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[darwin dali]

On the properties of the universe, what lies outside and what caused it's existance no one knows and if it can be described some day it'll probably be pretty incomprehensible outside the maths of it. Even the universe around us isn't really what we percieve and there are some pretty strange things closer to home.

[youtube]A9tKncAdlHQ[/youtube]

It's s*** like that, that gets me hard. Lol.

I keep looking at taking an OU physics course, but just do not have the time.

Plus my wife has a degree in Physics and Space Science, and would not be able to feign interest every time I run over to tell her the new exciting thing I learnt.

At first, I thought this behavior of the atoms in the video is a demonstration of Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle. But I confused it like many people before me with the observer effect, which seems to be more at play here, and on a quantum mechanic level at that. In short: by observing the atoms using the probe, they get influenced in their behavior, their path gets altered because the simple process of observing them, i.e., registering and absorbing some form of energy or signature emission by itself backfires on the observed atom and changes its properties.

[darwin dali]

Sometimes I really freak myself out by wondering about the fact that if we weren't here, if life didn't exist, there would be NOTHING here. And I dont mean us as humans, I mean anything, no people, plants, no atoms, no animals, no planets, no universe, no dark matter, no space, no nothing. What would be in its place? Because for there to be nothing, there has to be somewhere for that nothing to exist? Or does there? And then if there was nothing, and I mean nothing, then that just makes me feel sad.

That thought then follows onto - well we are here, so what's the point? And I dont mean this in a "oh whats the point of it all" or "there must be a pre-ordained grand scheme for us" - but more along the lines of ...... I dont know. Maybe it is, and Im too scared to go down that route of philosophical thought?

And I know this rambling is veering very close to a discussion about religion, but that's not even on my radar. Im thinking of it with more of a scientific view point. But is that even possible? Maybe thats why my head spins in circles with this everytime I find myself thinking about it, as science cant explain it?

I've thought about this since my early teens. It only happens once a year or so, but when it does, it kinda freaks me out.

Discuss.

NB: Apologies for the randomness of this thread. Its hard to explain with any clarity, the exact thought process of my brain. If Mods thinks this should go in the general chat thread, then please feel free to move.

You're quite the nihilist, aren't ya?

But seriously: if there is nothing, how could you define nothing? As opposed to what? Similarly: if there is no time (which there wouldn't be as there would be no space either), how could you define now, before and after? In other words, if you take yourself out by cancelling your existence and everything else as well, then there is really no point in exploring this as there is no way of differentiation between nothing and the other nothing. As soon as you bring yourself back into the equation (or anything else for that matter) to afford you the opportunity to actually describe or define the 'nothing', then the great 'nothing' doesn't exist anymore because something exists.

[1Lemon]

Turtles.

[What's Burning?]

:sigh: when is it that we invent the warp drive engine again?

[stonemonkey]

[Yes, from what little I understand about them, they are just extremely massive collapsed stars that suck in everything that comes close to them (i.e., get within their event horizon), even light waves get trapped in them and hence they appear as black holes when in reality they are very massive. I think I read somewhere that you'd have to pack 5 aircraft carriers into a matchbox to achieve the same density of mass.

That depends, if it collapses to a singularity then the volume is 0 and the density is infinite, but I don't think it's known if that happens or if the collapsed mass still has a volume inside the event horizon. If anything passes the event horizon it can't escape but Hawkings predicts another strange quantum mechanism involving virtual particles at the edge of the event horizon by which the black hole appears to radiate and evaporate, that was one of the things they thought the might be able to verify at the LHC if they managed to create the micro black holes.
A black hole doesn't really suck everything in though, if a star collapses to a black hole it would still have the same mass as the star it formed from, if there were planets orbiting the star they'd continue to orbit after it collapsed. It would collect mass though as a star does but the black hole won't emit as much as a star so it's mass might increase at a higher rate than a star.

At first, I thought this behavior of the atoms in the video is a demonstration of Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle. But I confused it like many people before me with the observer effect, which seems to be more at play here, and on a quantum mechanic level at that. In short: by observing the atoms using the probe, they get influenced in their behavior, their path gets altered because the simple process of observing them, i.e., registering and absorbing some form of energy or signature emission by itself backfires on the observed atom and changes its properties.

The atoms behave as waves but when observed they behave as particles. It's not so much that their path is altered by the observation, when they pass through the slits unobserved and 1 at a time they behave like they are passing through both slits and causing interference.

Turtles.

All the way down.

[What's Burning?]

Who knew when Dylan penned Like A Rolling Stone the line "when you ain't got nothing, you got nothing to lose" would be so cosmically profound.

[stonemonkey]

LRW, I get similar weird thoughts to you but not quite the same. More than thoughts really because they're not just in my head, like thoughts, but are more a feeling that goes through me. And if I try to grasp it and think about it, it disappears. It's a bit scary and depressing when it comes.
Best way describe it is I get a sudden sense of what is everything about? Why am In this car driving along here? Why such a complex world of issues and problems and decisions when we just die? But it's powerful because its not just a thought....because if I think it, then it becomes a logical consideration and looses its power. When this thing comes its like , almost like looking at something on a completely different level to how you've viewed things before. It's a feeling that flutters around at the edge but won't let me get hold of it.
And like you said, nothing whatsoever to do with a search for religion.
Well LRW, I've probably topped you for wappy thoughts this evening But I do get the darkness and the sadness you feel .

We are all a small part of one thing called life, it started with the first self replicating molecule a few billion years ago. Each individual lives and dies and may appear insignificant on it's own but each plays it's part in the continuation of the whole of life.

I understand that , it's just that when I get this feeling, well it's just so hard to describe. It's a sort of unrealness

Well, to add to the unrealness just think, the atoms you're made of (except for the hydrogen) were forged through nuclear fusion in the hearts of stars.

[andrew]

Who knew when Dylan penned Like A Rolling Stone the line "when you ain't got nothing, you got nothing to lose" would be so cosmically profound.

Or how about the more contemporary "I know I believe in nothing but it's my nothing".