to the shithole our environment is in? we also forget though that deforestation and plenty of other human activities are stuffing around with the ecology which in tern is affecting climate change.

The climate is cooling right now bud, and in the scheme of things, there is no significant change overall. There is no proven link between CO2 (the life giving gas) and climate, and as a direct result of this myth, bio-fuels are being grown where rain-forests used to stand...

[Gaz]

the fact human emitted gas CFC's were the route cause for the hole in the ozone. why then is it so hard to believe that human Co2 levels are contributing to the shithole our environment is in? we also forget though that deforestation and plenty of other human activities are stuffing around with the ecology which in tern is affecting climate change.

The climate is cooling right now bud, and in the scheme of things, there is no significant change overall. There is no proven link between CO2 (the life giving gas) and climate, and as a direct result of this myth, bio-fuels are being grown where rain-forests used to stand...

Yeah but Bio Fuels plants still take in CO2 and emit oxygen sucks for the animals tho.

[Jensonb]

denying the fact that humans are infact damaging our planet is just sticking your head in the sand. while youre all bickering about whether man made Co2 levels are causing climate change youre all forgetting we are currently in the greatest mass extinction since the end of the Mesozoic era 65 Million years ago. we Are damaging our planet in many ways other than just Co2 levels. Of which there is no doubt in my mind that we are infact contributing to an accelerated climate change.

its simple physics, the planets ecological systems are so fragile that any sudden change (industrial revolution) will have an adverse affect. those who dont believe it why not do an experiment and go to a pub in amsterdam and not expect to get high passively!

This.

You don't have an answer do you? Your only contribution to this thread has been to insult or belittle the poor misguided deniers (you and Miliband should get a room)...

And your only contribution has been circumstantial evidence and YouTube propaganda

You're nothing more than an apathetic sheep, happily spoon-fed by media and government - and sorry to break it to you, but these people don't give a stuff about the environment And you're nothing but a well-intentioned rebel whose playing into the hands of the global elite - for media it's all about selling papers with sensationalist stories, and for the latter group, aside from running up expenses and lying about them, sending us on unpopular wars on the basis of false evidence (familiar?), they want votes - and in the case of the socialists (Labour, Democrats), they want big brother surveillance, nanny state, redistribution of wealth, and gross public sector waste supported by fines and taxes. This might be news to you, but the new EU President wants to run the whole EU (cost €140m/day) on environmental taxes alone (agenda, what agenda?) - and where do you suppose they come from? Oh big business you say? Right then, that's an extra 10% on everything you buy! Ah, I see you're a Tory. That explains a lot.

Am I wrong for refusing to accept a theory based on poor, manipulated data by a small group of vested scientists? No, but you are wrong to deny a credible theory held by many scientists by pointing to what is at best a anomaly - apparently you were unaware but the earth is very old so 10 years for example is trivial. The trend is upwards, it is the MMGW deniers who are fudging the data A theory, claimed to be settled by politicians (whilst the majority of their electorate That's a fabrication and independent Weasel words scientists remain unconvinced), which will have far reaching consequences in the way we all live our lives, in how much tax we pay and what we can no longer doYes because it would be such a disaster if we had to stop producing things in inefficient ways...Waitaminute...But perhaps the problem here is simply you ascribing to me a position I don't hold. My beef is with things like the production of Plasma screen TVs, coal & gas power plants and factories in countries like China spewing crap into the atmosphere. The contribution of individuals (Eg. through cars) is negligible.. Then there's the environmental cost of creating solutions to combat threats that possibly don't exist (growing algae in the Oceans, giant solar reflectors, painting whole towns white, population control In all forms is evil, once again you're assuming I agree with everyone who disagrees with you, the pressure placed on developing Countries). Then you might want to worry about what the real agenda is - why is this major scientific subject not being debated, how is it in anyway settled, and who benefitsHaving a debate and claiming it's a hoax are two different things. One is rational, and the other is paranoid insanity.. And finally, if CO2 is so damn bad, why are tens of thousands of delegates meeting in Copenhagen next month, the majority travelling by planeCall me crazy, but I don't recall being involved in planning that, nor do I recall even endorsing it.?

