FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[LRW]

But F1 isnt some lame American sport that very few people outside of the US care about - so to me your argument is irrelevant.

[CookinFlat6]

But F1 isnt some lame American sport that very few people outside of the US care about - so to me your argument is irrelevant.

Exactly, it's irrelevant to suggest that in some lame American sport, teams have a Ferrari style extra payout. Only in F1 does one team get paid an extra 80 mill from the top of all revenues win or lose.

[spankyham]

.... The Yankees receive approx. $39 million from MLB (varies from year to year, next year it is $65 million), ....... The $60 million they EARNED (they have their own TV network) and they have to give approx. 30% of that back to MLB to be shared by the other teams......

So you admit that in your example the team can sell TV rights exclusively and only 30% of what they sell goes into the pool to be shared.

Maybe Ferrari should try using their position in the sport to earn money...

This is a ridiculous statement. Ferrari is an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money.

Then F1 could give them a special deal like the Yankees and tax them 30% on their revenue to be shared among the poor teams

Ferrari would leap at the chance to sell TV rights and only have to hand over 30% and keep the rest.

Last year the Yankees paid over $100 million dollars to help the lesser teams in MLB. Ferrari did NOTHING, despite being "an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money". End of discussion.

Actually that is entirely incorrect. FOM receives all revenue from tv and circuits. Most viewers, and most fans at circuits are Tifosi. Of that "Ferrari" revenue all goes to the distribution pool - that's 70% more that you're example of the Yankees. If we went to the MLB example you are touting Ferrari would get 70% of their viewing fans revenue.



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[spankyham]

But F1 isnt some lame American sport that very few people outside of the US care about - so to me your argument is irrelevant.

Exactly, it's irrelevant to suggest that in some lame American sport, teams have a Ferrari style extra payout. Only in F1 does one team get paid an extra 80 mill from the top of all revenues win or lose.

So you prefer cricket to baseball? Don't they actually have a lot I'm common.



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[LRW]

But F1 isnt some lame American sport that very few people outside of the US care about - so to me your argument is irrelevant.

Exactly, it's irrelevant to suggest that in some lame American sport, teams have a Ferrari style extra payout. Only in F1 does one team get paid an extra 80 mill from the top of all revenues win or lose.

So you prefer cricket to baseball? Don't they actually have a lot I'm common.

Id say cricket is probably almost as dull as baseball. But for some reason quite a few countries love the thing.

[What's Burning?]

I'd rather be talking about Ferarri's engine than their veto. I know, as much as I hate it, until things change, (people in power die off) nothing's going to be altering that situation. Although a few more years of not being at the top of the game, and even the folks in Maranello will have a hard time justifying their favorite son status.

[Hammer278]

Luca De Mont's recent speech about a return to LeMans is a strong enough hint about what he expects in F1 for the next few years with turbo engines.

[LRW]

How many years we talking? I mean, its been a while since they actually won anything isnt it?

How long until they are classed as a Williams?*

*sorry Lemon

[CookinFlat6]

.... The Yankees receive approx. $39 million from MLB (varies from year to year, next year it is $65 million), ....... The $60 million they EARNED (they have their own TV network) and they have to give approx. 30% of that back to MLB to be shared by the other teams......

So you admit that in your example the team can sell TV rights exclusively and only 30% of what they sell goes into the pool to be shared.

Maybe Ferrari should try using their position in the sport to earn money...

This is a ridiculous statement. Ferrari is an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money.

Then F1 could give them a special deal like the Yankees and tax them 30% on their revenue to be shared among the poor teams

Ferrari would leap at the chance to sell TV rights and only have to hand over 30% and keep the rest.

Last year the Yankees paid over $100 million dollars to help the lesser teams in MLB. Ferrari did NOTHING, despite being "an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money". End of discussion.

Actually that is entirely incorrect. FOM receives all revenue from tv and circuits. Most viewers, and most fans at circuits are Tifosi. Of that "Ferrari" revenue all goes to the distribution pool - that's 70% more that you're example of the Yankees. If we went to the MLB example you are touting Ferrari would get 70% of their viewing fans revenue.



