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[Gilles 27]

That's true, McLaren should really just be called Mercedes imo, especially given that the team has completely abandoned any link back to it's origins. Anyway, the relationship could change at any minute given Mercedes' poor financial situation. These things can change very rapidly.

[billindenver]

It seems a tad silly to me that McLaren are doing badly and Brawn are doing so well yet Mercedes aren't benefiting form the Brawn publicity as much as they should in order to avoid upsetting McLaren. McLaren didn't get the job done over winter so they should have no complaints. Merceds clearly isn't the weak link there at the moment. Plus it could help McLaren in the long run if it encourages Merceds to stick around and gets them more money and exposure. Mercedes aren't about to ditch McLaren anytime soon after all, they have the best resources in the paddock and will surely be back at the top soon enough.

youre talking from a stand point of McLaren and Mercedes being two different entities, when Mercedes owns McLaren in majority.

Then his point is even more valid. Mercedes is the parent company, and if their petticoats are wide enough to cover more than one team...where is the harm? They are clearly doing so with engines, all we are talking about here is them taking credit for what they have already done. You seem to think that by putting their name on the Brawn it detracts from the support of McLaren. In truth, it only adds recognition to the Mercedes brand...which currently McLaren is not doing. That recognition is the only reason a manufacturer is involved in F1. Mercedes is not in bed with McLaren because there is some love affair going on there. They are involved in order to promote their name. The last couple of years there has been one very good bit of press and several very bad bits...so perhaps they have decided that all their eggs in one fairly fragile basket might not be the best business decision.

[Gaz]

That's true, McLaren should really just be called Mercedes imo, especially given that the team has completely abandoned any link back to it's origins. Anyway, the relationship could change at any minute given Mercedes' poor financial situation. These things can change very rapidly.

no no no no no no no no and no some more.

Mclaren has almost as much heratige as Ferrari in F1.

Mclaren haven't forgot their Orgins at all.

whatever ANYONE says calling Mclaren Mercades would be like Calling Ferrari FIAT.

[bud]

It seems a tad silly to me that McLaren are doing badly and Brawn are doing so well yet Mercedes aren't benefiting form the Brawn publicity as much as they should in order to avoid upsetting McLaren. McLaren didn't get the job done over winter so they should have no complaints. Merceds clearly isn't the weak link there at the moment. Plus it could help McLaren in the long run if it encourages Merceds to stick around and gets them more money and exposure. Mercedes aren't about to ditch McLaren anytime soon after all, they have the best resources in the paddock and will surely be back at the top soon enough.

youre talking from a stand point of McLaren and Mercedes being two different entities, when Mercedes owns McLaren in majority.

Then his point is even more valid. Mercedes is the parent company, and if their petticoats are wide enough to cover more than one team...where is the harm? They are clearly doing so with engines, all we are talking about here is them taking credit for what they have already done. You seem to think that by putting their name on the Brawn it detracts from the support of McLaren. In truth, it only adds recognition to the Mercedes brand...which currently McLaren is not doing. That recognition is the only reason a manufacturer is involved in F1. Mercedes is not in bed with McLaren because there is some love affair going on there. They are involved in order to promote their name. The last couple of years there has been one very good bit of press and several very bad bits...so perhaps they have decided that all their eggs in one fairly fragile basket might not be the best business decision.

No i have nothing against Brawn, I actually admire their story this year and as a McLaren fan seeing a Mercedes car win is the next best thing to McLaren not winning.
Im looking at it from a sponsors point of view of exclusivity to the works team, there is Harm when sponsors are involved. im not sure on the current crop of sponsors but i know in the past some German sponsors of McLaren Mercedes were there strictly to be linked to Mercedes. Now if Some other team has the Mercedes logo then im sure that sponsor paying money for a link with Mercedes is being ripped off if someone else gets to have it also!

also McLaren and Mercedes are not only linked to F1 they also make road cars together as seen with the SLR McLaren. Also look out for the new McLaren supercar P11 coming out soon

[Gaz]

Merc Arn't Invloved in the P11 Bud.

