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By McLaren Fan
#103114
From Planet F1:

Ferrari down on their luck as KERS doubts grow
Monday 6th April 2009

As if Ferrari didn't have enough worries to contend with on their malfunctioning F60, it has emerged that their KERS system - previously thought to be the strength of their package - may in fact be significantly hindering their performance by reducing the size of their petrol tank and limiting their capacity to rebalance the car's handling.

Although a general lack of downforce and two astonishing errors of judgement from the pitwall were the principal reasons why the team failed to score any points in Malaysia, matters were not helped by Kimi Raikkonen being undermined throughout the weekend by a persistent problem with his KERS system.

The device failed on Friday and the official F1 website explained that its removal from the Finn's car revealed that 'it is located in a cavity under the chassis, the presence of which means a significantly smaller fuel tank than would otherwise be possible.'

'With the base of the battery box now effectively forming a second floor, it also means the fuel is higher in the chassis, raising its centre of gravity.'

The F60 has been described as a 'sensitive' car and it is suspected that the enforced weight distribution of the 40kg KERS battery may also be compromising its handling. What's more, it was reported in Australia, where both Ferraris had to pit ahead of schedule after starting the race on soft tyres, that the weight of the KERS device may have been the reason why their rubber grained far quicker than expected.

Publicly at least, the team remain adamant that the advantages of the device outweigh its bulky disadvantages. "I passed from 16th to 12th straight away, so it helped me," reported Felipe Massa in Malaysia. It is claimed that Ferrari believe the system's overall effect is a two-tenths-of-a-second improvement per lap. As yet, however, that hasn't been apparent with Brawn, Williams, Red Bull and Toyota all leading the field despite not carrying the system.

As with McLaren, who are also struggling to keep pace with the frontrunners, Ferrari's main problem appears to be a lack of aerodynamic grip. In the wake of two point-less grands prix, the team are already under severe pressure to deliver a substantial performance upgrade in China after boss Stefano Domenicali described their start to the season as "unacceptable".

"This is the critical point on the car that we are seeing now," he said before leaving Malaysia. "We need to work day and night to try and anticipate everything we can to improve the performance of the car.

"We know that from what we have seen it's on the aero side that we need to make the difference, so an aerodynamic development is needed - we need to have more downforce."

According to Massa, however, Ferrari's season may yet hinge on the FIA's hearing on April 14 to determine the legality of the two-tiered diffusers used by Brawn, Williams and Toyota.

"The guys who have the diffuser have a lot more downforce," he complained to Autosport. "So it is completely difficult to fight with them. If we get a Championship that is the same for everybody at the next race, then for sure it will be more competitive. But if we don't, then it will take quite a bit of time to have the diffuser on our car, so it will be very difficult."
By Tony_sa
#103115
On the broadcast:

"What does Brawn know that Ferrari doesn't?"

"Well, the track is bone dry for one."


Good laugh at 6 AM or so. :P


They the laughing stock of the universe over that one. and schumi laughing in the background. I know the world is asking what were they thinking..... but really ..what the hell were they thinking???.. there was gonna be a flash flood the moment he leaves the pit lane?? they should have given him a canoe if that was on their minds. I am a ferrari supporter - not only for their ability to actually win races - but because it appeared that they used to put some thought into strategy. I have no intention to jump ship - but they made me lose a big bet this past two weeks. anybody think it worth the effort to go over there and beat some sense into some of them ?? including schumi ??


you right I guess but witha dry track what were the chances. inters would have made more sense.... anyway I think I am going to make as if the next race is the first race this year. deleting the memory of what the heck happened so far.... I will wear a disguise for the next two weeks.
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By Gilles 27
#103133
I can't help but feel that KERS is the route of Ferrari's problems. i don't understand how compromising the handling and strategy that badly can possibly be worth it, especially given the top 4 teams aren't running it. You can blame the success of Brawn, Toyota, Williams on their diffusers but what about Red Bull? I think it has a lot to do with them not running KERS.
I love how BMW have run into problems over weight with their KERS and they are the ones who were really pressurising the FIA to bring it in in the first place!
Ferrari have been absolutely calamitous since Brawn, Todt, Schumacher (I know he is still there but not really in a major role) et al left their posts. It has always been the way with Ferrari, they seem to go berserk as soon as Italians start running the team...
User avatar
By FerrariFan63
#103137
I love how BMW have run into problems over weight with their KERS and they are the ones who were really pressurising the FIA to bring it in in the first place!
Ferrari have been absolutely calamitous since Brawn, Todt, Schumacher (I know he is still there but not really in a major role) et al left their posts. It has always been the way with Ferrari, they seem to go berserk as soon as Italians start running the team...


