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#109847
by track testing parts on their 09 car and understanding whats not working they are infact working on their 09 car. its pretty simple, if you look at it this way, whats good now is good for 2010 same regulations


But optimising the performance of the '09 car over this season and building up the knowledge and resources to optimise the performance of the '10 car are very different things. Particularly since the Ferrari car was built to a quite different interpretation of the regulations than the current official interpretation. That's the crucial thing. Even if the letter of the regulations hasn't changed, what Ferrari believes them to mean has changed. And from a practical car design point of view, that's as good as a change in regulations.

look i think people think Ferrari will do a Brawn and stop developing and concentrate on 2010. totally different situation, firstly Honda, by developing the 08 car further would get them no where in 09 as obviously it is a different set of rules. now if the rules didnt change do you think Honda would have stopped development on their 08 car?

Now we have a new set of rules and Ferrari is trying to come to terms with them but they are not going to just scrap what they have and start from scratch in 2010 thats just plain stupid! Thet are already working on a redesign of their rear end on the F60 now this will obviously play a role in the development of the 2010 car thus it will be an evolution.


Nobody has said that they are going to start completely from scratch. But fundamentally, their strategy for developing the car will be quite different if they are trying to do their most to win this year's championship from where they are now, compared to if they write this season off and concentrate on being strong in 2010. Because in the former situation they have to develop car technology which finds the best compromise between what is ideal and what can reasonably be added to the current car. While in the former they are not limited in the same way. As a simple example, if they've written off this year's championship, then they can take more risks with new developments than they could if they were after every point they can get. In terms of things that might break, things that might not turn out to be an advantage, or in exploring the too many grey areas the FIA left in the regulations. They can in-race test bits that might not deliver benefits until they've been developed for three or four races. While if they're going for it this season, they couldn't afford that. And, as they get more knowledge about what their 2010 car is going to be, they can test bits that might actually make the 2009 car slower, but will benefit the 2010 car.

What Ferrari are going to know, being a very experienced engineering organisation, is what their chances are going to be of winning the championship this year, and how different the 2009 and 2010 cars are going to be. And I would expect that Ferrari will make the decision about their strategy for this year taking these two factors into account. And I think it's quite plausible that within even just a few more races, that the balance could tip to where it is the best strategy to write this year off.

If we look at the original quote:

Ferrari boss Stefano Domenicali says the Italian team may switch its development focus onto the 2010 car as early as next month if its fortunes do not improve dramatically in the next few races.


This suggests that Stefano Domenicali, who will have a good idea of the various trade-offs, is already considering writing off this year. Which wouldn't happen if there was no benefit to doing so.
#109855
This could all be pie in the sky guys. By the time we get to the 2010 season, that little hobbit with glasses that needs to be sectioned will have re-written the FIA rules for next season. Hell in more cost cutting moves he could state that all cars will have to be electric next season, 100mph limiters, one set of tyres to last 2 races, and only tap water to be served in the garages to cut down on Kimi's Magnum's and cans of Coke
#109860
This could all be pie in the sky guys. By the time we get to the 2010 season, that little hobbit with glasses that needs to be sectioned will have re-written the FIA rules for next season. Hell in more cost cutting moves he could state that all cars will have to be electric next season, 100mph limiters, one set of tyres to last 2 races, and only tap water to be served in the garages to cut down on Kimi's Magnum's and cans of Coke

The can't change the 2010 technical regulations now without a unanimous agreement between the teams and the technical working group.
#109862
This could all be pie in the sky guys. By the time we get to the 2010 season, that little hobbit with glasses that needs to be sectioned will have re-written the FIA rules for next season. Hell in more cost cutting moves he could state that all cars will have to be electric next season, 100mph limiters, one set of tyres to last 2 races, and only tap water to be served in the garages to cut down on Kimi's Magnum's and cans of Coke


Entirely possible. Even if they can't change the letter of the rules, they only need to come up with weird "interpretations" and who knows what happens. After seeing what happened with Brawn, it would probably be worth some of the smaller teams taking some big risks in interpretation of the regulations in the hope they get passed as legal.
#109865
This could all be pie in the sky guys. By the time we get to the 2010 season, that little hobbit with glasses that needs to be sectioned will have re-written the FIA rules for next season. Hell in more cost cutting moves he could state that all cars will have to be electric next season, 100mph limiters, one set of tyres to last 2 races, and only tap water to be served in the garages to cut down on Kimi's Magnum's and cans of Coke

The can't change the 2010 technical regulations now without a unanimous agreement between the teams and the technical working group.