There is no doubt that climate change is real, has always been real, and will continue long after the human race have killed each other off Congratulations, you've made an observation most 13 year olds I know could make. The planet is currently cooling (inconvenient truth isn't it) but CO2 has by no means been proven to be the causeBut it has been proven to be harmful, and there is evidence tat is at least a contributing factor, hence denying it is irresponsible. Which is entirely my point and has been all along.. The Artic ice is coming back to normal levels (same characteristics were seen in the Artic in 1850 - but what do you care? - oh and the great ice sheet Greenpeace were banging on about, their outgoing Leader recently announced it's likely disappearance was a lie - or rather 'emotive' lies to generate interest), polar bears are thriving (and you can go hunt them if you have a few thousand dollarsMe? No. See, I'm a good person.) - so what's the issue? Are you just going to blame bad weather on AGW like the BBCI've made it pretty obvious the issue is that when people claim "There's nothing to see here" you're handing the world over to the men in suits to do as they damn well please. And it's worse than handing it over to the political elite - we at least have some semblance of control over them. You're handing the fate of the world to people who care more about their Bonuses and Golden Parachutes than our or the planet's wellbeing.? So to sum-up - no real evidence, just a half-assed theory made very public by politicians with an agenda, and scientists wanting a job and name up in lights.It's not half-assed, there's plenty of evidence (You're just looking for things to disprove it) politicians did not make it very public (hippies and the press did) and if we dismiss it now, we'll regret it later.

[Stephen]

We should agree to disagree, however, just keep a balanced view.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/greenhouse_data.html - 0.28% of CO2 man-made, and falling temperatures. Oh dear, more inconvenient truths...

[racechick]

Wow. Thats some pretty damning evidence that all this is based on crap. How can they get away with cheating figures like that? They're supposed to be scientists.

[Stephen]

suppose the hole in the ozone is a natural occurrence also?

You might want to also read this bud:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/janet ... ood-thing/

[bud]

You like your Guardian reporters but alas....http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... antarctica

But because the the CFC gasses that caused the ozone hole now been banned, scientists expect the damage to repair itself within the next 50-60 years. By then the cooling effect will have faded out and Turner said the Antarctic would face the full effects of global warming. This means an increase in average air temperatures of around 3C and a reduction in sea ice by around a third.,

it was man made agreed? why is it so hard to believe other gasses we pump into the atmosphere at an un natural rate would also change things? i mean people forget the time frame of the earth we are talking 100 years of the industrial revolution in which we have drastically altered our environment. something the planet has not gone through before in its billions of years history. Call me naive but its time we took more responsibility for our actions.

[Stephen]

You like your Guardian reporters but alas....http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... antarctica

But because the the CFC gasses that caused the ozone hole now been banned, scientists expect the damage to repair itself within the next 50-60 years. By then the cooling effect will have faded out and Turner said the Antarctic would face the full effects of global warming. This means an increase in average air temperatures of around 3C and a reduction in sea ice by around a third.,

it was man made agreed? why is it so hard to believe other gasses we pump into the atmosphere at an un natural rate would also change things? i mean people forget the time frame of the earth we are talking 100 years of the industrial revolution in which we have drastically altered our environment. something the planet has not gone through before in its billions of years history. Call me naive but its time we took more responsibility for our actions.

Agree about the responsibility bit, but through taxation...give me a break. This is about global politics, not about saving the World (how we as a race can even begin to think we understand our environment is a joke, and believing politicians have the answers is laughable). Nothing is settled, AGW is a complete farce, but yes, I will say again, we need to be greener.

[Jensonb]

We should agree to disagree, however, just keep a balanced view.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/greenhouse_data.html - 0.28% of CO2 man-made, and falling temperatures. Oh dear, more inconvenient truths...

Fine by me. All I am saying is that some of us are merely trying to protect the world from the robber barons (Who are people completely dissimilar to yourself)

It's a matter of that old saying, "be careful not to mess with the balance of things". Some of these big corporations (And several governments) are being reckless with our planet, and I'd very much like them to stop.