Ferrari won the teams championship last year, and Kimi with Ferrari won the drivers' championship in 2007. That's not exactly what I would call "absolutely calamitous".

Edited for typo pointed out in the next post.
Last edited by FerrariFan63 on 06 Apr 09, 14:03, edited 1 time in total.
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By Gilles 27
#103148
Ferrari won the teams championship last year, and Kimi with Ferrari won the drivers' championship in 2006. That's not exactly what I would call "absolutely calamitous".


i assume you meant 2007... anyway, they produced excellent cars last year and the year before. The really should have dominated both championships with McLaren drivers taking pints off each other in 2007 and I am convince the 2008 Ferrari was the fastest car. They let themselves down with idiotic development decisions, poor strategy, poor(er) reliability and really stupid stuff like that traffic light thing.
User avatar
By m00g
#103158
I think Im smashed. 2 veliko kozarec oops imean big g;asses of home full made vino.................... FERRARI will never go back to the bullshiit pre schumacher dAYS. FERRARI will bounce back. F1 afterall is all about nFerrari. Im currently wearing mu GREAY Chelsea jersey with my Italia jacket cos Chelsea is the greatest football team in England and Italia the greatest overall. I am also watching the 2008 F1 season review. Just gpot to Brazil now and can see cheating Hamilton rob the title from Massa who crossed the line first as the first world champion before Hamitlon crossed the line. In my opinion Massa is the true 2008 champion because he was passed the line first and racing afterall is all about who comes first. Ferrari 4eva, Italia 4eva, Slovenija 4eva, Chelsea 4eva, Juve 4eva, VAFFANCULO AL RESTO PERCHE NON ME NE FREGA ATTRAMENTE!!!!! *LOL* :drink::drink::drink::drink::drink::drink::drink::drink::drink::drink:


So you like Ferrari AND support Chelsea? I bet you've been a lifetime Chelsea fan since 2004 too haven't you?
Poor fcuker! :rofl:
User avatar
By SAS88
#103159
Sure it looks likr Ferrari is failing its drivers right now. That can turn on a dime though. Also, this is a bit of a reset year for most of the teams. As long as the regs don't change too much for the next year, thing should settle down again and they'll get back into their grooves. That's actually a bad thing for Bernie's wallet.


There are divorces to consider... :D
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By FerrariFan63
#103160
Ferrari won the teams championship last year, and Kimi with Ferrari won the drivers' championship in 2006. That's not exactly what I would call "absolutely calamitous".


i assume you meant 2007... anyway, they produced excellent cars last year and the year before. The really should have dominated both championships with McLaren drivers taking pints off each other in 2007 and I am convince the 2008 Ferrari was the fastest car. They let themselves down with idiotic development decisions, poor strategy, poor(er) reliability and really stupid stuff like that traffic light thing.


They certainly didn't maximise their opportunities. But I don't think it goes as far as Ferrari being "absolutely calamitous".
User avatar
By texasmr2
#103167
On the broadcast:

"What does Brawn know that Ferrari doesn't?"

"Well, the track is bone dry for one."


Good laugh at 6 AM or so. :P

Excellent! :thumbup:
User avatar
By csrracer
#103201
Ferrari won the teams championship last year, and Kimi with Ferrari won the drivers' championship in 2006. That's not exactly what I would call "absolutely calamitous".


i assume you meant 2007... anyway, they produced excellent cars last year and the year before. The really should have dominated both championships with McLaren drivers taking pints off each other in 2007 and I am convince the 2008 Ferrari was the fastest car. They let themselves down with idiotic development decisions, poor strategy, poor(er) reliability and really stupid stuff like that traffic light thing.


They certainly didn't maximise their opportunities. But I don't think it goes as far as Ferrari being "absolutely calamitous".



