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[racechick]

Were you drinking when you made your list?

Non cogitabat ergo non erat

there you have it.

And Juan is special. Circumstances were against him or he'd have won loads and loads.

Michael- I put him way higher than i really wanted to, so i did recognise his talent, but the cheating, car superiority and lack a teammate who could challenge dragged him down past lewis. And i lurved it when Juan beat him...lots of times.

Fernando- Well lewis beat him when he was only a rookie, that kindov dropped him down the list. Also the help he requires to do everrything, but maybe I could slip him up to 6th possibly, if i ws feeling generous.

[vaptin]

Were you drinking when you made your list?

Non cogitabat ergo non erat

there you have it.

And Juan is special. Circumstances were against him or he'd have won loads and loads.

Michael- I put him way higher than i really wanted to, so i did recognise his talent, but the cheating, car superiority and lack a teammate who could challenge dragged him down past lewis. And i lurved it when Juan beat him...lots of times.

Fernando- Well lewis beat him when he was only a rookie, that kindov dropped him down the list. Also the help he requires to do everrything, but maybe I could slip him up to 6th possibly, if i ws feeling generous.

How did you figure putting Button and Vettel ahead of him?

[racechick]

Were you drinking when you made your list?

Non cogitabat ergo non erat

there you have it.

And Juan is special. Circumstances were against him or he'd have won loads and loads.

Michael- I put him way higher than i really wanted to, so i did recognise his talent, but the cheating, car superiority and lack a teammate who could challenge dragged him down past lewis. And i lurved it when Juan beat him...lots of times.

Fernando- Well lewis beat him when he was only a rookie, that kindov dropped him down the list. Also the help he requires to do everrything, but maybe I could slip him up to 6th possibly, if i ws feeling generous.

How did you figure putting Button and Vettel ahead of him?

Well, my thinking went like this......

Imagine Vettel and Alonso in the same team and who do you think would come out on top?? I figured it would be Vettel. Why? He's fast, probably faster than Alonso raw speed, he's not phased by other drivers. OK he still makes mistakes but so does fernando. Now Fernando is phased by other drivers and especially struggles with fast less experienced team mates.So I think Vettel would win. He'd get all the poles too.

Now Button is more tricky. I find him difficult to gauge because he's had crap cars, a superb dominant car and a super fast team mate. He's not phased, can be superb but...there are buts. It was a tricky decision. But if I had a fast driver in my team like hamilton or Vettel, Id wnt Button alongside him not Alonso. Ok that doesnt make him a worse driver than Button. So that must have just finally come down to my personal choice.

[vaptin]

Vettel's made more "unpressured mistakes" than Alonso I'd say, a lot of Alonso mistakes this year have been from pushing a car too hard because he wanted to get it higher than it should be.

Vettel's very fast, but Alonso's shown some great qualifying performances as well, often unnoticed as he hasn't been able to beat the redbull, just get very close to them. It's hard to say though, Vettel's been in a very fast redbull for qualifying at almost every race of the year.

I'd say Alonso can make strategies work better, handle tyres better, manages traffic better, is better at starts, overtaking, blocking, than Vettel.

Button? He just isn't fast enough, and he's good at strategy but it just won't be enough against Alonso, who is also good at strategy. He's been in poor cars, but has he ever shown much in them? Look at say, Kobayashi and Sutil sometimes as well, you can see where they've out performed the car.

[racechick]

Vettel's made more "unpressured mistakes" than Alonso I'd say, a lot of Alonso mistakes this year have been from pushing a car too hard because he wanted to get it higher than it should be.

Vettel's very fast, but Alonso's shown some great qualifying performances as well, often unnoticed as he hasn't been able to beat the redbull, just get very close to them. It's hard to say though, Vettel's been in a very fast redbull for qualifying at almost every race of the year.

I'd say Alonso can make strategies work better, handle tyres better, manages traffic better, is better at starts, overtaking, blocking, than Vettel.

Button? He just isn't fast enough, and he's good at strategy but it just won't be enough against Alonso, who is also good at strategy. He's been in poor cars, but has he ever shown much in them? Look at say, Kobayashi and Sutil sometimes as well, you can see where they've out performed the car.

Yes point taken with Button. I still keep waiting for the emphatic evidence that he will fulfill all his promise but....there's that but again.

Alonso is hugely more exerienced in F1 than Vettel and so he should be making less mistakes. Im not conivnced he made less this year.Yes Alonso's had to haul a not quite on it car up the grid. So have lots of other drivers. Racecraft? Probably Alonso yes, but again he's hugely more experienced, and he still looses the plot sometimes. Silverstone. When he thinks about Hamilton instead of his own race. I still think in the same team, same car and no team orders, Vettel would win.

[spankyham]

When you think about F1 over the next few years with the likes of Alonso, Vettel, Hamilton and a swag more, it is just so exciting. Hopefully they will have competitive cars.

In regards to Button, well, he has a F1 brain 2nd to none - he might not have the speed of the others, but, I can see him running a team for for 20 years and making decisive calls that could win and decide championships long after he stops driving. Assuming he wants to do that.

[Robert12010]

When you think about F1 over the next few years with the likes of Alonso, Vettel, Hamilton and a swag more, it is just so exciting. Hopefully they will have competitive cars.

