FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Selcouth_Feline]

you have a valid point and i can see where your comming from, but if somebody is even a suspect they should be banned from "all" commercial flights untill proven otherwise, just my opinion though

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?!

[bud]

now its being reported there were two islamic terror suspects onboard the flight, giving credence to the bomb threat story days earlier.

I think it's a bit of a non-story right now TBH.

1. The names match, but they don't have dates of birth. How common are the names? For example I know that in London there are at least 6 people with the same name as me, two of which also have the same middle name. [And no, my surname isn't Jones or Smith ]

2. How big is their list? And therefore what are the chances of having someone who is on that list (or indeed someone with the same name as someone on that list) also on any flight at any one time?

you have a valid point and i can see where your comming from, but if somebody is even a suspect they should be banned from "all" commercial flights untill proven otherwise, just my opinion though

ban all muslims from flying?

[texasmr2]

you have a valid point and i can see where your comming from, but if somebody is even a suspect they should be banned from "all" commercial flights untill proven otherwise, just my opinion though

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?!

Leave that for the courts to decide because we citizens of whatever country are the first line of defense, if a person is suspected of any affiliation to a terrorist group they should be black flagged until PROVEN otherwise. Try waking up to watch thousands of your brothers and sisters die and you may have a different perspective.

[bud]

im for the hardline guantanamo approach!

[RA Dunk]

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?!

So your saying if any of your family were killed on a plane by terrorists that were "under suspicion" but were "never proven guilty" to be terrorists you would be saying the same thing?

This is exactly the same scenario the relatives of the Air France flight will be going through right now...

I stand by my last post, anybody suspected of being a terrorist should be banned from flying in "any" commercial aircraft, I know i wouldent be comfortable flying with somebody who might or might not be a terrorist, why take the risk?

[RA Dunk]

Leave that for the courts to decide because we citizens of whatever country are the first line of defense, if a person is suspected of any affiliation to a terrorist group they should be black flagged until PROVEN otherwise. Try waking up to watch thousands of your brothers and sisters die and you may have a different perspective.

Amen to that one brother

[Selcouth_Feline]

Leave that for the courts to decide because we citizens of whatever country are the first line of defense, if a person is suspected of any affiliation to a terrorist group they should be black flagged until PROVEN otherwise. Try waking up to watch thousands of your brothers and sisters die and you may have a different perspective.

But you aren't leaving it to the courts to decide if you want to black flag people who you have no evidence against. Anyway, all the increased security at airports is meant to stop bombs from getting through (probably not 100% foolproof, but that's not the point here).

By that reasoning, I wouldn't have gotten into the US when I visited NYC earlier this year. Why? Because I've been to Dubai and the customs guy didn't like the Arabic stamp from Dubai on my passport. On questioning me, he discovered I'd actually been to NY last year too, after I'd been to Dubai (which was quite a few years ago) and because I'd been let in before, he relented and waved me through.

What you are suggesting is akin to the Chinese history where the Red Guards eventually attempted to destroy anything associated with traditional or foreign cultures and was a horrendous example of completely extreme, and in many cases unjustifed, persecution. Thousands of Chinese died around the time of the Cultural Revolution thanks to this extreme persecution so don't give me BS about seeing my 'brothers and sisters' die because trust me, my family's seen *plenty* of it. My mother to this day refuses to visit China because she is absolutely terrified that she will be thrown in jail or killed even though she has done nothing wrong.

Bear in mind that many of the names that ended up on the Chinese blacklists were as a result of hearsay and little or no evidence. Friends turned on each other to ensure they didn't end up on the blacklists themselves. Pointing the finger at someone else, no matter whether guilty or innocent, meant they had less chance of ending up on the blacklist themselves.

So I make no apologies for being 100% against stopping people from getting on planes even if they are on a blacklist. If there's evidence that they are potential terrorists, fine, stop them getting on a plane. If all you have is a "susipicion", absolutely no way.

[RA Dunk]

Well thats the difference between you and me then, I know i wouldent like to sit on a plane with somebody who could be a terrorist but the authorities didnt have enough evidence to convict, Me personally i dont see the sense in taking the chance when hundreds of civilian lives at stake

[texasmr2]

Leave that for the courts to decide because we citizens of whatever country are the first line of defense, if a person is suspected of any affiliation to a terrorist group they should be black flagged until PROVEN otherwise. Try waking up to watch thousands of your brothers and sisters die and you may have a different perspective.