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now I have really heard it all. Foms revenue from circuits and tv is 70% due to the tifosi? The tifosi contribute 70% to all revenues globally? So that's why Ferrari should get the extra guaranteed revenue win or lose?
And presumably why they should get extra help to allow them to beat the others?

Wow, just wow!

[spankyham]

.... The Yankees receive approx. $39 million from MLB (varies from year to year, next year it is $65 million), ....... The $60 million they EARNED (they have their own TV network) and they have to give approx. 30% of that back to MLB to be shared by the other teams......

So you admit that in your example the team can sell TV rights exclusively and only 30% of what they sell goes into the pool to be shared.

Maybe Ferrari should try using their position in the sport to earn money...

This is a ridiculous statement. Ferrari is an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money.

Then F1 could give them a special deal like the Yankees and tax them 30% on their revenue to be shared among the poor teams

Ferrari would leap at the chance to sell TV rights and only have to hand over 30% and keep the rest.

Last year the Yankees paid over $100 million dollars to help the lesser teams in MLB. Ferrari did NOTHING, despite being "an enormously successful organization making bucket-loads of money". End of discussion.

Actually that is entirely incorrect. FOM receives all revenue from tv and circuits. Most viewers, and most fans at circuits are Tifosi. Of that "Ferrari" revenue all goes to the distribution pool - that's 70% more that you're example of the Yankees. If we went to the MLB example you are touting Ferrari would get 70% of their viewing fans revenue.



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now I have really heard it all. Foms revenue from circuits and tv is 70% due to the tifosi? The tifosi contribute 70% to all revenues globally? So that's why Ferrari should get the extra guaranteed revenue win or lose?
And presumably why they should get extra help to allow them to beat the others?

Wow, just wow!

Perhaps it was your anxiety to deal out a few more of your "backhanders" to the Tifosi.

Perhaps I just used too many big words

Either way you completely misread my post.

What I said was, whatever the amount that Ferrari fans contribute to FOM, in F1, it all goes into F1 revenue. Under the MBL model, the team can keep 70% of their viewing fans revenue. Meaning FOM does far better from Ferrari fans watching F1 than the MBL gets from the Yankees fans.


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[spankyham]

Luca De Mont's recent speech about a return to LeMans is a strong enough hint about what he expects in F1 for the next few years with turbo engines.

There are so many Tifosi who are hoping that we do return to LMP1. Having done so well with the 458 in the GT classes, there may be a real chance of this happening.

Plus, with no caps and far less prescriptive rules LM is looking more like the premier racing competition. The V6 turbo can be developed for both f1 and LMP1.

Nothing is forever.


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[What's Burning?]

A-hem.... you do know that Porsche is in the game now.

[spankyham]

A-hem.... you do know that Porsche is in the game now.

That just makes it more attractive. Seeing those two going head to head along with the Audi's - awesome.

And none of this pu55y one and a half hours of racing



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[CookinFlat6]

What I said was, whatever the amount that Ferrari fans contribute to FOM, in F1, it all goes into F1 revenue. Under the MBL model, the team can keep 70% of their viewing fans revenue. Meaning FOM does far better from Ferrari fans watching F1 than the MBL gets from the Yankees fans.


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FOM does far better from all fans watching F1. It takes 100% of the revenue and then pays out about 50% to the teams. If we assume that fans are attracted to F1 by 10 teams competing then each team would be better off on the MLB model, if they each kept 70% and gave 30%.
Therefore any argument that Ferrari are victims of some unique largesse is based on Ferrari having a disproportional amount of the total revenue from all 10 teams. So the only way Ferrari are uniquely better off under the MLB model is if their fans generated a much larger percentage of the total than the average. meaning most fans are there just to watch Ferrari and would pay the same if Ferrari were the only team on the track

Do the Yankees get extra help to beat their competitors? vetos? International assistance?

[CookinFlat6]

Luca De Mont's recent speech about a return to LeMans is a strong enough hint about what he expects in F1 for the next few years with turbo engines.

I cant see Ferrari going into LMP unless they have a chance of winning. It would not look good to be seen to be struggling in 2 top line series at the same time

And against Porsche and Audi they will struggle. And if Toyota start raising their budget as a response then Ferrari will be likely 4th