FORUMula1.com

[vaptin]

Eh what? he said to all f1 fans diddn't he? Doesn't that include you? I thought that was what you meant. . .

[Bruno_Brazil]

Ferrari was told three times that Fernando Alonso should have let Robert Kubica through during the British Grand Prix, according to the FIA race director Charlie Whiting.

Alonso was given a drive-through at Silverstone after overtaking Renault's Kubica by going off track.

The penalty, which Ferrari felt was too harsh, ruined Alonso's chances of a good result, the Spaniard finishing down in 14th position.

Although the penalty was given nine laps after Alonso passed Kubica, Whiting said Ferrari was advised to let Kubica through immediately, but that the team decided against it.

"We told Ferrari three times that in my opinion they should give the position back to Kubica," Whiting was quoted as saying by Autosprint magazine.

"And we told them that immediately, right after the overtaking manoeuvre. On the radio, I suggested to them that if they exchange position again, there would be no need for the stewards to intervene.

"But they didn't do that and on the third communication they said that Kubica was by then too far back to let him regain the position.

"It's not true at all that the stewards took too long to decide. For us the facts were clear immediately: Alonso had gained an advantage by cutting the track."

Ferrari team principal Stefano Domenicali said the team did not ask Alonso to let Kubica through because it did not feel the Spaniard has gained an advantage.

"He tried to be aggressive to overtake, and we complained the drivers not to be aggressive and we complain about the lack of overtaking, and so at that stage, we felt as we normally do at that moment that we need to go on the radio with race control to check what is the position," Domenicali said.

"And normally, we take the right time to discuss with race control to make the judgement, and the moment when race control give us the instruction to give back the position to Robert, it was clear that Robert had already lost a lot of time - effectively he had a problem and he came back. That is the situation we analysed.

"You can have a situation where immediately there is a possibility to give back the position to a driver if you feel that there is really an advantage that you gain. On our side we felt that was not the case otherwise we would have done it."

Domenicali said that by the time the stewards told them Alonso should let Kubica by, the Pole was already too far behind.

Kubica retired from the race moments later with mechanical problems.

"As soon as we received the information that in the opinion of the stewards, Fernando should have given back the position to Robert, Robert was already very far behind and Robert was really slowing down because he had a problem."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85258" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[SaintDean]

Just read that too, then came on here. Those damn Italians love to lie lol.

[Bruno_Brazil]

It's incredible that Domenicalli thinks that aggressiveness is a reasonable justification.



While Kubica had to slow down in order to corner, Alonso can go straight and cut the track.
Does he really think it`s right...and even if it were right, he couldnt take this position of disobey stewards' decision...

[bud]

So Charlie gave them the his informed opinion to let Kubica back through, though in defence of Ferrari, Charlie is not a Steward and they could have had a different view, albeit rarely.

[EwanM]

To answer the question posted in the thread topic: Politics and Motor racing go hand in hand.

I for one believe that the sport would not be the same without the controversies.

Maybe that's just me.

For those who disagree then I will leave you with this:

I never give you my pillow
I only send you my invitations
And in the middle of the celebrations
I break down

[What's Burning?]

To quote Oscar Wilde; "The only thing worse than being talked about, is not being talked about."

[Hammer278]

So Charlie gave them the his informed opinion to let Kubica back through, though in defence of Ferrari, Charlie is not a Steward and they could have had a different view, albeit rarely.

Charlie is in charge or Race Control. If Ferrari don't believe he's in control then they shouldn't race. IMO Alonso should have been blackflagged straightaway for ignoring Race Control.

Wish McLaren hits back saying "Ferrari are soooooo lucky!"

[EwanM]

In all honesty I've just read through this thread and laughed at most of the posts on both sides.

Surely the discussion should be above nationality or certain teams and drivers and more focused on the constant contradictions of the rules and stewards' decisions?

I’m a fox on a mission

[bud]

In all honesty I've just read through this thread and laughed at most of the posts on both sides.

Surely the discussion should be above nationality or certain teams and drivers and more focused on the constant contradictions of the rules and stewards' decisions?

I’m a fox on a mission

they applied the penalty to Alonso to the letter of the law, the only people who think it is wrong are Ferrari/Alonso fans. And youre right, Nationality shouldnt even be brought in but you can look to the latter for bringing it up.

[bud]

Definitely feeling the pressure. Maybe the pressure of having to win, in a car that maybe can't win? who knows... Also, the Valencia thing, that has to be a TOUGH pill to swallow. Will take him at least a win to get over it hehe

The move was a very good move. Difficult! but he had the corner won. Only went to the grass to avoid contact, but not to make the move (there's difference). Should have given the p back though.. you're right.

For example, the Magny cours penalty, Lewis had nothing else to do but to miss the corner, but because of the position and speed he brought. Even without Vettel there, Lewis was going to miss the corner (considering the speed and position he was in).

The Magny Cours penalty was right for Lewis though, he had all four wheels leaving the track to pass Vettel. It sucked but its there! Ive seen a car in another series get a drive through for leaving the track on a straight to pass a car, all 4 wheels left the track and thats all it takes.


and to say Fernando had the corner won is a bit far fetched, its a chicane its not just one turn! Kube had the inside line Fernandos only hope in this scenario is to get ahead of him turning into the corner and get the up and under, classic chicane move. But he only got along side of him thus had to go wide.
Corner won? no way Kube had it fair and square.

[f1ea]

hmmm, seems he didnt have the corner. It would have been a great move by a couple of cms. Maybe because it was on the outside... anyway.. ALMOST legal hehe

He'll get him next time

[madbrad]

If I were Alonso I woul dhave given it back. That would be my gamble. Might be less painful than th epenalty for not doing so. Now that we saw the penalty we know my gamble would have paid off. But since There was a question of whether Alonso had no choice but to go that far off the track or crash, Ferrari really had to wait for a clarification or appeal before obeying the command from Whiting to let Kubica by, just in case their pleadings were successful. So they weren't, live and learn. Still, you have to agree penalties are not handed down with any consistency in F1.

[f1ea]

If I were Alonso I woul dhave given it back. That would be my gamble. Might be less painful than th epenalty for not doing so. Now that we saw the penalty we know my gamble would have paid off. But since There was a question of whether Alonso had no choice but to go that far off the track or crash, Ferrari really had to wait for a clarification or appeal before obeying the command from Whiting to let Kubica by, just in case their pleadings were successful. So they weren't, live and learn. Still, you have to agree penalties are not handed down with any consistency in F1.

Exactly what I think. I think he should have given the position back, just to be sure. Definitely he did it to avoid contact and when i saw the move in the race i thought he had the position. Surely, if you see telemetry it must have been alonso lifting off when Robert came in front of him at the 2nd apex. Alonso was ahead in the 1st.

Another big part in the o/t problem in F1 has to do with how easy those little expensive pieces break......... other categories can afford some contact.