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[racechick]

Both Braun and Newey have said reliability will be the issue with the new engines. Not just the engines but also the new components. Brawn said it will be like going back 20 years regarding reliability and there could be four retirements in a race. So if the extra horsepower gives them more scope for reliability, that's very good.

[CookinFlat6]

Must be a disappointment to the haters out there hoping the extra power was going to be negative for Lewis. I even saw a nonce on a lame site claim that drivers with a 'lighter right foot' like Button would have an advantage

[What's Burning?]

You had to press the Button, didn't you.

[What's Burning?]

Both Braun and Newey have said reliability will be the issue with the new engines. Not just the engines but also the new components. Brawn said it will be like going back 20 years regarding reliability and there could be four retirements in a race. So if the extra horsepower gives them more scope for reliability, that's very good.

Renault Red Bull is the engine "works" team so they're likely to lose less in the translation as well.

I agree, reliability is king, I forget the number but for some reason I though it was 8 races they'd have to last or some fixed number just like transmissions.

[Jabberwocky]

Maybe we could have an engine championship. Most points per engine block

Sent from Turing Colossus using Tapatalk 2

[CookinFlat6]

I reckon, with these new power unit regulation era, the customer team is going back to the same type of disadvantage teams had when Lotus first integrated the chassis all those years ago.
With so much emphasis on extracting performance from the engine as opposed to aero in time we might see the spec chassis supplied along with the power units.
With aero you can add parts and test them in a wind tunnel, but improving chassis and mechanical parts independently of the power units evolution without track testing? Things like the car squatting on acceleration, distributing load during turbo lag etc is going to be a nightmare unless the power units are homologated and fixed soon. If the engine makers are going to evolve them for a few years the customers could be facing a world of expensive hit and miss

[What's Burning?]

There are going to be power unit tentacles spread through the entire chassis but a spec chassis is a tough sell given that it's the only real differentiators in customer teams. The engines and systems are baked and work going on now is for things just like that in car optimization and cooling requirements it's not like something revolutionary will change in the engine design at this late stage.

How did we wind up talking about engines in the Pirelli thread?

[racechick]

Powerful engines preferring bigger tyres.

[CookinFlat6]

Its ridiculous that the tyres should stay pretty much the same size they have been for ages through to next year. They were much wider in the older turbo days and got narrower trying to slow things down, there has to be a safety aspect along the way that overides silly thoughts of spicing things up.
Cars that cant put all the power down coupled with turbo lag plus rain is a disaster waiting to happen no matter how skillful the drivers are

[sagi58]

Jonathan Noble wrote:">F1 drivers want tyre safety guarantees after Belgian GP failures

Formula 1 drivers want guarantees about the safety of Pirelli's tyres at the Belgian Grand Prix in the wake of the failures that hit Sebastian Vettel and Fernando Alonso on Friday.

Amid concerns about the dangers of potential tyre failures at the high-speed Spa Francorchamps circuit, F1's leading drivers have asked the FIA to get assurances from Pirelli about the safety of its products.

Although Pirelli is adamant that the problems that Vettel and Alonso suffered were caused by debris puncturing their right rears, drivers and team figures are not so convinced that is the full explanation.

During Friday evening's drivers' briefing at Spa, F1 race director Charlie Whiting was asked to look in detail at the Pirelli matter and get the Italian company to guarantee that there is no structural issue with the tyres.

Just two races after the Grand Prix Drivers' Association (GPDA) threatened to withdraw from the German GP if there were tyre problems, the drivers remain concerned about the possibility of a repeat of what happened at Silverstone.

A spate of tyre blow-outs marred the British Grand Prix and forced Pirelli to revert to last year's construction to prevent repeat problems.

One leading driver said that there was serious concern from the drivers about the situation, but made it clear they are prepared to leave the matter to Whiting's jurisdiction.

"We've left it in Charlie's hands," said the drivers. "We have to trust him."

Pirelli motorsport director Paul Hembery admitted on Friday that the fact there had been failures on Friday at Spa had been a concern.

"It is a worry for the sport because we have to go out and find what it is," he said.

"There is not a lot we can do, but we will try our very best to identify it to give us an indication of what is causing it."

Pirelli plans to conduct a detailed examination of the Spa track to try to get to the bottom of exactly what punctured Vettel and Alonso's tyres.

Red Bull's Mark Webber said that drivers wanted clarity from Pirelli about the situation, as they were not satisfied with the response they had got so far.

"We need answers and 'debris' is not the answer," he said.

Whiting met with Hembery and Pirelli racing manager Mario Isola to inspect both the tyres and the failures.

Whiting plans to conduct a detailed investigation tonight.

[1Lemon]

I read this comment on a BBC article and thought it was quite interesting:

Can you imagine if the FIA said to spice up the action, from now on they wanted engines to last no more than 180-200 miles, thereby keeping everyone on edge for the last 10 or so laps of a grand-prix in the hope the leaders' engine doesn't expire

-then ask yourself exactly how many engine manufacturers would put their reputations on the line as 1 by 1 the engines blew up

I feel sorry for Pirelli

[Hammer278]

I read this comment on a BBC article and thought it was quite interesting:

Can you imagine if the FIA said to spice up the action, from now on they wanted engines to last no more than 180-200 miles, thereby keeping everyone on edge for the last 10 or so laps of a grand-prix in the hope the leaders' engine doesn't expire

-then ask yourself exactly how many engine manufacturers would put their reputations on the line as 1 by 1 the engines blew up

I feel sorry for Pirelli

I think a lot of you a missing the point. Pirelly was asked to construct tyres which lose grip QUICKLY to make racing interesting. Not to self destruct.

The comparison in the article is stupid to say the least. If you want to use engines in the way Pirelli are making tyres, you'd want the engines to lose power quickly after say, 100 miles and still make the flag with no problems, but with much reduced performance.

[1Lemon]

I read this comment on a BBC article and thought it was quite interesting:

Can you imagine if the FIA said to spice up the action, from now on they wanted engines to last no more than 180-200 miles, thereby keeping everyone on edge for the last 10 or so laps of a grand-prix in the hope the leaders' engine doesn't expire

-then ask yourself exactly how many engine manufacturers would put their reputations on the line as 1 by 1 the engines blew up

I feel sorry for Pirelli

I think a lot of you a missing the point. Pirelly was asked to construct tyres which lose grip QUICKLY to make racing interesting. Not to self destruct.

The comparison in the article is stupid to say the least. If you want to use engines in the way Pirelli are making tyres, you'd want the engines to lose power quickly after say, 100 miles and still make the flag with no problems, but with much reduced performance.

A tyre that forces you to make a pit stop after X number of laps, cannot just slightly lose performance and slightly degrade, it has to be significant; the FIA are more at fault that Pirelli here.

[Hammer278]

Yes, and why can't they just construct a tyre which loses grip quickly, but fundamentally have a very strong construct with a canvas protecting the tyre from puncture? The layer which holds the pressure doesn't have to provide grip, it simply needs to be strong enough to withstand high external forces!

I'm not pretending to be some tyre expert, but I simply can't find an excuse for a tyre which needs to lose performance = tyre which is easy to self destruct??

[1Lemon]

Oh sorry I forget that there has never been a puncture in F1's history until Pirelli turned up.

a tyre cannot loose performance without losing grip and therefore rubber, if rubber is being removed higher temps and loads are being placed on the very construct of a tyre. The incredible forces on a tyre in F1 are hard enough with rubber, but when all that's gone it's going to naturally make a tyre more unstable and flimsy. It's why there is a minimum tread limit on cars on public roads, partly for rain/grip but also that the tyres are more prone to blow outs.