Ferrari's Race/Qualifying Strategy this year is way more shameful than Mclarens post race Strategy. Mclaren doesn't claim to be a Law firm, So their behavior in front of the stewards to me isn't nearly as embarrassing as Ferrari (The # 1 Racing team) sending a driver out on full wets when the track is dry . Let's not forget also that Massa missed qualifying Higher on the grid because his team didn't realize the track was getting faster, and failed to have the car ready for Massa to attempt a better time. Ferrari this year look like an amateur race team, compared with Braun and in my opinion didn't look much better last year with all their Pit Lane mistakes. They wouldn't have had a chance last year at the WDC if the Stewards didn't keep gifting them points.
By Tony_sa
#103203
Ferrari won the teams championship last year, and Kimi with Ferrari won the drivers' championship in 2006. That's not exactly what I would call "absolutely calamitous".


i assume you meant 2007... anyway, they produced excellent cars last year and the year before. The really should have dominated both championships with McLaren drivers taking pints off each other in 2007 and I am convince the 2008 Ferrari was the fastest car. They let themselves down with idiotic development decisions, poor strategy, poor(er) reliability and really stupid stuff like that traffic light thing.


They certainly didn't maximise their opportunities. But I don't think it goes as far as Ferrari being "absolutely calamitous".



Ferrari's Race/Qualifying Strategy this year is way more shameful than Mclarens post race Strategy. Mclaren doesn't claim to be a Law firm, So their behavior in front of the stewards to me isn't nearly as embarrassing as Ferrari (The # 1 Racing team) sending a driver out on full wets when the track is dry . Let's not forget also that Massa missed qualifying Higher on the grid because his team didn't realize the track was getting faster, and failed to have the car ready for Massa to attempt a better time. Ferrari this year look like an amateur race team, compared with Braun and in my opinion didn't look much better last year with all their Pit Lane mistakes. They wouldn't have had a chance last year at the WDC if the Stewards didn't keep gifting them points.


And you had to go there .didnt you .
User avatar
By FerrariFan63
#103222
Ferrari's Race/Qualifying Strategy this year is way more shameful than Mclarens post race Strategy. Mclaren doesn't claim to be a Law firm, So their behavior in front of the stewards to me isn't nearly as embarrassing as Ferrari (The # 1 Racing team) sending a driver out on full wets when the track is dry .


You don't have to be a law firm to realise that lying to the stewards in an attempt to knobble a competitor is morally very very wrong. Making a few bonehead decisions during a race pales in comparison.
User avatar
By f1ea
#103226
Ferrari have been looking like amateurs since last season. They show some signs of brilliance, but also signs of desperation and plain mediocracy. Of course, the times are difficult, the changes were too many, they have the diffuser issue, they started developing later for this yr... anyway i dont think it is a 'downfall'. It will probably get sorted out before the season ends.
User avatar
By Jensonb
#103239
Ferrari have been looking like amateurs since last season. They show some signs of brilliance, but also signs of desperation and plain mediocracy. Of course, the times are difficult, the changes were too many, they have the diffuser issue, they started developing later for this yr... anyway i dont think it is a 'downfall'. It will probably get sorted out before the season ends.

I agree, they're not stupid, they've just lost their way a little bit. McLaren too.
User avatar
By csrracer
#103246
Ferrari's Race/Qualifying Strategy this year is way more shameful than Mclarens post race Strategy. Mclaren doesn't claim to be a Law firm, So their behavior in front of the stewards to me isn't nearly as embarrassing as Ferrari (The # 1 Racing team) sending a driver out on full wets when the track is dry .


You don't have to be a law firm to realise that lying to the stewards in an attempt to knobble a competitor is morally very very wrong. Making a few bonehead decisions during a race pales in comparison.


Boneheaded is an understatement, There was no way in Hell that full wets on a dry track was a good move. Do the math. Full Wets on a dry track will lose app. 40 to 50 seconds a lap and will be totally useless after 3 laps, including being useless in wet conditions. Even if it started raining after 2 laps he would have lost over a minute. It would only cost app. 40 seconds to come in and change tires, and if it was pouring rain everyone else would be coming in for Wet tires also and that 40 seconds wouldn't cost as much as 1 lap on Wet tires on a dry track. If they sent him out on Intermediates it would have been an excusable gamble, but sending him out on full wets was pure stupidity.
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