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[onelapdown]

Actually I think Hamilton is pretty lucky not to have been penalised because first with the Toyota and then with Webber he really did stretch the regulations beyond breaking point, and even though I love the guy, I really wasn't impressed with that. I hope he doesn't make a habit of it.

[Denthúl]

Actually I think Hamilton is pretty lucky not to have been penalised because first with the Toyota and then with Webber he really did stretch the regulations beyond breaking point, and even though I love the guy, I really wasn't impressed with that. I hope he doesn't make a habit of it.

I felt that with Glock it was something that you could say was down to spray, but with Webber it was very harsh, especially since Mark had the racing line. I'm surprised there wasn't any damage reported by Webber, because they did make contact and after that he didn't seem able to get close to Lewis, though he was certainly getting close enough to overtake him.

[bud]

Actually I think Hamilton is pretty lucky not to have been penalised because first with the Toyota and then with Webber he really did stretch the regulations beyond breaking point, and even though I love the guy, I really wasn't impressed with that. I hope he doesn't make a habit of it.

with the Toyota it wasnt too bad, with Webber he was being overly defensive! but i think within the rules! he wasnt squiggly under braking!!

[onelapdown]

I fail to see how shoving a car onto wet grass at that speed can be described as "not too bad". I don't think Hamilton knew he was there but it was not his finest moment.

[bud]

I fail to see how shoving a car onto wet grass at that speed can be described as "not too bad". I don't think Hamilton knew he was there but it was not his finest moment.

Youre talking about the Glock incident right? well right there and then being on a corner Hamilons eye sight would have been firmly planted on where he was going not on his mirrors! its easy to judge from your lounge sweet but from a driver perspective the Glock incident was just a racing one!
Webber one was a bit iffy!! but as i said he defend on the edge of fairness as he only slightly moved under braking! we see that every race but it seems its in fashion to pick on Hamiltons moves

[cetin]

First of all congratulations to Vettel for his big win.

I wonder when would the stewards would declare the penalties of 2 Ferraris both cutting the chicane and taking over at Monza. Probably they won't even 'see' the cuts. Massa did it more than once.

Massa cut the chicane twice and gave back the position twice, before waiting to attack. By the rules as the FIA have clarified. When he cut the chicane in front of the other guy, he came down the straight with what was actually a smaller gap to the guy behind than when he went in to it. I would not call that gaining an advantage.

I agree, Massa did everything by the rules. I even thought one of those was a legitimate move, when it was not so clear if he cut the chicane, but he still gave back his place later in that lap. Maybe he was being cautious and did it to make sure he did not get a penalty.

I don't agree. He cut the chicane twice but gave back only once. I don't have the power to find the recordings and publish but I believe stewards do.

I still have hope for justice (even if it doesn't come from FIA).

[McLaren Fan]

From what I saw of the Massa incident, there was nothing that merited a penalty. The only way you can get good times around Monza is to take as much of the kerbs and run-off areas as you legally can. That's exactly what Massa was doing. If he got a penalty, I probably couldn't help but have a wry grin to myself, seeing it as some kind of revenge after what happened to Hamilton last week, but two wrongs don't make a right.

[bud]

yeah i didnt see anything different in terms of taking the curbs at Monza if it wasnt for last race we wouldnt have even cared about it!

again its funny its taken 100 years for FIA to clarify the rules once cutting a chicane giving back position and overtaking before the next turn

[cetin]

"there was nothing that merited a penalty" just as there was nothing that merited a penalty last week on Hamilton's take over. Maybe I should only watch Nascar for my sanity.

[Denthúl]

First of all congratulations to Vettel for his big win.

I wonder when would the stewards would declare the penalties of 2 Ferraris both cutting the chicane and taking over at Monza. Probably they won't even 'see' the cuts. Massa did it more than once.

Massa cut the chicane twice and gave back the position twice, before waiting to attack. By the rules as the FIA have clarified. When he cut the chicane in front of the other guy, he came down the straight with what was actually a smaller gap to the guy behind than when he went in to it. I would not call that gaining an advantage.

