FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[texasmr2]

McLaren was mentioned because somebody asked whether or not bud was only in favour of KERS because McLaren did a good job of it...

Yes Chris that was realized and that is the reason why so many threads go way O/T. I'm just trying my best to keep the thread from going astray that is all. No offense meant towards my friend bud either.

[scotty]

I like KERS. I think it's an interesting piece of technology. It's tricky and there's a lot that can be done with it. Although KERS isn't really that green at the moment, it does have potential and could lead into other developments. For Formula One to remain a technical challenge and be relevant to the automotive industry, KERS must stay.

Couldn't agree less, Hybrid Technology is already here and works well in a Prius. A battery KERS system is not anything new that'll save the the world. Flywheel KERS ditto the cars are still powered by Fossil fuels and none of these technologies add anything to the racing except for cost, unreliability, and safety issues. It'll cost each team 15 to 20 million a year to develop a technology that already exists. That money would do the environment and all man kind a lot more good if it went into a Hydrogen infrastructure. Or feeding the Hungry.

In an ideal world, yes, however the powers that be are basically politicians aren't they - KERS provides them with more overtaking in races as well as appeasing the 'green' groups - i reckon they just see it as killing two birds with one stone...

[Denthúl]

I like KERS. I think it's an interesting piece of technology. It's tricky and there's a lot that can be done with it. Although KERS isn't really that green at the moment, it does have potential and could lead into other developments. For Formula One to remain a technical challenge and be relevant to the automotive industry, KERS must stay.

Couldn't agree less, Hybrid Technology is already here and works well in a Prius. A battery KERS system is not anything new that'll save the the world. Flywheel KERS ditto the cars are still powered by Fossil fuels and none of these technologies add anything to the racing except for cost, unreliability, and safety issues. It'll cost each team 15 to 20 million a year to develop a technology that already exists. That money would do the environment and all man kind a lot more good if it went into a Hydrogen infrastructure. Or feeding the Hungry.

In an ideal world, yes, however the powers that be are basically politicians aren't they - KERS provides them with more overtaking in races as well as appeasing the 'green' groups - i reckon they just see it as killing two birds with one stone...

I think KERS (as well as the new regulations) is definitely increasing overtaking and I don't see how anyone can disagree. A guy on the BBC 606 posted a comparison. There were over 200 overtaking moves in the entirity of last season. In the first three races of this season, there have already been half as many.

[texasmr2]

We are all loving the amount of overtaking but I think the issue lies in all the extra cost, weight etc etc to the teams. I'm not against KERS yet I do think a more suitable solution such as the one csrracer suggested could have been implicated.

[scotty]

I like KERS. I think it's an interesting piece of technology. It's tricky and there's a lot that can be done with it. Although KERS isn't really that green at the moment, it does have potential and could lead into other developments. For Formula One to remain a technical challenge and be relevant to the automotive industry, KERS must stay.

Couldn't agree less, Hybrid Technology is already here and works well in a Prius. A battery KERS system is not anything new that'll save the the world. Flywheel KERS ditto the cars are still powered by Fossil fuels and none of these technologies add anything to the racing except for cost, unreliability, and safety issues. It'll cost each team 15 to 20 million a year to develop a technology that already exists. That money would do the environment and all man kind a lot more good if it went into a Hydrogen infrastructure. Or feeding the Hungry.

In an ideal world, yes, however the powers that be are basically politicians aren't they - KERS provides them with more overtaking in races as well as appeasing the 'green' groups - i reckon they just see it as killing two birds with one stone...

I think KERS (as well as the new regulations) is definitely increasing overtaking and I don't see how anyone can disagree. A guy on the BBC 606 posted a comparison. There were over 200 overtaking moves in the entirity of last season. In the first three races of this season, there have already been half as many.

Hell, we've seen more overtaking under the safety car than we did at Valencia!

[csrracer]

In an ideal world, yes, however the powers that be are basically politicians aren't they - KERS provides them with more overtaking in races as well as appeasing the 'green' groups - i reckon they just see it as killing two birds with one stone...

I think KERS (as well as the new regulations) is definitely increasing overtaking and I don't see how anyone can disagree. A guy on the BBC 606 posted a comparison. There were over 200 overtaking moves in the entirity of last season. In the first three races of this season, there have already been half as many.

Someone show me a statistic on how many of these passes were actually due to the KERS, until then I will continue to believe that it has everything to do with a smaller rear wing and slick tires. F1 went in the wrong direction with grooved tires they reduced mechanical grip and relied on downforce to go through the turns quicker. The overtaking cars although faster, would lose downforce in the wake of a slower car making it harder to pass. A large part of the cars wakes has been removed due to the new rear wing, this is why there's more passing, not because 1 Team has an operational KERS system. If F1 wants to go green they have many other options, example Transporters running on Biodiesel that'll look great in the press. Teams spending millions on KERS just makes F1 look bad in this financial environment.

