FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[killem2]

Diablo is one of my favorite childhood super cars growing up.

[AKR]

You miss my point AKR. You were saying that people put Ferrari over all else. Both on the F1 track and off, that is not the case. I have given examples of both on and off track where they are not head and shoulders above all else.

If you think people don't know about the McLaren F1, which was one of the greatest supercars of all time, you are sadly mistaken.

If you didn't like the Murcielago, then you have something wrong with your head.

Every man and his dog knows what a Ferrari is. Every kid in the school yard know what a Ferrari is. Every woman (I admit most chicks are not into cars like me) know what a Ferrari is. Most of the above unless they have some interest in cars will not know what a McLaren is. I am not saying it makes McLaren bad, I am saying that everyone knows what Ferrari is and can identiy what Ferrari is associated with like racing cars for example if not specifically F1. You either misunderstand what I am trying to say or my way of expressing it in the English language is not up to scratch.

I didn't say I do not like Lamborghini. And if I am going to have a preference for any Lambo, it is the real Lambos like the Countach and none of these half Volkswagen/Audi stuff of today. But compared to the likes of Ferrari, Porsche and even McLaren, Lamborghini are inferior. Their cars may look as good, sound as good, go as fast, but Lambos lack what the 3 makes I just mentioned make them real supercars. Ferrari, Porsche and McLaren all have extensive racing programs and with this, they can study and learn new things by racing and then develop their road cars based on this. Something that Lamborghini lacks almost completely.

And for the record, I like Porsche as much as Ferrari. Just that there is no Porsche in F1 so I can really only talk about my love for Ferrari when talking F1.

[Hammer278]

Diablo is one of my favorite childhood super cars growing up.

Recognized! I remember one of my treasured childhood games, Need for Speed III Hot Pursuit. The Diablo SV was my darling throughout.

[Big Azza]

Well another epic display of Vettel's skill: He posted that last fast lap with his engine turned down and KERS off! Behold the baby-faced racing God!

He's the best. Definitely the best. Who's looking forward to 2012?

See he can't even let his team mate beat him, because his team-mate is having too much fun battling Alonso for 3rd place. And I really love this picture:



To me that picture alone signifies that Vettel has now definitely the greatest driver on the grid. I was really enjoying talking to my friend about his performances in Toro Rosso. My friend was saying that he would like to see Vettel in a car that qualifies on the second row or lower. But Vettel is a 10/10 for qualifying, and perhaps a 9/10 for racing. Even in STR he was a prolific qualifier. Consider Monza '08. He put the car on pole and the 4-time CART Champion and Le Mans Veteran that was his team mate qualified 4th. Don't we see that on the grid this year. Vettel always on pole, and his team mate always in 4th? (Well not all the time... most of the time then. )

So if he at least qualifies 4 places better than his team mate, I would say that he could qualify maybe that Mercedes in 3rd or 4th. Do we really want to see Vettel in the 4th best car? No it would be an absolute travesty, unless he went there to a Schumacher-Ferrari-esque manouver and bring the team up the pecking order.

[bud]

cough "fanboy" cough

[Hammer278]

It is good days for Seb and his fans though.

[PartsaS]

Well another epic display of Vettel's skill: He posted that last fast lap with his engine turned down and KERS off! Behold the baby-faced racing God!

He's the best. Definitely the best. Who's looking forward to 2012?

See he can't even let his team mate beat him, because his team-mate is having too much fun battling Alonso for 3rd place. And I really love this picture:



To me that picture alone signifies that Vettel has now definitely the greatest driver on the grid. I was really enjoying talking to my friend about his performances in Toro Rosso. My friend was saying that he would like to see Vettel in a car that qualifies on the second row or lower. But Vettel is a 10/10 for qualifying, and perhaps a 9/10 for racing. Even in STR he was a prolific qualifier. Consider Monza '08. He put the car on pole and the 4-time CART Champion and Le Mans Veteran that was his team mate qualified 4th. Don't we see that on the grid this year. Vettel always on pole, and his team mate always in 4th? (Well not all the time... most of the time then. )

So if he at least qualifies 4 places better than his team mate, I would say that he could qualify maybe that Mercedes in 3rd or 4th. Do we really want to see Vettel in the 4th best car? No it would be an absolute travesty, unless he went there to a Schumacher-Ferrari-esque manouver and bring the team up the pecking order.

I want to see Vettel in a ferrari battling Alonso, If he qualifies 3 places above him, then me and many others will admit his talent and his ''greatness''

I do look forward to 2012 and the catch up McL and ferrari will do to beat RedBull,

hopefully we will see a strong Mec too.... untill then enjoy your throne

[GRHinPorts]

So if he at least qualifies 4 places better than his team mate, I would say that he could qualify maybe that Mercedes in 3rd or 4th. Do we really want to see Vettel in the 4th best car? No it would be an absolute travesty, unless he went there to a Schumacher-Ferrari-esque manouver and bring the team up the pecking order.