Perhaps Engine only.

But your correct about the German sponsors, never thought of that.

[Gilles 27]

At least Ferrari still have the same badge

and the same colour

and they claim the nationality of their founder.

As far as i'm concerned, McLaren are a New Zealand team that should race an orange car with a Kiwi badge on it.

Mercedes are a German company that pretty much own and run the McLaren F1 team, they have always raced in silver and were around before McLaren, If McLaren aren't going to acknowledge their own history, they may as well adopt the history of one of the most prestigious of all race teams.
I don't know where McLaren get off calling themselves British, they are clearly either German or New Zealand. I know they are based in Britain but everyone is. On that basis Toyota are german...

[Gaz]

At least Ferrari still have the same badge

and the same colour

and they claim the nationality of their founder.

As far as i'm concerned, McLaren are a New Zealand team that should race an orange car with a Kiwi badge on it.

Mercedes are a German company that pretty much own and run the McLaren F1 team, they have always raced in silver and were around before McLaren, If McLaren aren't going to acknowledge their own history, they may as well adopt the history of one of the most prestigious of all race teams.
I don't know where McLaren get off calling themselves British, they are clearly either German or New Zealand. I know they are based in Britain but everyone is. On that basis Toyota are german...

Your wrong i'm afraid.

Merc have the Biggest Single Share in Mclaren but its not the marjority share. The Middleeast has a large share in mclaren also, does this mean it should be Called Vodafone Mercades Arabian Pan European Formula 1 Intenational.


And Mclaren have Ackowledged their own heritage several times, for example the Mclaren F1 LM Supercar was Painted in Mclaren orange.

Mclaren have never called themselfs British there are an International team.

Just based in Britan.

[bud]

Merc Arn't Invloved in the P11 Bud.

Perhaps Engine only.

But your correct about the German sponsors, never thought of that.

well in that case they werent involved with the SLR either as that was designed and built at McLaren Tech centre.

but the P11 ofcourse will use the mercedes engine!



and gilles i guess ownership of the team has changed since Bruce has died once Dennis came on the scene and merged it with Project 4 it became truelly British! But i would have no quams if the team were to be classed as German!

[Gaz]

Merc Arn't Invloved in the P11 Bud.

Perhaps Engine only.

But your correct about the German sponsors, never thought of that.

well in that case they werent involved with the SLR either as that was designed and built at McLaren Tech centre.

but the P11 ofcourse will use the mercedes engine!



and gilles i guess ownership of the team has changed since Bruce has died once Dennis came on the scene and merged it with Project 4 it became truelly British! But i would have no quams if the team were to be classed as German!

Yeh there was a big song and dance about Mclaren Automative breaking away and this is a Mclaren car.

I think what they mean by that is is its not going to have a merc badge on it or look like a Merc like the SLR did.

May not even have a Merc Engine the F1 had a BMW engine and Mclaren were using Honda, Ford them Pergot and Finaly Merc during its years of Manufactor.

[bud]

they chose the BMW because Honda had no engine available they could use that would give them the performance of the V12 BMW.

but dont worry the P11 will definitely be using a Merc V8

[scotty]

yeh it's a good job Honda didn't let them use their engines because apparently, they were not a patch on the Mercedes units.

Yep, i heard the Honda at 19000rpm was down at least 60hp on the 18000rpm Merc!

[Gilles 27]

i also heard that the Honda had a Cosworth DFV - like power delivery, which made it much less driver friendly. Even if the power was there, it wasn't anywhere near as usable for balancing the car through corners compared with the Merc, which is apparently a peach

[Tony_sa]

I dont even think i will bother popping my 2 cents here. tex , bill and DD done it all for me. this has been a good day.
i liked the last one :: watching a brawn merc car winning is like seeing a mclaren ( not ) winning... lol

[Jensonb]

...

So anyway, speaking as a Brawn fan, I've actively wanted the Mercedes badge on the car all along. Just because I think it'd be cool.

[McLaren Fan]

A lot of factual inaccuracies on this thread. Daimler, not Mercedes, own a 40% share of the McLaren Group.