But you aren't leaving it to the courts to decide if you want to black flag people who you have no evidence against. Anyway, all the increased security at airports is meant to stop bombs from getting through (probably not 100% foolproof, but that's not the point here).

By that reasoning, I wouldn't have gotten into the US when I visited NYC earlier this year. Why? Because I've been to Dubai and the customs guy didn't like the Arabic stamp from Dubai on my passport. On questioning me, he discovered I'd actually been to NY last year too, after I'd been to Dubai (which was quite a few years ago) and because I'd been let in before, he relented and waved me through.

What you are suggesting is akin to the Chinese history where the Red Guards eventually attempted to destroy anything associated with traditional or foreign cultures and was a horrendous example of completely extreme, and in many cases unjustifed, persecution. Thousands of Chinese died around the time of the Cultural Revolution thanks to this extreme persecution so don't give me BS about seeing my 'brothers and sisters' die because trust me, my family's seen *plenty* of it. My mother to this day refuses to visit China because she is absolutely terrified that she will be thrown in jail or killed even though she has done nothing wrong.

Bear in mind that many of the names that ended up on the Chinese blacklists were as a result of hearsay and little or no evidence. Friends turned on each other to ensure they didn't end up on the blacklists themselves. Pointing the finger at someone else, no matter whether guilty or innocent, meant they had less chance of ending up on the blacklist themselves.

So I make no apologies for being 100% against stopping people from getting on planes even if they are on a blacklist. If there's evidence that they are potential terrorists, fine, stop them getting on a plane. If all you have is a "susipicion", absolutely no way.

That is the difference between you and I as you have not experienced such horrific events such as I have yet I respect your opinon, view and outlook.

[Selcouth_Feline]

Well thats the difference between you and me then, I know i wouldent like to sit on a plane with somebody who could be a terrorist but the authorities didnt have enough evidence to convict, Me personally i dont see the sense in taking the chance when hundreds of civilian lives at stake

So you wouldn't want to sit next to me on a plane? Just because I've been to Dubai? The borderland security man obviously thought I shouldn't be let in to the US because I'd been to Dubai. You want to ban everyone who's been to Dubai or any other country you happen not to like very much?

Actually, while we're at it, how about we stop everyone from carrying bags on the Tube system *just in case they happen to be carrying a bomb*.

You don't even know that the blokes on the planes are the same as those on the blacklist, nor do you even know why the plane came down. Pure conjecture and a knee-jerk reaction to a threat which might not even have existed.

[RA Dunk]

Just a difference in opinion, if i knew there was a "suspected" terrorist on the same plane as me i would get off and find another flight, Im not willing to risk my life by taking that chance....

[texasmr2]

Well thats the difference between you and me then, I know i wouldent like to sit on a plane with somebody who could be a terrorist but the authorities didnt have enough evidence to convict, Me personally i dont see the sense in taking the chance when hundreds of civilian lives at stake

So you wouldn't want to sit next to me on a plane? Just because I've been to Dubai? The borderland security man obviously thought I shouldn't be let in to the US because I'd been to Dubai. You want to ban everyone who's been to Dubai or any other country you happen not to like very much?

Actually, while we're at it, how about we stop everyone from carrying bags on the Tube system *just in case they happen to be carrying a bomb*.

You don't even know that the blokes on the planes are the same as those on the blacklist, nor do you even know why the plane came down. Pure conjecture and a knee-jerk reaction to a threat which might not even have existed.

I think we are all on the same page and we cannot offer a true and heartfelt meaning via a keyboard.

[Rivelution]

People listen to the media too much. Just because somebody is muslim doesnt make them a terrorist. Only like 18 percent of muslims in the world live in the middle east aka terrorismland according to the media . Islam is like christianity, where its spread all around the world and not "just in the middle east" like the media portrays.

[RA Dunk]

Who mentioned muslims? Like you say people listen to the media too much!

[Rivelution]

I was just letting everyone know