I agree, Massa did everything by the rules. I even thought one of those was a legitimate move, when it was not so clear if he cut the chicane, but he still gave back his place later in that lap. Maybe he was being cautious and did it to make sure he did not get a penalty.

I don't agree. He cut the chicane twice but gave back only once. I don't have the power to find the recordings and publish but I believe stewards do.

I still have hope for justice (even if it doesn't come from FIA).

I only saw him cut the chicane once for position and he gave that back. At all other times, it was merely running over the kerbs, like every other driver who dared take the risk of lighting up their rear wheels and spinning off.

[FerrariFan63]

I must point out that I do not feel the penalty applied to LH last race was justified.

But one thing we can be certain of. The claims that this new rule would kill racing were certainly proved wrong. Huge numbers of very aggressive passes and attempted passes at that race. Even Kimi started passing people near the end of the race.

[vanja]

I also agree that Massa cut the chicane twice but gave back only once, so according to that he must be punished, at least the same as Hamilton on the last race.
Maybe someone has recorded the moment of cutting the chicane, so we can analyzed it??

[Matkins]

First of all congratulations to Vettel for his big win.

I wonder when would the stewards would declare the penalties of 2 Ferraris both cutting the chicane and taking over at Monza. Probably they won't even 'see' the cuts. Massa did it more than once.

Massa cut the chicane twice and gave back the position twice, before waiting to attack. By the rules as the FIA have clarified. When he cut the chicane in front of the other guy, he came down the straight with what was actually a smaller gap to the guy behind than when he went in to it. I would not call that gaining an advantage.

I agree, Massa did everything by the rules. I even thought one of those was a legitimate move, when it was not so clear if he cut the chicane, but he still gave back his place later in that lap. Maybe he was being cautious and did it to make sure he did not get a penalty.

More likely Ferrari radioed him.

According to the ITV team (I think Ted mentioned it) the FIA told Ferrari to tell Massa to give the position back.

Yeah this bothers me quite a bit actually, talk about inconsistency. If they had radioed McLaren to say Hamilton should give the place back to Raikkonen at Spa (for the second time after La Source) then he would have done this and probably gone on to win and taken 10 points. But instead they didn't say anything, until a couple of hours after the race... I hope McLaren's lawyer was taking notes during the Monza GP.

[McLaren Fan]

First of all congratulations to Vettel for his big win.

I wonder when would the stewards would declare the penalties of 2 Ferraris both cutting the chicane and taking over at Monza. Probably they won't even 'see' the cuts. Massa did it more than once.

Massa cut the chicane twice and gave back the position twice, before waiting to attack. By the rules as the FIA have clarified. When he cut the chicane in front of the other guy, he came down the straight with what was actually a smaller gap to the guy behind than when he went in to it. I would not call that gaining an advantage.

I agree, Massa did everything by the rules. I even thought one of those was a legitimate move, when it was not so clear if he cut the chicane, but he still gave back his place later in that lap. Maybe he was being cautious and did it to make sure he did not get a penalty.

More likely Ferrari radioed him.

According to the ITV team (I think Ted mentioned it) the FIA told Ferrari to tell Massa to give the position back.

Yeah this bothers me quite a bit actually, talk about inconsistency. If they had radioed McLaren to say Hamilton should give the place back to Raikkonen at Spa (for the second time after La Source) then he would have done this and probably gone on to win and taken 10 points. But instead they didn't say anything, until a couple of hours after the race... I hope McLaren's lawyer was taking notes during the Monza GP.

I agree, again. That said, as much as the case is stacked up in McLaren's favour, the FIA aren't famous for losing appeals and, by all counts, not too many people think Hamilton will get anything from the appeal either.

[racechick]

Well no, not those with a vested interest. But all the ones asked without a vested interest say it was an unfair penalty (Brundle, Lauda, Stewart amongst them)