I'd love to see Seb go to Merc with the challenge of taking them to the front. I think its extremely unlikely we will see Hamilton, Alonso or Vettel ever go up against one another as equal team mates in the same car but maybe I am just being cynical.

I feel there is a strong chance Merc will be the next big team in the coming years and it might not be a bad move for any of the top drivers after about 2013.

[Big Azza]

More Vettel fan-boy stats, particularly aimed at those who feel that a 4-time CART Champion team mate in Bourdais in '08, and the more-than-capable Mark Webber and Vitantonio Liuzzi are not worthy comparisons of Vettel's talent.

Well what about the once highly rated Nick Heidfeld and the very highly rated Robert Kubica who were his team mates back in the 2006 season at BMW Sauber when Vettel was 19 years of age?

I didn't do any extra research into the weather conditions, or what the drivers' focus were. later on I'll do that, but I'm at work and I keep getting pulled away from my desk and then the page times out and I have to re-write this all again.

In Vettel's ever outing in the car at the 2006 Turkish Grand Prix FP1 Session, he was immediately up to speed, posting a time that was only .18 behind Heidfeld.

Hedifeld 7th - 1:29.780
Vettel 8th - 1:29.964

In FP2 Vettel set the fastest time in the session, .073 ahead of Ferrari's Felipe Massa. It appears both Kubica and Heidfeld had problems, with Vettel lapping 2.4 and 3.4 seconds faster, respectively.

Vettel 1st - 1:28.091
Kubica 17th - 1:30.502
Heidfeld 27th - 1:31.526

Italian GP FP1 Vettel was again fastest in session over 4 tenths faster than 2nd placed team mate Kubica.

Vettel 1st - 1:23.263
Kubica 2nd - 1:23.745

FP2 - Vettel was again fastest over 5 tenths faster than Schumacher's 2nd-placed Ferrari, and ahead of both Heidfeld (+1.699)and Kubica (+2.182).

Vettel 1st - 1:22.631
Heidfeld 7th - 1:24.330
Kubica 9th - 1:24.813

China FP1

Vettel 7th - 1:37.913
Kubica 8th - 1:38.062

China FP2 Vettel was second fastest in the session (missing out by .040), and well ahead of his team mates, who were likely experiencing more problems, or were focussing on something else.

Vettel 2nd - 1:35.579
Heidfeld 14th - 1:38.062
Kubica 22nd - 1:39.217

In Japan FP1 - only a few drivers set times, so we cannot compare Vettel with his team mates. But he placed third in the session behind Davidson's Honda, and Jani's STR.

In Japan FP2 Vettel was once again well ahead of his team mates.

Vettel 6th - 1:34.912
Kubica 18th - 1:36.234
Heidfeld 27th - 1:38.779

In Brazil FP1 - Vettel's team mates did not take part.

In Brazil FP2 - Vettel was third fastest in the session, once again well ahead of his team mates.

Vettel 3rd - 1:12.870
Kubica 16th - 1:14.510
Heidfeld 18th - 1:14.793

In the 2007 Australian FP1 - In a brand spanking new BMW Vettel was the third fastest of the session, and well ahead of Heidfeld, but looking at the times, there must've been some adverse weather conditions.

Vettel 3rd - 1:30.857
Heidfeld 17th - 1:37.249

In Australia FP2 Vettel did not take part.

In Malaysia FP1 Vettel was this time behind Kubica, and Vettel did not take part in FP2.

Kubica 10th - 1:37.121
Vettel 12th - 1:37.837

That was Vettel's last Friday drive before the USA GP Later that year, where he did not beat his team mate Heidfeld in any of the sessions (except the race, in which Heidfeld retired), but going on his performances in practice, he proved that he was mighty fast, consistant, and thoroughly deserving of a full-time drive with Toro Rosso later on that year.

This perhaps put his performances against his other team mates at STR and Red Bull into perspective. And I can assure you, he can only get better. Then again, it is only practice, but this is the best opportunity that I have of comparing him with other well-established drivers.

Then you also have this impressive display in his junior years which I posted elsewhwere. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Formula_BMW_ADAC_season

Goes to show he is used to being fast, and consistant. Then you have the Toro Rosso boys praising him for his technical ability in developing the car. Notice that Toro Rosso have gone downhill since then, and Red Bull have only been getting better and better since Vettel's arrival.

So there you have it - just another stat that I can rattle off the top of my head for thos who think that Hamilton/Button/Alonso would be able to beat Vettel in the Red Bull.

[darwin dali]

More Vettel fan-boy stats, particularly aimed at those who feel that a 4-time CART Champion team mate in Bourdais in '08, and the more-than-capable Mark Webber and Vitantonio Liuzzi are not worthy comparisons of Vettel's talent.

Well what about the once highly rated Nick Heidfeld and the very highly rated Robert Kubica who were his team mates back in the 2006 season at BMW Sauber when Vettel was 19 years of age?

