FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[What's Burning?]

We gotta move forward guys, cookin' just enjoy the advantage Mercedes seemingly has. I for one won't get too stoked about it... the memories of 2012 are still fresh in my mind but things are looking as good as they can.

Savor it, no defensiveness necessary.

[racechick]

jeez, 2012! They should have had both championships sewn up! Dont remind me about that one!! But there are a lot of negatives gone that were around in 2012, and some positives from then still around....plus some more positives added....so that's looking pretty positive

[What's Burning?]

Ugh, I remember it well. 2012 was the year a lot of McLaren fans were adamant that there was absolutely nothing wrong, nothing to see here, move along. Oh and Lewis is just a primadonna whiner that was soundly beaten by Button last year.

[Hammer278]

WB, I distinctly remember you saying Lewis is way better off at Mac when he was at the crossroads....and rc and myself were like GET OUT LEWIS GET OUT!

Just imagine the tragedy if he had stayed back. A highly depressing 2013 and a B grade team for 2014.

[racechick]

OMYGOD. I don't think I could gave taken another year of........THAT!

[What's Burning?]

In hindsight, I was still looking for the ideal, you know where they built a car to suit Lewis as opposed to one that would suit Button, and Lewis would just learn to drive. A McLaren where a driver finishing 9th that started 11th was celebrated more by the TP than his team mate starting 22nd and finishing 8th in the same race. But Lewis knew what he needed more than I did that's for sure.

Or do you think there was a hidden more profound reason?

[bud]

WB, I distinctly remember you saying Lewis is way better off at Mac when he was at the crossroads....and rc and myself were like GET OUT LEWIS GET OUT!

Just imagine the tragedy if he had stayed back. A highly depressing 2013 and a B grade team for 2014.

B grade team?

[What's Burning?]

WB, I distinctly remember you saying Lewis is way better off at Mac when he was at the crossroads....and rc and myself were like GET OUT LEWIS GET OUT!

Just imagine the tragedy if he had stayed back. A highly depressing 2013 and a B grade team for 2014.

B grade team?

Well C- grade performance from a A grade team.

[CookinFlat6]

I think the hard facts support the assertion that there are currently 2 grades in F1,

Manufacturers or exclusive works teams = A
Customers = B

Unless there is an alternative argument that says otherwise

[CookinFlat6]

The rules of the game appear to have changed, and at the moment it seems as if others have adapted better than Red Bull and Renault.
Chief among them look to be Mercedes, who are so far undoubtedly in the best shape of all the teams.
The car is generally running reliably and at a good pace - to say the least. One rival described Rosberg's fastest lap of the test on Saturday as "a (expletive) good time".
And Rosberg underlined the challenge facing Red Bull after the test when he said: "We learned a massive amount, and it's every lap - every lap you learn.
"We discovered a lot of reliability issues, which you only discover if you do a lot of laps and really push the car to the limit."
That does not necessarily mean Rosberg and team-mate Lewis Hamilton will be the dominant force come Melbourne next month, nor that they have the fastest car.

Fuel consumption under the new limit of 100kg per race has been added to the multitude of variables that already made it incredibly hard to extrapolate a genuine sense of relative performance from pre-season testing.
Nevertheless, any team that can complete two full race-distance simulations (and get not far off a third), do more laps than anyone else and set one-off lap times nearly two seconds quicker than any of their rivals, without trying that hard, has to be considered the favourite going into the season

[spankyham]

That's a good summary from Benson, I'd say Mercedes are a clear, outright favorite.

[Roth]

Just to get some sort of comparitive, is this how the Brawn was talked about after testing in '09?

[bud]

I think the hard facts support the assertion that there are currently 2 grades in F1,

Manufacturers or exclusive works teams = A
Customers = B

Unless there is an alternative argument that says otherwise

I think saying there's an A and B grade is suggesting there is two categories in F1 or it's like a premier league team to 1st division.

Being a works team isn't the be all and end all in F1, Redbull have proven that.

[Hammer278]

I think the hard facts support the assertion that there are currently 2 grades in F1,

Manufacturers or exclusive works teams = A
Customers = B

Unless there is an alternative argument that says otherwise

I think saying there's an A and B grade is suggesting there is two categories in F1 or it's like a premier league team to 1st division.

Being a works team isn't the be all and end all in F1, Redbull have proven that.

This is exactly what I meant by B grade. Mercedes will not be expecting their clients to outperform/outdevelop them, that would be a major embarrassment for both Mercedes and Ferrari if it were to happen.

Didn't mean to insult McLaren whatsoever (I finally have newfound respect since they the coup happened) but they are essentially a B grade team heading into 2014. From 2015 though they have a better deal since it's an exclusive one with Honda. But still not a purebred engine/chassis deal under 1 roof.

EDIT I misunderstood you. What you say about RB is true, they proved being a works team you can still be beaten but as repeated time and time again, we are now in the engine era more than the aero. The balance of power has shifted massively, and from now onward being the works team WILL BE a major advantage.

[bud]

Ferrari is the only "under one roof" team.

As long as F1 cars have wings and aren't looking like trucks. Aero will always be crucial.