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[deMuRe]

Really MF
I don't see any of the USUAL SUSPECTS blaming anyone but the team.

And more to the point the team and the drivers seem to agree.
Now compare this with how another team, drivers & fans's react and then come and see me mate.
Keep fishing mate you might convince yourself one day

No conspiracy's, No FIA bias, No Driver's unable to admit when they FU

On a couple of occasions when McLaren made a strategic decision, some people on this forum seriously suggested that Ron Dennis et al. were out of their depth and should resign. Ferrari have made their own chicken-ups throughout the ages, even a few major gaffes with Ross Brawn at the helm, but I don't hear too much criticisms, let alone calls for staff to resign!

Everybody admits to this and are asking questions. It's people like you and Hanwombat who are screwing up their eyes and deliberately ignoring the honesty and openness about Ferrari's dreadful performance this weekend because it doesn't fit your view of Ferrari "lambs". Perhaps it's because Ferrari fans and Ferrari itself have been revealed as more objective, even handed, and honest than fans of certain other teams. Feeling a bit shown up?

McLaren have admitted their mistakes in terms of strategy etc., but all the team gets is the same old rubbish about McLaren losing the plot, Ron Dennis being off his rocker etc.. Ferrari, however, make a similar apology, but the matter stops there: mistakes were made, the team will move on from them and they won't happen again. End of. Nobody has said that Luca Baldisseri has lost his mind.

When Ferrari make a mistake they come out and say they made a mistake, in plain English.

They don't run around spewing Ronspeak by first trying to cover up their mistake, then getting lots of signatures to swear they never made a mistake and finally releasing an apology to say they were lying all along.

There is a huge difference here, don't even get me started on team orders...

[McLaren Fan]

When Ferrari make a mistake they come out and say they made a mistake, in plain English.

They don't run around spewing Ronspeak by first trying to cover up their mistake, then getting lots of signatures to swear they never made a mistake and finally releasing an apology to say they were lying all along.

There is a huge difference here, don't even get me started on team orders...

That would be a good argument, if Ferrari did all of their mistakes etc., and that nobody at McLaren was aware of what Coughlan was doing, save for Jonathan Neale, who believed he had the matter sorted.

As for team orders, feel free to talk.

[Mikep99]

Really MF
I don't see any of the USUAL SUSPECTS blaming anyone but the team.

And more to the point the team and the drivers seem to agree.
Now compare this with how another team, drivers & fans's react and then come and see me mate.
Keep fishing mate you might convince yourself one day

No conspiracy's, No FIA bias, No Driver's unable to admit when they FU

On a couple of occasions when McLaren made a strategic decision, some people on this forum seriously suggested that Ron Dennis et al. were out of their depth and should resign. Ferrari have made their own chicken-ups throughout the ages, even a few major gaffes with Ross Brawn at the helm, but I don't hear too much criticisms, let alone calls for staff to resign!

Everybody admits to this and are asking questions. It's people like you and Hanwombat who are screwing up their eyes and deliberately ignoring the honesty and openness about Ferrari's dreadful performance this weekend because it doesn't fit your view of Ferrari "lambs". Perhaps it's because Ferrari fans and Ferrari itself have been revealed as more objective, even handed, and honest than fans of certain other teams. Feeling a bit shown up?

McLaren have admitted their mistakes in terms of strategy etc., but all the team gets is the same old rubbish about McLaren losing the plot, Ron Dennis being off his rocker etc.. Ferrari, however, make a similar apology, but the matter stops there: mistakes were made, the team will move on from them and they won't happen again. End of. Nobody has said that Luca Baldisseri has lost his mind.

You missed my point.
I am going on about the constant whining that the McLambs, the team & ONE driver go on about every-time they do make a mistake. It is never ever as simple as yes we made a mistake. It is always But, But , IF and then the Oh yeh we made a mistake comes out reluctantly in the end. But I am never convinced

Your righteous comments have been filed away as exhibit one.
I am sure I will get to use it in the near future

[deMuRe]

When Ferrari make a mistake they come out and say they made a mistake, in plain English.

They don't run around spewing Ronspeak by first trying to cover up their mistake, then getting lots of signatures to swear they never made a mistake and finally releasing an apology to say they were lying all along.

There is a huge difference here, don't even get me started on team orders...

That would be a good argument, if Ferrari did all of their mistakes etc., and that nobody at McLaren was aware of what Coughlan was doing, save for Jonathan Neale, who believed he had the matter sorted.

As for team orders, feel free to talk.

It's the way McLaren advertise everything is equal within their team and they have never used team orders...

[Rivelution]

When Ferrari make a mistake they come out and say they made a mistake, in plain English.