I didn't do any extra research into the weather conditions, or what the drivers' focus were. later on I'll do that, but I'm at work and I keep getting pulled away from my desk and then the page times out and I have to re-write this all again.

In Vettel's ever outing in the car at the 2006 Turkish Grand Prix FP1 Session, he was immediately up to speed, posting a time that was only .18 behind Heidfeld.

Hedifeld 7th - 1:29.780
Vettel 8th - 1:29.964

In FP2 Vettel set the fastest time in the session, .073 ahead of Ferrari's Felipe Massa. It appears both Kubica and Heidfeld had problems, with Vettel lapping 2.4 and 3.4 seconds faster, respectively.

Vettel 1st - 1:28.091
Kubica 17th - 1:30.502
Heidfeld 27th - 1:31.526

Italian GP FP1 Vettel was again fastest in session over 4 tenths faster than 2nd placed team mate Kubica.

Vettel 1st - 1:23.263
Kubica 2nd - 1:23.745

FP2 - Vettel was again fastest over 5 tenths faster than Schumacher's 2nd-placed Ferrari, and ahead of both Heidfeld (+1.699)and Kubica (+2.182).

Vettel 1st - 1:22.631
Heidfeld 7th - 1:24.330
Kubica 9th - 1:24.813

China FP1

Vettel 7th - 1:37.913
Kubica 8th - 1:38.062

China FP2 Vettel was second fastest in the session (missing out by .040), and well ahead of his team mates, who were likely experiencing more problems, or were focussing on something else.

Vettel 2nd - 1:35.579
Heidfeld 14th - 1:38.062
Kubica 22nd - 1:39.217

In Japan FP1 - only a few drivers set times, so we cannot compare Vettel with his team mates. But he placed third in the session behind Davidson's Honda, and Jani's STR.

In Japan FP2 Vettel was once again well ahead of his team mates.

Vettel 6th - 1:34.912
Kubica 18th - 1:36.234
Heidfeld 27th - 1:38.779

In Brazil FP1 - Vettel's team mates did not take part.

In Brazil FP2 - Vettel was third fastest in the session, once again well ahead of his team mates.

Vettel 3rd - 1:12.870
Kubica 16th - 1:14.510
Heidfeld 18th - 1:14.793

In the 2007 Australian FP1 - In a brand spanking new BMW Vettel was the third fastest of the session, and well ahead of Heidfeld, but looking at the times, there must've been some adverse weather conditions.

Vettel 3rd - 1:30.857
Heidfeld 17th - 1:37.249

In Australia FP2 Vettel did not take part.

In Malaysia FP1 Vettel was this time behind Kubica, and Vettel did not take part in FP2.

Kubica 10th - 1:37.121
Vettel 12th - 1:37.837

That was Vettel's last Friday drive before the USA GP Later that year, where he did not beat his team mate Heidfeld in any of the sessions (except the race, in which Heidfeld retired), but going on his performances in practice, he proved that he was mighty fast, consistant, and thoroughly deserving of a full-time drive with Toro Rosso later on that year.

This perhaps put his performances against his other team mates at STR and Red Bull into perspective. And I can assure you, he can only get better. Then again, it is only practice, but this is the best opportunity that I have of comparing him with other well-established drivers.

Then you also have this impressive display in his junior years which I posted elsewhwere. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Formula_BMW_ADAC_season

Goes to show he is used to being fast, and consistant. Then you have the Toro Rosso boys praising him for his technical ability in developing the car. Notice that Toro Rosso have gone downhill since then, and Red Bull have only been getting better and better since Vettel's arrival.

So there you have it - just another stat that I can rattle off the top of my head for thos who think that Hamilton/Button/Alonso would be able to beat Vettel in the Red Bull.

These practice times need to be taken with a grain of salt though. I seem to remember at the time there were comments about SV running very light while the team drivers completed heavier fuel runs, etc.

[bud]

Do you really think FP stats are meaningful? Unless you really think Vettel is some driving god who is naturally 2 seconds faster than the likes of Kubica?

[scotty]

Do you really think FP stats are meaningful? Unless you really think Vettel is some driving god who is naturally 2 seconds faster than the likes of Kubica?

Di Resta beat Vettel in the same car he must be some sort of absolute Zeus or summat!!

[The_Stig_Money]

It is good days for Seb and his fans though.

It has been a good 2 seasons! Lol

[Big Azza]

Do you really think FP stats are meaningful? Unless you really think Vettel is some driving god who is naturally 2 seconds faster than the likes of Kubica?

Of course not, but I believe Vettel was 4 tenths faster than Kubica.

Hey, I'm sure I can find more "delusional" facts when I think of them.

[bud]

Do you really think FP stats are meaningful? Unless you really think Vettel is some driving god who is naturally 2 seconds faster than the likes of Kubica?

Di Resta beat Vettel in the same car he must be some sort of absolute Zeus or summat!!

care to show those di Resta vs Vettel in same car stats for everyone here?