It was very tongue in cheek mate :rolleyes:
#109868
The can't change the 2010 technical regulations now without a unanimous agreement between the teams and the technical working group.


Who needs to change regulations when you can "intepret" them?

Even as a Ferrari fan, I have to admit that the "tyre ovens" of a few years ago which were allowed as "blankets" were taking the p***. Mercedes increasing power during the engine freeze, etc. It's not the teams' fault, while the FIA is making such "interpretations", teams have to search for these advantages or be left behind by the teams that do.
#109893
besides actual track testing is by far more beneficial than a wind tunnel or computer model for collecting data.

Certainly a lot can be done by computer. But I don't think that testing has become irrelevant. Otherwise you wouldn't have pundits such as Brundle saying how it was now not possible for top teams to "spend their way out of trouble" if they have a poor start to the season.

One of the reasons things have gone pear-shaped for McLaren this season is because they relied too much on their computers. They thought it would allow them to keep developing the MP4-23 and design the MP4-24 simultaneously. Although the computer is a big help, it goes to show that nothing beats having time on your side and doing things the old-fashioned way: testing your car around a track.
#109909
I keep hearing that the 2010 regs will be the same as 2009. Not so!
There is talk about the diffuser getting regulated, refueling getting banned, which means larger fuel tanks with all the ramifications - KERS will be tweaked as well, possibly doubling the output and/or availability.
#109911
If they do write off the year their money will be seriously depleted for next year as they will not get many constructors points, therefor not much tv money.. The road car business is set up exclusively to fund the race team so with the economic melt down and slow vehicle sales, combined with poor results that don't look like changing any time soon, Ferrari could be in the poo for the short to medium term.

They should probably get Alonso right now because we all know he can instantly bring .5 :wink:
#109912
If they do write off the year their money will be seriously depleted for next year as they will not get many constructors points, therefor not much tv money.. The road car business is set up exclusively to fund the race team so with the economic melt down and slow vehicle sales, combined with poor results that don't look like changing any time soon, Ferrari could be in the poo for the short to medium term.


Depends what their reserves nd sponsorship contracts are like. If they can significantly improve their 2010 results by partially sacrificing 2009, then they may do better financially over the two years than if they got mediocre results in both years.

Look at McLaren in 2007. Huge loss of money with fines and lost points, but they came back and came second the next year, with LH winning the drivers'.
#109915
besides actual track testing is by far more beneficial than a wind tunnel or computer model for collecting data.

Certainly a lot can be done by computer. But I don't think that testing has become irrelevant. Otherwise you wouldn't have pundits such as Brundle saying how it was now not possible for top teams to "spend their way out of trouble" if they have a poor start to the season.

One of the reasons things have gone pear-shaped for McLaren this season is because they relied too much on their computers. They thought it would allow them to keep developing the MP4-23 and design the MP4-24 simultaneously. Although the computer is a big help, it goes to show that nothing beats having time on your side and doing things the old-fashioned way: testing your car around a track.



funny thing.. Adrian Newey still pens the car by hand. He then give the drawings to the engineer and then they go into the computer.. I believe this is way more art then science.. The brain and our imagination are still better than computer IMO for 2009.. Ask Brawn, ask Newey.
#109921
funny thing.. Adrian Newey still pens the car by hand. He then give the drawings to the engineer and then they go into the computer.. I believe this is way more art then science.. The brain and our imagination are still better than computer IMO for 2009.. Ask Brawn, ask Newey.


Really? When Stewart F1 was created, they made a big thing about how their car design was a paperless process.
#109923
funny thing.. Adrian Newey still pens the car by hand. He then give the drawings to the engineer and then they go into the computer.. I believe this is way more art then science.. The brain and our imagination are still better than computer IMO for 2009.. Ask Brawn, ask Newey.


Really? When Stewart F1 was created, they made a big thing about how their car design was a paperless process.

Newey wasn't with Stewart F1 when it was created (if you're saying Newey was there when it started), he was still with Williams helping Damon take the title against Sir Frank's wishes (he wanted JV to win the title just to have the number 1 on his car, and Newey was leaving along with Hill).
#109924
funny thing.. Adrian Newey still pens the car by hand. He then give the drawings to the engineer and then they go into the computer.. I believe this is way more art then science.. The brain and our imagination are still better than computer IMO for 2009.. Ask Brawn, ask Newey.


Really? When Stewart F1 was created, they made a big thing about how their car design was a paperless process.


Yup, Newey is more of a hand-job man, doesn't even own a puter (according to SpeedTV).
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