In regards to Button, well, he has a F1 brain 2nd to none - he might not have the speed of the others, but, I can see him running a team for for 20 years and making decisive calls that could win and decide championships long after he stops driving. Assuming he wants to do that.

formula1 is in very safe hands with bernie (for how ever long he decides to go on for), plus you have the drivers mentioned above too,

[EvilGiraffe]

Were you drinking when you made your list?

Non cogitabat ergo non erat

there you have it.

And Juan is special. Circumstances were against him or he'd have won loads and loads.

Michael- I put him way higher than i really wanted to, so i did recognise his talent, but the cheating, car superiority and lack a teammate who could challenge dragged him down past lewis. And i lurved it when Juan beat him...lots of times.

Fernando- Well lewis beat him when he was only a rookie, that kindov dropped him down the list. Also the help he requires to do everrything, but maybe I could slip him up to 6th possibly, if i ws feeling generous.

How did you figure putting Button and Vettel ahead of him?

Well, my thinking went like this......

Imagine Vettel and Alonso in the same team and who do you think would come out on top?? I figured it would be Vettel. Why? He's fast, probably faster than Alonso raw speed, he's not phased by other drivers. OK he still makes mistakes but so does fernando. Now Fernando is phased by other drivers and especially struggles with fast less experienced team mates.So I think Vettel would win. He'd get all the poles too.

Would Vettel beat Alonso in equal cars? I don't know. That's a tough one. But even if I thought Vettel would win, I would still put Alonso slightly ahead of Vettel because the original request was to rank the drivers on the decade and not just the past season or two.
Also, how do you figure Alonso is phased by other drivers? Remember that drive in Imola when Michael was glued to him lap after lap and Freddy didn't put a wheel wrong. If you were going to crack under pressure, that was the time to do it.

[racechick]

Were you drinking when you made your list?

Non cogitabat ergo non erat

there you have it.

And Juan is special. Circumstances were against him or he'd have won loads and loads.

Michael- I put him way higher than i really wanted to, so i did recognise his talent, but the cheating, car superiority and lack a teammate who could challenge dragged him down past lewis. And i lurved it when Juan beat him...lots of times.

Fernando- Well lewis beat him when he was only a rookie, that kindov dropped him down the list. Also the help he requires to do everrything, but maybe I could slip him up to 6th possibly, if i ws feeling generous.

How did you figure putting Button and Vettel ahead of him?

Well, my thinking went like this......

Imagine Vettel and Alonso in the same team and who do you think would come out on top?? I figured it would be Vettel. Why? He's fast, probably faster than Alonso raw speed, he's not phased by other drivers. OK he still makes mistakes but so does fernando. Now Fernando is phased by other drivers and especially struggles with fast less experienced team mates.So I think Vettel would win. He'd get all the poles too.

Would Vettel beat Alonso in equal cars? I don't know. That's a tough one. But even if I thought Vettel would win, I would still put Alonso slightly ahead of Vettel because the original request was to rank the drivers on the decade and not just the past season or two.
Also, how do you figure Alonso is phased by other drivers? Remember that drive in Imola when Michael was glued to him lap after lap and Freddy didn't put a wheel wrong. If you were going to crack under pressure, that was the time to do it.

He cracks when his team mate is as fast or faster than him and his team won't help him out. Also if he hears anything about a a driver he 'has a thing about' he goes AWOL. Cant remember the Imola drive, which year? He's not always phased. But Vettel as a team mate would phase him.
I take your point about time spent doing well in this decade.

[Big Azza]

I thought this was about the best 10 drivers - not our favourite 10. I cannot fail to see why Schumi and Alonso wouldn't be top.

Alonso can drag crap cars to race wins, and Schumacher didn't cheat in this century. That was last century. And he was always duly punished for it. You mention a driver's ability to gather his team around him as a plus. Basically drivers who are better are able to do that. None of Alonso's team mates at Renault appeared to match the Spaniard.


Maybe I should revise my list then...

[texasmr2]

AMAZING !!!! Schumi tops the list so far and not Hamilton , common sense prevails once again .

[Big Azza]

I love Vettel and Hamilton more than anyone - but I can see facts rather than being clouded by emotion-fuelled speculation. Should Vettel win the title again next year, then he would deserve to be the third greatest or event the second greatest.

[Robert12010]

there is no doubt michael is the best driver of the 21 st century, plus i agree with race chick about alonso, who when gets beat by his team mate, decides to shake his fist at the pit wall, threat backmail against the team and a whole host of other things ! but apart from that he is a good driver

[racechick]

I thought this was about the best 10 drivers - not our favourite 10. I cannot fail to see why Schumi and Alonso wouldn't be top.

And how do we decide who is top? Is it to be decided by Big Azza's favourite drivers? How we judge drivers is not an exact science, cannot be. The question did not ask who had the most championships, who had the most wins;that is an exacting science and there would be no point asking people for their list. The fact that people are being asked means this is down to who individuals perceive as the best. How 'best' is determined will differ from individual to individual. Some will look soley at results,others at how the results were achieved others at racecraft , others at performance against team mate, others at style....the list goes on....

You may be right. When the results are colated Schumi and Alonso may well be at the top. But that still wont put them at the top in my eyes. If you voted purely on what you expected other people to put top, then yes, maybe you should change your vote.

[F1er]

Schumi
Lewis (because of head2head against Alonso)
Alonso
Kimi
Mika
Juan Pablo
Vettel
Jenson
Kubica
Rubens