[Jensonb]

I think KERS (as well as the new regulations) is definitely increasing overtaking and I don't see how anyone can disagree. A guy on the BBC 606 posted a comparison. There were over 200 overtaking moves in the entirity of last season. In the first three races of this season, there have already been half as many.

I think the increase in overtaking has far more to do with aerodynamic changes. Following cars is much easier now. Why am I so sure fo this? Most of the teams don't actually have KERS and none of them have had much problem cruising by.

KERS is a plaster (Band-Aid to you Yanks) on a problem which requires a bandage and surgery. F1 needs to go green, but KERS is so preposterously limited in its use and deployment as to be virtually pointless. The world is going Hydrogen fuel cell, so this technology ill never be of any use down the line. F1 needs to get back t being a leader in developing technology for the future.

[csrracer]

I think KERS (as well as the new regulations) is definitely increasing overtaking and I don't see how anyone can disagree. A guy on the BBC 606 posted a comparison. There were over 200 overtaking moves in the entirity of last season. In the first three races of this season, there have already been half as many.

I think the increase in overtaking has far more to do with aerodynamic changes. Following cars is much easier now. Why am I so sure fo this? Most of the teams don't actually have KERS and none of them have had much problem cruising by.

KERS is a plaster (Band-Aid to you Yanks) on a problem which requires a bandage and surgery. F1 needs to go green, but KERS is so preposterously limited in its use and deployment as to be virtually pointless. The world is going Hydrogen fuel cell, so this technology ill never be of any use down the line. F1 needs to get back t being a leader in developing technology for the future.

Exactly

[Gilles 27]

I know a little bit about this (my dad works for a company currently working on a KERS - type system), and KERS in NOT road relevant in the form it is being used in F1. Nor is it new, the technology was banned by the FIA in the 1990s before they realised they needed to make F1 look a little greener.

I'm sure that any reasonable person can see that firstly, F1 is never going to be environmentally friendly (most sports aren't!!!) and that in reality, the damage being done by F1 itself is minuscule. The problem with F1 is its image as being a wasteful, corporate, uncaring, greedy entity and this is what needs to change. Preventing the teams from using massive motor homes, hosting more races in Europe to save air travel, running the cars on a specification, low emission fuel etc. These things would all save costs to the teams and would make F1 less environmentally damaging. If these were the FIA's priorities, these measures would have come in long before KERS.

[bud]

i dont see why KERS and Fuel cells cant work in unison?

[csrracer]

i dont see why KERS and Fuel cells cant work in unison?

They do it's in a car called the Honda Clarity. Not very fast though.
I wonder how Kimi feels about the KERS system after having his manly parts a few millimeters away from a smoking KERS battery.

[bud]

i dont see why KERS and Fuel cells cant work in unison?

They do it's in a car called the Honda Clarity. Not very fast though.
I wonder how Kimi feels about the KERS system after having his manly parts a few millimeters away from a smoking KERS battery.

I know thats not the point i was trying to make, Jensonb and you noddingly suggest KERS is a waste of time and Hydrogen fuel cells are the future. but can you imagine the expense for the manufacturers if they had to go Hydrogen? can you imagine the hard core petrol heads outrage?
like im trying to point out this is a step in the right direction for F1 nothing more nothing less.

[cap-dude]

KERS = Bull
The message is sends out is as hollow as the FIA's heads.

Yeah, sure KERS creates some excitement right now, and some overtaking. But there's a reason for that. It's because only some teams are using it. Once all the cars use KERS, that'll be gone. There'll be no push to pass simply because when you hit the KERS boost, so does the guy in front. No one gains an advantage.

It's a stupid system that hopefully will be out the window by the end of this year. It's clear none of the teams like the system either. It's only causing more problems with reliability, which makes the racing worse. The less cars finishing the race, the less chance we have of some action.

[Frosty]

Firstly I like KERS because it's a good engineering challenge for the teams and that's partly what F1 is about but I think the FIA got it wrong about the amount of time per a lap you can use it I feel like 8-10 seconds would of made it far more worth while. Secondly I think that KERS is definitely helping the overtaking it is one thing for a driver to catch up with some but with all the cars at a very similar pace at the moment I feel that they need an extra boost get the past. I think most people would agree that KERS is effective coming onto the straights and making an overtaking manoeuvre I think the extra HP was clear to see on the straight in the overtaking on Sunday with both McLarens.

[Gilles 27]

Push to pass isn't such a bad idea imo as the cars find it so difficult to overtake but that could have been achieved at a fraction of the cost to the teams, without the safety issues and without the waste batteries and green hypocrisy that all come with KERS