They don't run around spewing Ronspeak by first trying to cover up their mistake, then getting lots of signatures to swear they never made a mistake and finally releasing an apology to say they were lying all along.

There is a huge difference here, don't even get me started on team orders...

I actually agree.

[McLaren Fan]

Your righteous comments have been filed away as exhibit one.
I am sure I will get to use it in the near future

Shove them up your jacksie for all I care. I stand by what I said: McLaren are subjected to all kinds of verbal and written abuse when they get things wrong and say so. When Ferrari makes mistakes and admits the fact, nobody is worried: no hurling of total vitriol towards the team and no calls for staff members to stand down.

It's the way McLaren advertise everything is equal within their team and they have never used team orders...

Well, if you would like to provide me with some examples. Then we can talk further.

[deMuRe]

Your righteous comments have been filed away as exhibit one.
I am sure I will get to use it in the near future

Shove them up your jacksie for all I care. I stand by what I said: McLaren are subjected to all kinds of verbal and written abuse when they get things wrong and say so. When Ferrari makes mistakes and admits the fact, nobody is worried: no hurling of total vitriol towards the team and no calls for staff members to stand down.

It's the way McLaren advertise everything is equal within their team and they have never used team orders...

Well, if you would like to provide me with some examples. Then we can talk further.

We've said it all before and I can't be arsed repeating myself.

I realise it's the casual F1 viewer that makes up the largest percentage of F1's viewing audiences, so teams need to market themselves according to what they think is best for their image.

The 'No team orders' stance at McLaren is just taking the p!ss...

Anyway, I'm still upset about Webber spinning so maybe I'm just taking pot shots to make myself feel better

[McLaren Fan]

Sounds like you're showing the white flag.



My offer's always open.

[deMuRe]

Sounds like you're showing the white flag.

[img]http://www.worldpeace.no/filer/White-Flag-Small.jpg[img]

My offer's always open.

Nah I just know I'm right and listening to your responses wont make me change my mind...

[Mikep99]

Your righteous comments have been filed away as exhibit one.
I am sure I will get to use it in the near future

Shove them up your jacksie for all I care. I stand by what I said:

The true hurts doesnt it mate

[stonemonkey]

@mclaren fan, as another mclaren fan I don't think they can go for the constructors this year as the Ferrari package is too strong. The only thing they've got going is the drivers championship but at least they're past the point of deciding which driver to support for that which I reckon'll give them an advantage or at least a chance. No disrespect to Heikki as he's been pretty unlucky and as Ron says, his time will come but the best hope of anything for Mclaren this year will be to support Hamilton to the end now and while both Ferrari drivers stay in the running it's going to be difficult for them to make that decision.

[AMCpacer]

It was a rain race.. You know the races that honda or toyota can get on the podium.. I hate rain races and F-1 should give a 4 hr. window to start the race that they can look at to race that day.. find the best time if they could dodge the rain..

[stonemonkey]

That's so wrong, when they changed Hockenheim they said it was because the track no longer suited F1 cars!!! Well build the cars to handle that, and the same for variable weather conditions to test various skills from both drivers and car design as well as tactical decisions. If you don't like that go watch drag racing or something.

[texasmr2]

Ferrari boss calls for no more errors

By Steven English Monday, July 7th 2008, 17:01 GMT


Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has urged his team and drivers to stop making "stupid" mistakes if they are to stay in contention for the world championship this season.

The team chose to leave Kimi Raikkonen on the same set of intermediate tyres at his first pit stop and then left him out on the old tyres so long that he fell out of contention for victory at Silverstone yesterday.

Raikkonen and Felipe Massa also had several spins each in the race, although Raikkonen did recover to finish fourth, but di Montezemolo says they all need to learn from their mistakes.

"I hope we'll manage to win our eighth title in ten years," he was quoted as saying by Gazzetta dello Sport. "We will (manage it) if we don't carry on doing stupid things.

"Obviously I wasn't pleased with what I saw yesterday, but I hope it's a useful lesson. Knowing my men, I'm certain it is."

He also says Ferrari have missed out on too many good results so far this season and can't afford to throw away any more in the remaining races.

"We're at the half way point of the season and in the lead of the championship," he added. "But we've lost too many opportunities, so in the second half of the season we must not lose any more."

[Kiwi_Chris]

It was a rain race.. You know the races that honda or toyota can get on the podium.. I hate rain races and F-1 should give a 4 hr. window to start the race that they can look at to race that day.. find the best time if they could dodge the rain..

Just because dirvers in NASCAR and IRL are afraid of a little rain doesnt mean that F1 shouldnt run in the rain. Some of the most memorable races have been wet ones because it can throw the form book away and you can get drivers up in places where they wouldnt normaly be.
If you dont like wet races go watch oval racing